45acp reload problem

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Digby49

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Working up a load of 45 with a 230grain lead
bullet with 5.5 grains of unique powder my problem is that every 3rd or 4th shot I get a failure to feed I have checked the dimensions of the round and it's spot on which leads me to think that the recoil spring is weak the gun is a Chief Special from the 80s.
Any one able to shed light on this would be most appreciated. Trevor
 

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Your load is a textbook formula. I load mine considerably lower. Thus, it would make more sense that your spring was to tight, not too weak.

My 85 year old dad had the same problem, while the gun shot fine when I used it. My wife had a similar problem until I coached her a bit.

I would look at your shooting technique before you change the load or gun parts. Sounds like it could be a case of "limp wristing". My Dad couldn't overcome it, but my wife was able to shoot the gun just fine after she used a more firm grip.

OTOH, what is a 45 Chief Special. I thought that was a 38 spl. revolver.
 
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Bent Rims??

In my long and error prone reloading career I found .45 ACP the most failure prone reload because of bent rims. The case head is relatively large in diameter making it easier to bend when stepped on, man-handled, squashed, or otherwise abused. Bent rim .45 ACP cases usually cull themselves out of the hull by being difficult to slip in a shell holder. I've had a few that slipped in easily but became jammed and wouldn't rotate or pull out without "assistance". Cases with bent rims are more feed error prone, especially in compact autos like your Chief's Special. Everyone focuses on the feed ramp, but every case has to scoot up the breech face and under the extractor. Bent cases don't do so well.

Just one of many feed possibilties.
 
If your C.O.L. is correct for the bullet you are using and the crimp is proper then the problem is not the round or recoil spring, but most likely the magazine - try replacing the magazine or loading it shorter. My opinion, I've been loading .45 ACP for over 20 years with Unique powder and I have not had the problem(s) unless it's been a week magazine.
Hope that helps...you have a nice Smith and should function well as it is designed.
Al Marin
 
While in my guns,5.5gr Unique under a 230 gr lead bullet is on the light side(lead=less friction than jacketed bullet=less pressure),it still is in the working range of the standard spring force of the gun(has the recoil spring been changed?).You mentionned that the spring seems weak.I'd try 3/10 of a gr more and check what happens.It might improve things or they might degrade.From there,you will have a clue as for the spring force.
If it jams more often,it will also seem to kick more when it'll shoot=weak spring;if the feeding improves,then the pressure with the actual load is too low.If nothing changes,look for some other problem that is not spring related.
Qc
 
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Digby49, there could be several causes for this happening. I'm thinking cartridge assembly.

Is this a new problem?

Do you usually load (these) lead bullets?

Are the bullets seated cleanly with no lead shavings around the case mouth?

Do they have a consistent & proper taper crimp?

Do they pass the plunk test in that barrel?

.
 
Diagnosing based on the term "failure to feed" is difficult at best. All manner of things can induce feeding issues.

First check this:

fredj338 said:
Check your OAL. It looks like the gun is not in battery, tells me maybe the round is too long.? Many try to load by lyman data & misread the oal of 1.269", but that is apsaami max, not what works in every gun.
Click to expand...

If the gun only does that when one of these cartridges is loaded, STOP. There are a couple dangerous situations going on.

If the gun is like that all the time...go suss it out with the guys in S&W Semi-Autos. Something's majorly wrong. The guide rod should be flush with the slide, and the rear of the slide should be at least close to level with the rear of the frame.

RE: the load.

According to Lyman's 50th, 5.5 gr of Unique is their starting load for a lead 225-gr, with a listed velocity of 695 fps. That's sort of borderline. I would expect that load and equivalent (~4.0 of Bullseye) to function in my 1911, for instance, but that simply wouldn't work in a stock-spring'd G30. Actually, it would fail to cycle about 30% of the time.

I'd consider the 750 fps to be velocity to shoot for with the 230-grain LRN in .45 ACP for general reliability. Another .3-.5 grains should do the trick, if the charge weight is the issue. If it doesn't, I would look elsewhere. I hesitate to say exactly what because I'm not there to see how exactly it's failing to cycle.

Generally-speaking, I've found that small autos are less tolerant of light loads than full-size pistols. I'm also hesitant to start playing with springs because small, light guns have heavy recoil springs for a reason: to prevent the slide from battering and cracking the frame to death.
 
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Well this gives me at least a few avenues to explore when I get a failure to feed some times you can push the slide and it will go in and other times it's solid and won't move just as a bit of background history the gun and caliber are new to me according to the load data that came with the dies 5.8 grains is max
I'm hoping to use this pistol as my ccw if I can get it to function reliably.
 
We need more info to give a long distance diagnosis. You've had 100% success with factory ammo? Your reloads pass the plunk test? The first pics suggest the round has started into the chamber, so take the offending round out and closely inspect it, looking for scratches where it jammed. Measure the offending round; diameter in a few places and bullet diameter. Check to make sure all flare has been removed. Double check OAL.
 
If the slide will not go home, into full battery lockup.........
the round is not set at the correct spec's.

Either the brass or the bullet need to be fixed.....
a mag will not keep a slide from going home but it might have a
feeding problem with a lead bullet with a OAL problem or rough ramp.

Have you tried any jacket bullets to see if there are problems.
It might be a spring that is damaged or weak, with not enough energy
to pick up a new load chamber it but I will put my big money on a bad round.

The slide is lubed, right?

Good luck.
 
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Take the barrel out and do a plunk test with the round that you are having trouble with. Or even easier buy a lyman cartidge checker. I use one for all the auto calibers I load for.
 
Do a plunk test first before changing any parts. 45 acp is not a thick walled case, and develop bulges that are not removed by most dies. The round should plunk both forward, and backward in the chamber. You can also buy a case gauge, they are not expensive.
 
Wow so much information thank you all I will report back with my findings Digby49
 
Please disregard my original comments. At first you said it was a failure to feed. Now that you have added pics that's not your problem. Its a failure to go into battery.

Your ammo is not loaded correctly. Case length, crimp, shavings around the case mouth, etc.
 
Groo here
Your gun has a short /light slide.
I believe that the timing [slide speed is off] increase or decrease load.
OR load 5.0 gr Bullseye with a 230 gr bullet[WW2 spec]
If this does not work look at other factors.
 
fredj338 said:
Check your OAL. It looks like the gun is not in battery, tells me maybe the round is too long.? Many try to load by lyman data & misread the oal of 1.269", but that is apsaami max, not what works in every gun.
Click to expand...

That's what I thought when I read the OP. In your OP you said, "I have checked the dimensions of the round and it's spot on." That gives me the impression you think the OAL listed in the data is what will work in your gun, that's not always so. You need to check the ammo in your barrel, the "plunk" test. Only then will the ammo be spot on.
 
I had a problem with some 9mm reloads that would not fully chamber in my Browning Hi Power with bar-sto barrel. I use a Lee factory crimp die and learned that I need to use the plunk test to set up the die.
George
 
your oal is long to me. First do the plunk test. I pull the barrel and keep it handy when i seat bullets and crimp. When i loading cast bullets i seat bullets and crimp in two separate steps. If your loads won't pass the plunk test try seating your bullets a little deeper. I shoot three different 1911's and they a run good with a oal of 1.245. These are 200 grain wadcutters.
 
Acp is a taper crimp I would say your don't have the seating die adjusted right. Set to the correct COL should feed It's your ammo not the gun or spring. Check all your ammo and make sure you have a nice taper crimp. I would bet a box of ammo factory shoots just fine.
 
No offence intended, but for a peg (cartridge) to enter a hole (chamber) it must be smaller than the hole. If your ammo is "spot on" and your gun shoots factory ammo fine, you handloads should chamber. Try the plunk test...
 
Cases that have been fired in guns with unsupported chambers like Glocks may be buluged near the base and not fitting in the chamber of the 3rd generation S&W.

Even the Lee Bulge Buster Kit will not fix this if cases were fired in such a gun previously.

As suggested already a case gauge should be used to weed out bad cases
 
Shockbottle Case Gauges - Dawson Precision, Inc.
Bulge Busters LOL I had a snake one time that had bulge, but it went away after awhile
Once the case web is screwed up That's it
I would never buy or use range brass
Trying to run +P pressures in unsupported chambers
Priceless
The only thing that separates the user from high pressure gases
Is that little brass tin can
Treat it gently and it will serve you well
 
I run all my .45 ACP through a Lee final sizing die after loading. It irons out the bulge in the case and makes sure they will chamber without issues.
 
I test fired my first .45 ACP reloaded rounds today for function. Worked like a charm. They were 230 grain FMJ bullets, mixed hulls and I plunked tested them 100% after reloading. I only fired 15 rounds, I needed about 200. :-)

Have a blessed day,

Leon
 
FWIW I had the exact same problem with a second-hand ATI 1911 CS (Compact Slide - a.k.a. Officer's model)I bought at auction.

The recoil spring was weak and slightly kinked. It wouldn't reliably return to battery on its own, but MOST (not all) of the time I could push it forward that last 3/16" with my thumb and it would fire again. Sometimes it would fail to go into battery again on the next shot, sometimes it would fire the next few rounds before doing it again. Once or twice when it failed to go into battery I couldn't push it the rest of the way forward with my thumb and had to re-rack the slide to chamber the next round.

I got a new replacement recoil ring, installed it, and problem solved. That may or may not work for you, but it did for me. YMMV.
 
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