About to buy my first gun... ever! Help! :)

[WilliamG]

Hey everyone!

Just registered a few minutes ago! Yay!

So quick background:

I'm from London originally, Land of the No Guns, and moved to the USA, and currently reside in Seattle, WA. I want to get a revolver for home defense and range/target practice for myself and my wife. She can NOT use a semi-auto, as she has weak wrists and cannot pull the slide back.

So, everyone seems to recommend the S&W 686 line!

Anyway, after much play, but no firing of (yet), I've settled on the 686 SSR line. I love the 4" barrel, and comparing a "base" 686 with the SSR model, the SSR's trigger is leagues (I mean literally night and day) better than the regular 686 when I fired them both (not actual rounds - just in the store). I also think the SSR is borderline pornography with how good it looks.

Anyway, I'm THIS close to purchasing:

1.) 686 SSR (best price I could find locally is $768.95 new, which I think is a good price?)
2.) Crimson Trace grip - I'm not sure the difference between the 306 and the 308 "Hoghunter" grips..., and I came across this thread that scares me. Will I have trouble with the CT Sights on my SSR?

S&W 686 SSR + LG-308 + CTC Customer Service = Winner! (pics) - Crimson Trace Forums

3.) Some .38 special hollow-point for home use.
4.) Barska biometric safe.

What are people's thoughts on this? Any tips or advice you can offer is super appreciated. I'm trying to be as informed as I can be, and I'm taking a handgun class next week before purchasing anything!

Thanks, all!

 

[OKFC05]

1. Take the class--both of you, but not necesarily together.
2. Shoot several guns. Money spent on rentals and classes is money well spent. I really like the 686, but it is a heavy service gun; not exactly carry friendly for most people. Also shoot a steel J frame like the 3" model 60. Maybe try a lightweight: harder to control. Try different ammo powers to see what you can handle. The more you learn, the less you worry about recoil, and the more you form your own opinions. A .22 revolver is a wonderful learning tool for a total beginner.
3. Then decide what you want to buy (for the first of several, probably)

 

[WilliamG]

Thank you for the reply. My wife and I are both taking this class next week. We'll get to fire a load of different guns, so we'll get some experience with all types.

And FYI, I have no intention of carrying!

 

[corpulent]

I'm also in the market for a 686. The price seems right, even Bud's has it for more.

Wouldn't the recoil of a .357 be as hard on the wrists as pulling back a slide?

 

[WilliamG]

I'm also in the market for a 686. The price seems right, even Bud's has it for more.

Wouldn't the recoil of a .357 be as hard on the wrists as pulling back a slide?

Potentially, though it's a different kind of wrist stress. In any case it'll be firing .38 special rounds 99.9% of the time.

 

[OKFC05]

And FYI, I have no intention of carrying!

Neither did I, when the USAF introduced me to the Model 15 S&W revolver 40 years ago.
As you get more experienced, you'll learn the value of protecting yourself instead of waiting for the police to come investigate your murder and may change your mind about carry, too. Obviously right now you aren't skilled, and aren't going to be from one class.

 

[WilliamG]

Neither did I, when the USAF introduced me to the Model 15 S&W revolver 40 years ago.
As you get more experienced, you'll learn the value of protecting yourself instead of waiting for the police to come investigate your murder and may change your mind about carry, too. Obviously right now you aren't skilled, and aren't going to be from one class.

Ouch, harsh! In any case, my carry gun will certainly not be this gun. I'm sure my gun infatuation will only increase, so I'll pick up something smaller for out and about if I go that route. I'm going to get my carry permit just to have it, though, but I don't intend to use it.

 

[bigshot500]

buy the gun on gunbroker and save $150+ on the 686...use the money you saved on ammo to practice.

 

[OKFC05]

I'm also in the market for a 686. The price seems right, even Bud's has it for more.

Wouldn't the recoil of a .357 be as hard on the wrists as pulling back a slide?

Not really, if they learn how to hold the 686.
In my experience with teaching women's classes, recoil of a .38 in a model 686 or 3" model 60 is not an issue even with petite women, but operating the slide IS an issue with about half of them. It takes more experience to handle a 442 lightweight, however.
It takes an experienced shooter of either gender to master a lightweight .357.

 

[feralmerril]

If you are a totaly new shooter I would first or at least purchase a .22lr along with your defense gun. Ammo is cheap to learn with, more important they are more quite with almost no kick. Your wife wont be scared off on learning with a 22. You should be able to find a close counterpart in 22 to whatever main defense gun you decide on in size and handeling. In fact if you want to or feel you can delay your primary defense gun a short while, you just might find that your 22 initiation might change your ideas on what you really want in your primary defense gun.

 

[BearBio]

I live on the other side of the "hill" from Seattle. A couple of things to think about/consider:
1) While few and far apart, we do have grizzlies in the Cascades (I know-I work with them). BIG difference between a black bear and grizzly. A .357 would be too lite if you do much backpacking or trail biking.
2) Seriously consider getting a carry permit as soon as you can. If nothing else, it can cover your fanny if you do something dumb--like forget and leave the gun in the car.
3) Keep an open mind until you take the course (A really good idea, by the way). You both may fall in love with something you try there. My wife hates semi-autos and has been through 4 revolvers until she settled on what she carries now.
4) I have taught several women to shoot. Let HER make up her own mind=if that means getting her her own gun, so be it! (PS== Buy her some shooting gloves, or bicycle gloves before class=checkering can abrade her palms)

For what it is worth, a 4" or 6" .357 revolver is likely the best ALL-ROUND choice for a handgun.

 

[WilliamG]

Thank you for this super-handy information! I really appreciate it.

I will certainly getting my conceal/carry permit just to have it, for sure!

 

[InkEd]

I would suggest against the biometric safe. They are slow and sometimes unreliable compared to regular pushbutton designs.
Get a regular GunVault with the "pushbutton hand" configuration. However, unless you have small children I don't see much need for small bedside safes.

Also, the 686SSR is a great gun but it's a bit overkill for what you need. Perhaps you should look into the Thunder Ranch .357 since this is going to be for home defense. IIRC it will give you an extra round and allow a light to be mounted.

Welcome to the US.
I cringe at UK (and even your Seattle) gun laws. I'm glad you are now living in a place where you have the right to defend yourself against criminals.

 

[WilliamG]

InkEd thanks for the reply. I've read so many terrible things about the GunVault system that I'm not even sure what to get... (hit it to open it, pried open with a flat-head screw driver in seconds etc). All safes have their downsides. This Abraska safe is supposed to be superb, though, with 30-print memories so it's *unlikely* not to work, and no remembering what combination to press in an emergency. I will say, of course, that no safe is perfect...

I don't have any children, and had just thought about holstering the 686 (if I get it) to the underside of the bed (I have a slatted frame for easy placement), but the gun shop insisted that in a break in, if I'm not home, under the bed is one of the places a thief will look. Again, that's just what I'm told....

I'm not sure the 686SSR is *overkill* for what I need. I want a good, reliable, solid home defense weapon that I can take to the range, too. I'm sure I'll hear other suggestions, too. No gun is perfect for all men/women!

*EDIT*

Why do you cringe at Seattle gun laws? WA state is one of the easiest states in the USA to get a gun/carry.

 

[WilliamG]

buy the gun on gunbroker and save $150+ on the 686...use the money you saved on ammo to practice.

Not sure where you're seeing an SSR for $150+ off the price I found...

 

[ImprovedModel56Fan]

Feralmerril wrote for many of us. AFAIK, it is more or less the classic American position on learning to shoot a handgun. After that, the 686 is certainly a good choice, as is a K-frame .38 or .357.

Re-read feralmerril's post.

 

[Avery11]

I'm gonna chime in here.

The gun you chose is a looker and a worker for sure. If home defense is its intended purpose, you can do the job for ALOT less money. God forbid you do use it in a life-threatening situation, your beautiful revolver is going into evidence for a long time. I can tell you first-hand (LEO; not criminal) that not all evidence custodians are gun lovers and will handle your firearm with less regard for the fine finish than its owner.

As for the trigger, if you stick with a S&W, the trigger will get better with use and you can save about 200-300 on a standard used 686. I know a couple guys at my club who changed spring kits and stoned triggers only to go back to OEM parts because the action got so slick it scared them. A less expensive revolver may have a less refined trigger but you won't notice when the adrenaline starts pumping.

All that said, its your money and your choice so get what you want. Guns are like tools in your garage. Each one has its advantages and limitations for different applications (at least that's what I tell my wife).

To argue my own point, the more you like your gun the more you'll enjoy using it. The more you use it, the better you'll get. The better you get, the safer and more accurate you'll be (hopefully).

Find a happy medium.

I will disagree with the ".22 first" theory. It will get you used to a plinker. Shooting .38 will get you used to .38 and so-on. Get good with your defensive weapon and THEN get a plinker to save money on ammo. Always end the session with a dozen big boys no matter what. Trust me.

Don't ever think the gun will save you everytime. Get an alarm system, lock doors, use motion lights...there's alot you can do to prevent the need. Train your body in case you can't get to it and remember that a bat never runs out of ammo!

Regardless, you have good taste for sure. Welcome to America - we're happy to have you. Welcome to shooting - we're extatic to have you. Cheers.

 

[InkEd]

I don't cringe so much at the WA state laws as I do the idea of living in Seattle, you can keep everything in that city but the coffee. However, with very few exceptions I'll stick with the good gun laws here in Tennessee.

Any little bedside safe is a waste of time, if you're trying to
prevent theft while away from home. Get a real gun safe AND keep ALL your valuables (jewelry, documents, etc) in it when at work.

At night/daytime when home, take the gun out of the safe and leave it on the nightstand or holster on the bed post. It is by far the best to have it QUICKLY available when you may need it.

Here's a little exercise for you.

While in bed....

See how long it takes to open one of those little safes and draw your weapon. Then try just picking it up from the table or a holster secured to the bed. Needless to say, which method is quicker.

Now for the "concerning" part, (as fast as you can) see how long it takes for you to open your (unlocked) bedroom door and run to your bed.

That last bit is how long it takes an intruder to kill you. Practice
drawing and aiming that gun until it becomes second nature. It may save your life one day.

Also, this exercise demonstrates why locking your bedroom door is good idea even if it's just the two of you. Lastly, it shows the man should sleep on the side of the bed closest to the door/most vunerable entry point. Something to think about.

 

[Doc Nonverbal]

My first handgun was a .357 Magnum - a S&W Model 66. I sold it and bought a 686. After shooting it enough to realize that I really don't like the muzzle blast and bark of the .357 round, I had it converted into a 5-shot .44 Special.

My advice, for what it's worth, is to shoot a .357 before you purchase one. If you can, try shooting a .44 Special as well. I find the .44 Special a much more pleasant round to shoot, with less blast, less sharp recoil, and at least in the handguns I've fired, much more accurate (not to mention the bigger hole). The .357 Magnum typically fires a 158 grain bullet. The .44 Special round is typically 200 grains, but can go up to 240 grains. For home defense, I believe it is a superior round.

Unfortunately, there aren't a great number of options in the new gun market for .44 Specials. The Ruger Redhawk in .44 Magnum will fire .44 Specials. Ruger also makes a flat top Blackhawk on a medium frame with a 4 5/8" barrel in .44 Special. I have two of the stainless versions and although I haven't fired them (I bought them to put away for my daughters), they fit my hand wonderfully. Some will dismiss a single-action pistol for home defense, but one well placed round will trump six hastily fired ones any day of the week.

I wish you the best of luck, whatever path you choose.


David

 

[RobertJ.]

Welcome to the forum, and the Great Northwest!

Seattle has some great gun stores. I don't live there now, but I used to, and here are some of my favorites:

Wade's Eastside Guns in Bellevue. Halfway decent prices, good selection, and they have an indoor range where you can rent whatever you want.

Ben's Loan in Renton. Big pawn shop, small gun area in back. Usually crowded. Good selection and good prices. Friendly, knowledgable staff. They layaway can't be beat-20% down, 5 months to pay it off!

Federal Way Discount Guns. Pacific Highway in FW. Decent selection, decent prices, but the staff can be rude. Deal with the owner, he's nice.

Bullseye Shooter's Supply in Tacoma. Infamously known as the place the DC sniper got his rifle. Good selection, friendly staff, well stocked indoor range upstairs.

Butch's Guns on N. Aurora. Good selection, good prices. Near Beth's Cafe, a great place to eat!

 

[InkEd]

I just wanted to chime in, again. I agree 100% with Avery11 about NOT getting a .22 first! Personally, I had a "baptism by fire" and LEARNED to shoot a .38 Chief's Special before anything else. IMHO it made learning other pistols ALOT easier.

That said, I think a .38special service revolver or 9mm polymer semiauto is the best gun for a beginner. It allows you to experience recoil, noise, muzzle flash and get used to shooting a "real" gun. The ".22 first" method is fine for recreational only and children learning to shoot BUT for defensive shooting, it is best to get in there and do it right from the start.

 

[WilliamG]

Boy there's a lot of opinions here. I think what I'm seeing, though, is that there is no *right* gun for the job, so I'm going to fire whatever I can during my class, and go from there.

As far as easy access to my gun while sleeping, I'll have to think on it some more. I don't have a bedroom door I can lock. My house is a completely open floor plan. It's a town home with three floors. The ground floor is just an office/entry way, and then up to the kitchen/living room/dining room area, and then up again to the upstairs office/bedroom. There are ZERO doors to get to my bedroom once you get through the front door.

THIS is why I would feel safer with Mr Smith and Mr Wesson watching over me and my wife.

Anyway, I'll see how the class goes...!

BTW, I have absolutely no room in my tiny house for a huge gun safe, so that idea is out of the question..!

 

[MJB]

This is my 686 no dash, 1984 vintage. I bought this about 2 years ago for $490.

It is very accurate, very reliable and it has no stupid lock.

Shop around and welcome to America.

 

[WilliamG]

See, the infernal, I mean.. internal lock doesn't bother me one bit. I'm not sure why all the hatred, really...

And that gun doesn't do anything for me, for any amount of money. I guess I really am in it for the looks, too.

 

[Dragon88]

Hey everyone!

Just registered a few minutes ago! Yay!

So quick background:

I'm from London originally, Land of the No Guns, and moved to the USA, and currently reside in Seattle, WA. I want to get a revolver for home defense and range/target practice for myself and my wife. She can NOT use a semi-auto, as she has weak wrists and cannot pull the slide back.

So, everyone seems to recommend the S&W 686 line!

Anyway, after much play, but no firing of (yet), I've settled on the 686 SSR line. I love the 4" barrel, and comparing a "base" 686 with the SSR model, the SSR's trigger is leagues (I mean literally night and day) better than the regular 686 when I fired them both (not actual rounds - just in the store). I also think the SSR is borderline pornography with how good it looks.

Anyway, I'm THIS close to purchasing:

1.) 686 SSR (best price I could find locally is $768.95 new, which I think is a good price?)
2.) Crimson Trace grip - I'm not sure the difference between the 306 and the 308 "Hoghunter" grips..., and I came across this thread that scares me. Will I have trouble with the CT Sights on my SSR?

S&W 686 SSR + LG-308 + CTC Customer Service = Winner! (pics) - Crimson Trace Forums

3.) Some .38 special hollow-point for home use.
4.) Barska biometric safe.

What are people's thoughts on this? Any tips or advice you can offer is super appreciated. I'm trying to be as informed as I can be, and I'm taking a handgun class next week before purchasing anything!

Thanks, all!

There are a lot of comments in here, some of them negative. I'm gonna try and give you positive ones. It sounds like you want not just a defense gun but one you will enjoy owning. That's great! A gun you truly enjoy will get shot more, enjoyed more, maintained better, etc. You are thinking about recoil management which is great. You are thinking about a quick access safe which is excellent. Honestly some people will say you should get this or you should get that, but if what you plan to purchase makes you happy then go for it! You are leaps and bounds above the average person in creating a home defense plan.

I will say, shoot a 686 before hand on a range with both 38 special, 38 special +P, and 357 rounds if you can. Buy or borrow a speedloader and take it with you. Make sure both you and your wife will be comfortable with the gun and willing to shoot if the situation comes. Make sure both you, and especially your wife with weak wrists, can shoot a full cylinder, RELOAD, and shoot another full cylinder with no breaks or extreme fatigue. All 12 rounds should be on target at a reasonable self defense range.

Shop around for the best price, buy good SD ammo, practice as much as you can, and enjoy your new gun when you get it!

 

[WilliamG]

Dragon88, thank you for your positive comments!

I meant to add several Safariland speedloader comp II to my list of *potential* purchases, so thanks for reminding me. People tend to prefer that to the HKS speedloaders.

And you're absolutely right. I would simply not *enjoy* owning any old gun. A used 686 whatever would be absolutely fine for home defense, but looking at it doesn't bring a thrill to my... err.. loins (?), whereas the SSR does. It's that simple.

I am, however, fully prepared to hate firing a 686 when I do fire it next week, so we'll see how that goes!

 

[creweldragon]

WilliamG

I started shooting a long time ago. I did some reading at the time and one of the pundits said that I would need to put 5,000 rounds down range before I would be comfortable and resonably compitent.

I have put lots of lead down range, well in excess of 5,000 by now. I would advise a 22 long rifle built as close to your desired gun as possible. Then start practicing on a regular basis. If you can find classes they will help you move ahead much faster than I did. If you find the right 22 you will use it for years, even after you buy your favorite big bore.

I have worked with new shooters in our club and I was able to give them some pointers that shrank their groups at 25 yds from all over the paper to keeping them in the black on our targets. If I can do that for shooters so can any good trainer.

Hope this helps.

 

[WilliamG]

Thank you for posting! I take all your suggestions to heart, believe you me. I really want to be as informed as possible. I'm not afraid to admit I don't know enough.

That said, I kick ass at clay shooting with an over/under.

 

[NE450No2]

WilliamG

First Welcome to the USA, Englander...

[I have several English friends].

Your choice of a S&W in 357 is a good one. Crimson Trace grips are well worth the money.

Later on when you and the wife get your CHL, just get the 5 shot S&W's in 357 Mag. You will most likely carry 38's in them, but in a pinch ALL of your handguns can shoot 38 or 357 ammo, not a bad plan.

 

[WilliamG]

Sounds like a good plan. I do have a soft spot for S&W revolvers. I really don't know why. There's just something about them...