Awareness

[Old TexMex]

I'm in Mexico at the moment, and every time I'm in a different environment, applying what my training teaches- (situational awareness- it's called in a lot of circles) gets a real warmup. Do you really LOOK at each table in the restaurant, at every car in the service station, and do you let preconceived notions allow you to discount, or, focus too closely, look too long at an idividual or group.
Are you aware, and have you practiced it enough so that it isn't paranoia that spoils your enjoyment of the moment.
I say this because having adopted behavior patterns of paying attention, I am much more at ease, and have, as it turns out, avoided, almost unconciously, a dangerous situation.
It's practice, and as self defense, it's every bit as important as marksmanship.
Stay sharp, stay loose.

 

[Old cop]

Situational awareness comes second nature and I can relax while being aware of what's going on around me. Sometimes, like when I have my three small grandchildren with me, I may not be as aware as other times b/c I'm concerned w/their safety (like herding cats), but this is as important as marksmenship.

Keep your eyes and ears open and always go with your gut.

 

[gunnut44]

Never felt so helpless to protect my family this summer when vacationing in mexico, I didn't even have a pocket knife! Luckily nothing happened and I am back at home safe and armed. Yes I watch my back wherever I go.

 

[Ivan the Butcher]

I was in the theater men's room after a movie 2 weeks ago. The layout was such that to exit there is a choke point by the sinks. I had gone to the furthest urnal from the door and while exiting every stall door was open and empty, so I know nobody is behind me. A man standing about 6' back from the sinks, in the middle of the choke point, moves left and right to block my exit while combing his hair in the mirror. After he blocked my path 3 times, I backed off about 4 or 5 paces. I put my hand in my pocket and grabbed my model 49 but didn't draw. He left in about 10 seconds, I waited about 60 seconds and slowly exited, no sign of him. When my wife showed up in a few minutes, I made her stay back while slowly exited the building and checked behind the door, no sign of him. I don't know what was up, but if I wasn't paying attention in the rest room I think a bad thing would have happened to me!

 

[DR505]

I was in the theater men's room after a movie 2 weeks ago. The layout was such that to exit there is a choke point by the sinks. I had gone to the furthest urnal from the door and while exiting every stall door was open and empty, so I know nobody is behind me. A man standing about 6' back from the sinks, in the middle of the choke point, moves left and right to block my exit while combing his hair in the mirror. After he blocked my path 3 times, I backed off about 4 or 5 paces. I put my hand in my pocket and grabbed my model 49 but didn't draw. He left in about 10 seconds, I waited about 60 seconds and slowly exited, no sign of him. When my wife showed up in a few minutes, I made her stay back while slowly exited the building and checked behind the door, no sign of him. I don't know what was up, but if I wasn't paying attention in the rest room I think a bad thing would have happened to me!

I admire your restraint.

 

[kaaskop49]

A very interesting post. So it's called situational awareness. I subscribe to it. However, I've been called over-cautious, even scared because I believe a TON of prevention is worth a OUNCE of cure. I remember a movie-theater men's room in Times Square, NYC back in the 70s. My partner and I took turns at the urinal so we could watch each other's back. We also learned not to ride in the last car of a subway train, not to lean over the platform edge, to stand at an angle when confronting an indvidual so a possible kick would not reach our groin.. The list goes on and on. It's gotten longer as I've aged and have come across new situations in new places. It's not just about caliber or ballistics. Would love to hear other 'lists.' Stay safe, people.

 

[Steely Dan]

I've told my wife and two girls "keep your head on a swivel, be aware of your surroundings......always"

You CANNOT be too careful.

 

[mudman bob]

Great topic.
Situational awareness is what may keep you safe in many facets of life. The hairs on your neck stick up, or you get that gut feeling. Pay heed to your instincts and always be alert. That 30 foot radius, or whatever your comfort zone is, should always include the possible what if's. Grab a copy of Sharpening the Warriors Edge, or Living the Martial Way. Good stuff

 

[DAB]

being 6-5 and not looking rich also helps.

 

[kaaskop49]

Re Ivan the Butcher's post: This is what the anti-gunners steadfastly and INTENTIONALLY refuse to acknowledge. This incident will (fortunately) never make a police blotter, but without the 2" revolver in his pocket, Ivan might not be able to write about it.
Sadly, Ivan's type of incident happens countless times daily. Happily, the presence of a pocket gun can fortify us to help us get through the situation even without producing it.

 

[Mule Packer]

Old TexMex makes a good point about applying training and keeping it sharp.

That's one of the sad things about our society. We become too comfortable...too complacent and falsely secure in our environment that we quit paying attention to potential "red flags." We think we're safe.

Situational awareness is something that we are all born with, but we lose it as we grow older. Don't believe me? Just watch little kids when they are put in new surroundings...they notice all the sounds, smells, sights, etc. If something changes, they pick up on it.

We lose that, or perhaps more correctly, ignore it as we grow more "comfortable" with our surroundings.

Most of us feel that the majority of people can be trusted and are "good just like us." Just ask the girls that crawled into the car with Ted Bundy.

I'm as guilty as everyone else. In our little community, I feel fairly comfortable and safe. Do I still carry? You bet your life I do! Do I still assess the situation as I go into a restaurant with my wife, go to the store with my grandkids, or walk across a parking lot late at night? I sure try to.

Thanks, Old TexMex, for the post. I'm going to try to improve on what I know I should be doing.

 

[Old TexMex]

being 6-5 and not looking rich also helps.

One of those is impossible for me, and the other one is unavoidable! (I'm 5'9)

 

[The Big D]

What?!?!

So you are considering use of deadly force against someone in your way exiting the men's room? Wow.

Be safe.

I was in the theater men's room after a movie 2 weeks ago. The layout was such that to exit there is a choke point by the sinks. I had gone to the furthest urnal from the door and while exiting every stall door was open and empty, so I know nobody is behind me. A man standing about 6' back from the sinks, in the middle of the choke point, moves left and right to block my exit while combing his hair in the mirror. After he blocked my path 3 times, I backed off about 4 or 5 paces. I put my hand in my pocket and grabbed my model 49 but didn't draw. He left in about 10 seconds, I waited about 60 seconds and slowly exited, no sign of him. When my wife showed up in a few minutes, I made her stay back while slowly exited the building and checked behind the door, no sign of him. I don't know what was up, but if I wasn't paying attention in the rest room I think a bad thing would have happened to me!

 

[Roadtrash]

People watching is something that I have done since I was a small child. It's amazing how many bad situations you can avoid by being alert and just watching people. I don't do it consciously it's just something I do.

 

[sw1834]

My Awareness

My situational awareness is keen enough to never even GO to Mexico. My story is about las Vegas. Years ago I was downtown on Freemont St. with friends and had enough and was on my way to the bus stop to get back to the strip.
The bus stop was a block or two from the the safety of the covered street and the crowds of people. As i walked past a dark store-front I noticed two men hunkered down in an alcove. I kept watching them as i walked and after i past them I saw one of them approaching me from behind in a reflection of the store windows. I stopped and spun around and took a fighting stance. The man stopped and said "what the f**k were you looking at?" I carefully took 2 steps back while slowly unzipping my coat with my right hand while keeping my left arm up in a defensive manner. I replied - Just going to the bus. He turned and walked away.
I'm fairly positive i would have been jumped if i had not had the awareness to turn and face that man. On a side note I was not armed that night, but I gave the impression that I was. That impression might have saved me alot of trouble.

 

[TexasArmed]

So you are considering use of deadly force against someone in your way exiting the men's room? Wow.

Be safe.

What is a person supposed to do? Beg to be allowed to leave. If I feel threatened my hand is on my pocket holstered S&W 38 Spl. I will not allow a persion to attack, disarm me, shoot me with my own gun, in a physical attack whether the attacker is armed or unarmed. I am old and disalbed. I won't shoot someone from blocking the exit unless he is determined to stop me from leaving. No I iwll not allow him to rob me or take my billfold. Thats my opinion.

This is another reason I prefer carrying a 2nd revolver, one the 38 in my pocket. I can prepare to use it without alerting anyone, by preparing to draw it. It is quite useful if approached in a parking lot.

 

[Old TexMex]

What is a person supposed to do? Beg to be allowed to leave. If I feel threatened my hand is on my pocket holstered S&W 38 Spl. I will not allow a persion to attack, disarm me, shoot me with my own gun, in a physical attack whether the attacker is armed or unarmed. I am old and disalbed. I won't shoot someone from blocking the exit unless he is determined to stop me from leaving. No I iwll not allow him to rob me or take my billfold. Thats my opinion.

This is another reason I prefer carrying a 2nd revolver, one the 38 in my pocket. I can prepare to use it without alerting anyone, by preparing to draw it. It is quite useful if approached in a parking lot.

That scenario is the perfect leadup to a mugging. Close quarters, one exit, and isolation. Going through kidnap drills, restrooms at crowded venues are more common than I ever imagined. That and convenience store stops where there is a lot of traffic.

I just went to look at a restroom where there have been numerous gringo robberies(restroom tour-sounds fun, right?) the window in the stall is 8' above the floor, but only 3' off the ground outside.
Victim walks in, one bandit follows the mark and stands right outside the stall door, the unlocked window slides open, a hand and pistol points down on the innocent tourist, who is ordered to drop wallet, passport etc. which is taken by the guy outside the door, who then leaves as his accomplice in the window keeps the victim there till both bandits are outside, then they hop in a car(parked next to the window) and off they go. Nobody saw anyone, ever. This will mess up a holiday more than timeshare salesmen.

 

[photoman]

I was in the theater men's room after a movie 2 weeks ago. The layout was such that to exit there is a choke point by the sinks. I had gone to the furthest urnal from the door and while exiting every stall door was open and empty, so I know nobody is behind me. A man standing about 6' back from the sinks, in the middle of the choke point, moves left and right to block my exit while combing his hair in the mirror. After he blocked my path 3 times, I backed off about 4 or 5 paces. I put my hand in my pocket and grabbed my model 49 but didn't draw. He left in about 10 seconds, I waited about 60 seconds and slowly exited, no sign of him. When my wife showed up in a few minutes, I made her stay back while slowly exited the building and checked behind the door, no sign of him. I don't know what was up, but if I wasn't paying attention in the rest room I think a bad thing would have happened to me!

When they see you go hand-to-pocket they know exactly what that means.

I had a case where, at the gas station a typical "interview" at the pumps, a guy came up asking for directions. The minute my hand went into the pocket, he "suddenly" knew exactly where he was and didn't need directions after all.

 

[kaaskop49]

TexasArmed: you said it better than I ever could.

 

[jfd]

Texas Armed....in reply to poster questioning your intention, like you my hand goes into position when situational awareness dictates. I wouldn't pretend to know what somebody like you encountered might be up to but wouldn't take a chance that my personal safety or perhaps even my life wasn't at risk. Nothing wrong in my book with an ounce of prevention.

My wife also laughs at me for never sitting with my back to the door in a public place but she knows exactly why I do it.

 

[8DuckCaller]

When I was young had a friend that was several years older than me. We started deer hunting in SC in the early 70's. His job required him to travel to NY City often. One day he told me to always walk with one hand in a pocket. Being young and dumb I asked him why. He said that a robber would usually(?) not rob you because you may have a weapon. I'm 61 now and it's funny how often I have thought of that advise. Traveled to 42 states and that right hand is always in my pocket. My wife smiles about it often. I too never sit with my back to a door. I've been a people watcher all my life. I also believe in eye contact, even when walking down the street.

 

[XD40inTX]

I'll bet you guys don't just refuse to sit with your back to the door. You won't sit with your back to the room, either. I won't. I always insist on sitting with my back to the wall. My wife calls it the "gunfighter instinct," and I tell her she's exactly right.

I also augment my situational awareness by playing little mind games. What will I do if those guys follow me out to the parking lot? What will I do if that guy over there tries to stop me? That way, I'm prepared before it happens.

 

[J. R. WEEMS]

People watching is something that I have done since I was a small child. It's amazing how many bad situations you can avoid by being alert and just watching people. I don't do it consciously it's just something I do.

this is an everyday thing for me and has been for years. Now I am trying to instruct my daughter-in-law in these levels. As well as getting in all the range time we can. Never hurts.

 

[TexasArmed]

That scenario is the perfect leadup to a mugging. Close quarters, one exit, and isolation. Going through kidnap drills, restrooms at crowded venues are more common than I ever imagined. That and convenience store stops where there is a lot of traffic.

I just went to look at a restroom where there have been numerous gringo robberies(restroom tour-sounds fun, right?) the window in the stall is 8' above the floor, but only 3' off the ground outside.
Victim walks in, one bandit follows the mark and stands right outside the stall door, the unlocked window slides open, a hand and pistol points down on the innocent tourist, who is ordered to drop wallet, passport etc. which is taken by the guy outside the door, who then leaves as his accomplice in the window keeps the victim there till both bandits are outside, then they hop in a car(parked next to the window) and off they go. Nobody saw anyone, ever. This will mess up a holiday more than timeshare salesmen.

I don't dare what their strategy may be, I intend to get the one coming out and he will be bleeding on the floor. No free shots. Depends on what they are willing to pay to try to take me. Not claiming to be tough. This kind of scenario is why I carry.

 

[The Big D]

One thing my three (3) decades of LEO experience taught me is the vast majority of people we encounter do NOT want to harm us in any way. The rest of my life experiences have confirmed that fact.

That said, I will not walk through life with a hand on my gun, always sit with my back to a wall, or otherwise alter my existence in such a way that affects living life fully and happily.

Before anyone chimes in to inquire in what fantasy world I live, let me help you by reminding you my LEO career spanned forty-six (46) states with the majority spent in metropolitan Washington, DC, New York City, and Boston.

I have dealt with many, many bad guys both on-duty and off-duty and my "situational awareness" was keen and remains intact. But, I do NOT consider someone in my path or encountered in any way to be a threat lest other factors are present.

e.g. Last Saturday afternoon I was enjoying some beers in a very crowded bar before the Maryland-Dook basketball game. On one of my myriad trips to the men's room I bumped into many people. One of those was quite obviously carrying a gun. It was on his left hip...concealed, of course. I suspect it was a medium frame autoloader. I quickly noted his attire, body language, and demeanor and continued on my way. Took a moment to spot him when I returned to the bar and instantly determined he was not a threat...to anyone.

Given what has been said (and done) by some herein, what would you have done in the situation I cited? (Kindly spare us: "I wouldn't have been in a bar?" I was. )

Be safe.

 

[old curmudgeon]

One thing my three (3) decades of LEO experience taught me is the vast majority of people we encounter do NOT want to harm us in any way. The rest of my life experiences have confirmed that fact.

That said, I will not walk through life with a hand on my gun, always sit with my back to a wall, or otherwise alter my existence in such a way that affects living life fully and happily.

Before anyone chimes in to inquire in what fantasy world I live, let me help you by reminding you my LEO career spanned forty-six (46) states with the majority spent in metropolitan Washington, DC, New York City, and Boston.

I have dealt with many, many bad guys both on-duty and off-duty and my "situational awareness" was keen and remains intact. But, I do NOT consider someone in my path or encountered in any way to be a threat lest other factors are present.

e.g. Last Saturday afternoon I was enjoying some beers in a very crowded bar before the Maryland-Dook basketball game. On one of my myriad trips to the men's room I bumped into many people. One of those was quite obviously carrying a gun. It was on his left hip...concealed, of course. I suspect it was a medium frame autoloader. I quickly noted his attire, body language, and demeanor and continued on my way. Took a moment to spot him when I returned to the bar and instantly determined he was not a threat...to anyone.

Given what has been said (and done) by some herein, what would you have done in the situation I cited? (Kindly spare us: "I wouldn't have been in a bar?" I was. )

Be safe.

Were you armed?

Are you still an LEO?

Does MD exempt ex LEO's from their draconian firearm laws?

Was the bar in MD?

Does MD law allow drinking while armed or even in a bar armed drinking or not?

Was the other guy an LEO on duty or maybe undercover checking bars?

Since MD has such draconian firearm laws, lots of questions.

 

[photoman]

Were you armed?

Are you still an LEO?

Does MD exempt ex LEO's from their draconian firearm laws?

Was the bar in MD?

Does MD law allow drinking while armed or even in a bar armed drinking or not?

Was the other guy an LEO on duty or maybe undercover checking bars?

Since MD has such draconian firearm laws, lots of questions.

You forgot to turn on the bright light and pick up your rubber hose.

Personally, I get the point Big D is making. The goal is to balance awareness and relaxation. I'm guilty of picking my table in a restaurant for defense reasons but it doesn't ruin my meal if I have to sit in the middle with my back to 50 people.

 

[old curmudgeon]

I used to go through MD on interstate 81.

I also hunted in MD a few times.

Because of their firearms laws and the current attempt to wreck the 2Nd Amendment and my desire to support the 2Nd Amendment in any way I can, I refuse to enter the state for any reason whatsoever.

Therefore, it is of some interest to me that an ex LEO is drinking beer in a bar, probably armed, and encountering persons who might also be either ex or present LEO's drinking while armed.

Being from TX, you might consider this an over reaction, but here on the east coast there are a lot of problems with travelling through or to MD, DC, NJ, NY and CN.

 

[TexasArmed]

You forgot to turn on the bright light and pick up your rubber hose.

Personally, I get the point Big D is making. The goal is to balance awareness and relaxation. I'm guilty of picking my table in a restaurant for defense reasons but it doesn't ruin my meal if I have to sit in the middle with my back to 50 people.

I would never be in Mexico. I also would not be in a restaurant that served alcohol because in Texas drinking in a bar with a gun and a permit is sufficient for one to have their permit revoked. I don't know whether that applies to law enforcement in bars in Texas, because I don't drink. I have family in law enforcement and I don't think they drink on duty.

If someone is blocking the door I may wait a few minutes to see if he leaves. If he is clearly blocking me with intent to do anything to me, he will be dealt with.

 

[The Big D]

Answers below.

Be safe.

Were you armed? Yes.

Are you still an LEO? No, retired.

Does MD exempt ex LEO's from their draconian firearm laws? Carry per LEOSA. Maryland very pro-active in that regard.

Was the bar in MD? Yes.

Does MD law allow drinking while armed or even in a bar armed drinking or not? Yes, and Yes.

Was the other guy an LEO on duty or maybe undercover checking bars? Don't know either way.

Since MD has such draconian firearm laws, lots of questions. Here are the answers you requested.