A deadly mistake!

[Deceasedeye]

No round in the chamber can get you killed! It takes both hands to rack a slide. What if you need one hand for something else (there is a myriad of reasons possible) you might even be shot in one arm. This is a mistake made by hundreds if not thousands every day. Don't make this mistake!

 

[delcrossv]

Thousands every day.
??? Okayyyyy......

 

[Rocket3]

Much safer......................................for the other guy

 

[Jdavis]

I agree completely. If a person feels insecure carrying with a round in the chamber, get a gun with an external safety. 1911s are normally carried with the safety engaged. Train with the safety engaged and it will become second nature to you to thumb the safety off as you draw your weapon.

 

[Rpg]

Some very skilled individuals trained by the IDF (Israeli Defense Force) carry handguns with an empty chamber.

The problem for everyone else carrying that way is that they, almost by definition, don't have the skill necessary to effectively employ a gun carried with an empty chamber for self defense.

 

[Pisgah]

I agree that you should always carry with a loaded chamber. But if you believe it takes two hands to rack a slide, you need further training. Almost the first thing I try to figure out when I get a new auto-pistol is how to rack the slide with one hand. It's sometimes difficult to figure out, but there's always a way, and if you're going to carry it, you need to know how -- just in case.

 

[ISCS Yoda]

Thousands every day.
??? Okayyyyy......

Actually, yes, thousands every day. I can't get my own girl friend to carry her pistol with a round in the chamber but we have more training to do. She'll get there eventually.

If you think these new gun buyers out there buying pistols by the boatload, never mind ARs, many of whom are untrained, don't slap their magazines into their pistols and refuse to rack the slide, then you have not met Mr. and Mrs. Average New Shooter American. It's as common a practice as one can imagine.

Some very skilled individuals trained by the IDF (Israeli Defense Force) carry handguns with an empty chamber.

Yes, that's true - but the operative term there is "very skilled". The IDF adopted that carry method back long ago when they had a huge assortment of differing pistols imported from everywhere and they needed one method of training. IDF personnel, and veterans, can draw and rack and commence shooting a pistol in the literal blink of an eye. As you so aptly put it but I shall paraphrase, Mr. and Mrs. Average New Shooter American don't have that skill.

Actually, I'd wager that a lot of S&W Forum members can do it fairly easily. Maybe not at the speed of a trained Soldier but fast enough for most purposes. But the folks around this campfire are definitely very experienced if not very skilled.

And then there's this:

But if you believe it takes two hands to rack a slide, you need further training. Almost the first thing I try to figure out when I get a new auto-pistol is how to rack the slide with one hand. It's sometimes difficult to figure out, but there's always a way, and if you're going to carry it, you need to know how -- just in case.

That's good for you. That's good for me. That's not good for Mr. and Mrs. Average New Shooter American who often used to dislike handguns, or fear then, or even hate them. But even omitting the "anti" issue these folks are not training the way "gun people" train, they just want a gun to protect hearth and home in troubled times. Some will train, some will become real gun people, and some will forever carry their pistols without a round in the chamber.

It jus' beez dat weigh..........

Side note: The first thing I do with a new pistol is determine how to decock it. If it has a decocker it's easy; if it doesn't then I practice gently lowering the hammer. Because I never carry a pistol except with a round in the chamber. Period.

 

[Oracle]

I know a couple of people who carry their guns "condition one" with an appendix holster.

What could possibly go wrong?

 

[mikerjf]

In some poll or report of the last couple years, it was noted that in a majority of defensive uses the gun was not on the person... it was in a drawer, in the safe, in the next room, etc. I remember thinking that whether a round was chambered was almost irrelevant in that scenario.

 

[Borderboss]

No matter how many hands it takes you to rack a slide, the problem is the time it takes you to rack a slide. You'll be lucky to not have been shot by the time you're in the fight.

What if you're in a store that's being robbed, and you get a chance to launch a "counter ambush" because the bad guy has lost focus. This happens a lot. Now your counter ambush is thwarted because you have to spend a second or two racking the slide before you're even ready to go.

This will sound harsh, but I mean it. If you're not confident enough with a gun to carry it with a loaded chamber, stop carrying a gun. You're just going to get yourself hurt, or worse.

 

[AJ]

Condition One carry is the way I was taught while a member of a Fleet Anti-Terrorist Security Team way back in the late 1980's. That said we where also trained how to chamber a round one handed. We were shown three different ways to load a round one handed and had to practice each of them in training.

 

[VaTom]

Get a double action revolver - problem solved.

 

[Deceasedeye]

I agree that you should always carry with a loaded chamber. But if you believe it takes two hands to rack a slide, you need further training. Almost the first thing I try to figure out when I get a new auto-pistol is how to rack the slide with one hand. It's sometimes difficult to figure out, but there's always a way, and if you're going to carry it, you need to know how -- just in case.

I have seen a one armed trapeze artist but only one and he's gone. I don't think you'll have many training on the one handed rack it's much easier to keep one in the chamber.

 

[ContinentalOp]

I have seen a one armed trapeze artist but only one and he's gone. I don't think you'll have many training on the one handed rack it's much easier to keep one in the chamber.

It's still a useful skill to have. It's not inconceivable to have an injured arm or hand. Worst case scenario, as unlikely as it is, could be an injured hand and a failure to fire. Better to work out ahead of time how to clear that malfunction one-handed. I even practice one-handed reloads with my snubby revolvers. It's not part of my regular practice routine, but I do practice it from time to time.

 

[delcrossv]

Get a double action revolver - problem solved.

Or a semi with a decocker.

 

[bigben55]

Ive trained and trained to the point where its muscle memory to pull my G43x from my IWB where as I'm presenting the gun forward with my right hand, I rack it with my left hand before the gun is in firing position, and fire 2 rounds. Ive had people time me, im less than 1/2 slower unracked vs racked.

Now yes, i usually/almost always carry with a round in the chamber, and yes i know that 1/2 a second can mean life or death, and yes I understand that if I had to draw and fire one handed I'm screwed, but this little drill is a good one. There are times where I dont want a round chambered. Bowhunting(climbing trees), backpacking in non bear country, among others.

 

[Sistema1927]

A decent holster, a decent holster, a decent holster.

Many people don't carry in Condition One because they are afraid of an ND. A decent holster is the solution. I have carried both a Kahr PM9 and now a Sig P365 in Condition One pretty much every day for more than 15 years, but always in a decent holster.

 

[epj]

Get a double action revolver - problem solved.

This solves a lot of problems. Fewer rounds, maybe more powerful ammo, maybe not. No fail to feed, no fail to eject, no magazine not fully seated, no forget the safety. Second strike capability. Probably many I haven't thought of.
Further, I would suggest a 3-4" K frame revolver. The little J frames are not made for new or untrained shooters. The new folks are unlikely to put in the amount of practice it takes to become proficient with the little guns.

 

[S&W629]

where is that icon..for beating a dead horse????

 

[Dougaz]

This sounds like an argument in favor of revolvers.

A cop buddy once said: "I get it, auto's are the new prom queen but revolvers don't jamb and if I'm in a gun fight and need more than 6 rounds, an auto won't make much of a difference"

I can't carry an auto as my RA is too advanced to rack any slide.

My vote is for revolvers .....

Doug