Any probate attorneys here? Need help.

[lihpster]

I realize laws are different in different states, but I would like to bounce some things off an attorney to see if they sound reasonable. Also, If you have any recommendations for a probate attorney in Oregon, especially one that works on spec. that would be helpful. Never had to deal with this before, and what I'm hearing is setting off huge red warning flags with me. I'm skating pretty thin on cash and don't have enough to pay a retainer. Any advice would be helpful, beyond just, "Get an Oregon attorney". Really out of my depth here.

 

[DWalt]

If this is a situation you are faced with right now, you have no choice other to get an attorney in your state, as laws differ in every state. There might be some sort of free or modest fee legal help available if you can't afford much. You might contact your local bar association about that. And then there is also the possibility of Federal and State estate taxes, which is a different topic. You may need a CPA for that.

By far, the best approach is to structure the deceased's finances and assets to avoid any need for formal probate while the deceased is still alive. There are many ways to legally avoid probate, but not after someone dies. Some states do not require probate if assets are below a certain amount.

 

[Marshwheeling]

Talk to a lawyer in your state, or where the estate is being administered. You may not need to pay a retainer. Hourly, pay as you go is the norm, with attorney fees in many cases paid out of the estate.

 

[chief38]

If the inheritance is more than enough to cover legal fees, an attorney may agree to let you pay at the end. Not saying he will, but you can certainly ask.

 

[Krogen]

I am not an attorney, so I can't help you there. But, as said above, look for free legal assistance organizations. If they don't help you directly, they may be able to point you in the right direction.

Do take your time, there's no sense rushing into something you regret. I was the executor for my Dad's estate. Logically (I thought) I used the attorney who wrote up Dad's will and trust. Big mistake. The guy was a _________ ! I should have bailed early, but didn't. It did get settled, but took longer and more $$ than expected. Take your time in a situation where human nature is to just get it over with. You indicate red flags seem to be flying. Pay attention to your gut.

And finally: Don't hesitate to bounce ideas off the good folks of this forum. Many of us have gone through what you're facing.

 

[lihpster]

Well, the red flags are getting brighter. I was able to google one question I had and I will be calling an attorney later today. He did some work for my dad after my mom passed and seemed very competent and trustworthy. If he won't work with me on a payment agreement, maybe he will know somebody who might. We'll see. The people I'm dealing with are either crooks or incompetent.

 

[WR Moore]

Probate can be a swamp. Be careful. Also, not everyone who works in a courthouse/county offices knows what they're supposed to be doing and/or wants to be actually helpful. Cherish those who are and make sure you know their names.

 

[llowry61]

On the hourly billing side, be sure to ask what increments they bill the smaller the better.

If you get a 300 per hour atty and they bill in 15-minute increments, you will be paying minimum 75.00 every time you talk to them.

 

[DWalt]

Make all arrangements covering your assets to avoid probate before you die. Save your survivors from the torture of probate. Always use survivorship bank and brokerage accounts and vehicle titles, and put all real estate in Transfer on Death Deeds if your state recognizes them. It is very simple to do and does not require a lawyer, only a Notary and registration with the County clerk. Might also look into setting up a revocable trust if you have substantial assets. Meet with a lawyer before you die to get advice on probate avoidance as requirements differ by state.

When my parents died, I was very fortunate that the County Probate Court judge was my cousin. He basically expedited everything for me and I didn't need a lawyer. When my B-I-L died almost five years ago, there was enough time remaining before he died for me to take all the steps needed to keep his assets completely out of probate with the help of a lawyer friend who charged me nothing. Prevention is better than cure.

I am attaching a review of Transfer on Death Deeds. I think this information is very important for any owner of real estate to be aware of in order to avoid probate, assuming it is recognized by your state. Transfer-on-Death Deeds: An Overview | Nolo

My deceased mother-in-law was fleeced out of much of her dead husband's estate during probate. But that happened long before she was my M-I-L so I do not know all the details. But thereafter she had to live in near-poverty the rest of her life. My wife and I essentially supported her from the time we married until she died.

 

[cololab]

Some questions come to mind, not knowing the laws in any state in which your parents lived or owned property. Was there a will, or better, any trust created?

Dealing with any issue that requires a probate proceeding is a minefield for the uninformed and an opportunity for an unscrupulous attorney or administrator to do their worst. Sadly, the services of an attorney in matters such as these may be necessary.

 

[CalifEd]

Not sure about Oregon, but here in California there are self help centers in many of the State Central Courts.
The can't give legal advice but they will help with guidance in filling out forms, what they mean and what follow up you should do.
Seems that many of the issues and solutions can be resolved with a proper form delivered to the proper place.
Many of the folks providing this service are either practicing attorneys or legal clerks and may know a guy who knows a guy.
One place that I have used for Probate, Trusts, Trustee issues and removing relatives as squatters is NOLO Press. They have a web page and I believe many of their books deal with individual states' issues - worth a look.

 

[Mike SC Hunter]

We put everything into a trust with our 2 kids. The trust allows us to buy or sell......When we leave this earth all is automatically theirs. NO outsiders involved.

 

[HOUSTON RICK]

The bar association nay be able to help. Free or discounted wills and related help are a common volunteer attorney activity for those who qualify.

 

[steelslaver]

In Montana there is a group of attorneys that help elderly set up basic estates and end of life type paperwork. My wife usually volunteers with them several times a year. I suspect Oregon has something similar. Also many bar associations require attorneys to contribute so much pro bono work.

You need to contact some elder assistance groups.

 

[Mike SC Hunter]

As far as free versus paid.................You always get what you paid for

 

[DWalt]

The concept of a revocable trust is fairly simple, but there can be some drawbacks and complications. Best to talk with a lawyer knowledgeable in trusts to examine your personal finances. If you live in simpler financial circumstances and no complicated assets and investments there may be easier ways to avoid probate without paying a lawyer to set up a revocable trust.

 

[TX-Dennis]

After my Dad passed. I had to engage a local attorney to help deal with his will. His rate was $640/hour. Sounds like a lot, but really there weren't many hours involved. He drew up something called an Order Admitting Will In Probate As Muniment of Title. This was allowed in Texas since there were no debts and the only property involved was his home. Everything else was set up with beneficiaries. We did have to go before a county judge and swear that everything was true. Then he signed off on it, and the county clerk's office filed everything. I think my total cost was under four grand including filing fees.

Of course, you may be facing something more complex. More complex will also likely mean more expensive, unfortunately.

 

[mtgianni]

Also Law students in their last year of school have a class where they answer questions for free. You might get what you pay for but the basics are there

 

[DWalt]

After my Dad passed. I had to engage a local attorney to help deal with his will. His rate was $640/hour. Sounds like a lot, but really there weren't many hours involved. He drew up something called an Order Admitting Will In Probate As Muniment of Title. This was allowed in Texas since there were no debts and the only property involved was his home. Everything else was set up with beneficiaries. We did have to go before a county judge and swear that everything was true. Then he signed off on it, and the county clerk's office filed everything. I think my total cost was under four grand including filing fees.

Of course, you may be facing something more complex. More complex will also likely mean more expensive, unfortunately.

That would have been an ideal situation for a TODD. There would have been no need for retaining a lawyer. And the property would have passed instantly. No judges involved either.

 

[steelslaver]

As far as free versus paid.................You always get what you paid for

One of the ladies whom my wife does the free elder estate deal with, retired after a very sought after expert in estate law. What they do is very simple, but pretty iron clad if you are honest with them. If you have a lot of assets they will advise you to go somewhere else with those.

Believe it or not, there are attorneys that actually care about people. My wife took the case of an old woman being evicted from her own trailer in a trailer court all the way to the state supreme court before she finally won. That woman couldn't pay her a dime.

The property manager of the that trailer court had plenty of paid for legal advice. Not only did he pay for that he is now paying for more as she is going after them for the wrongful eviction and legal fees.

 

[CAJUNLAWYER]

Down here normal estate distribution consists of the first family cleaning out the trailer while the second family is at the funeral. Maybe I'm leaving a lot of money on the table, but here successions are 90% of the time quite simple matters and at least in my circle of clients take no more that a trip to the courthouse to round up property descriptions-getting info on the kids and surviving spouse preparing some rote documents and walking it through for a judge's signature. I'm not gonna tell you what I usually charge other than to say that I lie awake at night dreaming of being able to charge and collect $640 an hour. I guess when one has done something long enough it gets easy to the point where you don't realize just how much stuff goes into it-you just do it without thinking.

 

[WR Moore]

An attorney once took me to an establishment frequented by lawyers during lunch hour at the local court house. I overheard the following between two lawyers. One hopes this was an example of lawyer humor.

"Hey, how did that probate case come out?"

"It was a tough fight, the heirs got nearly as much money as we did."

 

[Farmer17]

My attorney friend charged me about $2,500 to set up my estate for everything to go to my daughters and I have a construction business, rent houses, oil & gas interests, four or five bank accounts, IRAs, 401K and 3 limitied liability companies. For most people it should be less than that and it was well worth the piece of mind knowing it was done right.

 

[Bald1]

OP hasn't stated exactly what his concerned about. His estate or someone else's. Unless I missed something

 

[DWalt]

My attorney friend charged me about $2,500 to set up my estate for everything to go to my daughters and I have a construction business, rent houses, oil & gas interests, four or five bank accounts, IRAs, 401K and 3 limitied liability companies. For most people it should be less than that and it was well worth the piece of mind knowing it was done right.

If you own businesses or are in partnerships or other complicated financial dealings, you nearly have to get a lawyer involved to avoid probate. If you just own a house, have bank accounts and brokerage accounts, you can generally handle it yourself. Make sure your heirs know all about your financial arrangements. For personal vehicles, the titles should be styled in joint survivorship as should bank accounts and brokerage accounts. Talk with your bank or brokerage. I believe most states allow that.

 

[ladder13]

My attorney friend charged me about $2,500 to set up my estate for everything to go to my daughters and I have a construction business, rent houses, oil & gas interests, four or five bank accounts, IRAs, 401K and 3 limitied liability companies. For most people it should be less than that and it was well worth the piece of mind knowing it was done right.

We have done the same. There will not be any arguments, at least ifo a judge, when we both pass.
We did it for them, not us, so they can keep the lions share. And as my estate lawyer said "not many people do any of that", which includes my sister and BIL.
BIL has the "who cares what happens when we die" attitude. I gave up talking about estate finances ifo of him. Let the court figure it all out.

 

[lihpster]

OP hasn't stated exactly what his concerned about. His estate or someone else's. Unless I missed something

My father had a court appointed conservator. He died intestate. Worried that the conservator is a thief. Had some questions that I didn't know how to get answers for. Got some off of Google from a State website that shows all the statutes concerning intestate estates. Gonna try talking to a lawyer, and see if I can't get this figured out.

P.S. I am the sole heir. The estate comes to me and me alone. There was a court order awarding me compensation for being my dad's caregiver. They gave me a small chunk and said they couldn't give me the rest until we had sold the house because we had to be sure there was enough to sustain him, even though there was over 3 times the amount owed to me in cash, or liquid assets. When my father died and we no longer needed to save for his future, I asked for the rest of my compensation as I am selling guns to buy food. Now they say, that since he's passed it's just another claim against the estate and we have to wait for it to go through probate so that they can get a court order to pay me, even though there was already a court order to pay me.
Anyway, I think I got it handled, for now. Thanks to everyone for their advice and counsel. I appreciate it.

 

[Bald1]

Well good luck with it. My wife and I took steps back in the spring to straighten out our estates. Wills, healthcare proxy, power of attorney, trusts, and document all beneficiaries. Got all the paperwork in a binder locked in safe. Hopefully we won't need it anytime soon.

 

[Golddollar]

Years ago when I was working in Maryland I was friendly with a local accounting firm. The accounting firm came up with something that I think is just absolutely brilliant. They called it an estate handbook, and I really provides a means for pulling together all the things that an estate administrator would have to consider. I'm talking about down to asking what songs to have played at the funeral (I wanted "Return to Sender" by Elvis Presley when they are wheeling me out). Just having the phone numbers all together for the people to notify would save a lot of time and effort trying to look them up at a very stressful time.

 

[DWalt]

BIL has the "who cares what happens when we die" attitude. I gave up talking about estate finances ifo of him. Let the court figure it all out.

My BIL had the same lack of concern. Almost five years ago he came down very suddenly and was sent to hospice care within a few days after I took him to the hospital where nothing could be done to save him. No worse place on earth than a hospice. He had done nothing regarding the disposition of his estate, not even a simple will. I actually made all the arrangements to pass everything he had to his daughter (who lived out of state) while he was on his deathbed. He had no wife. I had to hire a Notary Public to come to the hospice while he signed all the paperwork I prepared so I could file it. He was dead two weeks later. One other very important thing I did was to have both he and his daughter sign a Power of Attorney to me, which I also prepared. His daughter knew less than nothing about handling the details so I had to do everything for her. But at least I kept everything out of probate.