Bodyguard 380: Finally Reliable!

After getting my 2nd BG repaired with the new firing pin, I just received my 3rd one back from S&W and took it apart to measure it.

I can't believe it. It has the OLD version firing pin in it! Why would S&W replace my firing pin in one gun with a new, modified design, and then when I send in the next gun, go back to the old design? If they even replaced it.

How hard is this? This is a company that doesn't appear to be run with any intelligence. Customer service, as nice and helpful as they appear to be, is also totally clueless. On the repair sheet it says they replaced the trigger bar (why, I can't imagine) but no mention of the firing pin, even though that is what I specifically requested.

For gun #2 they repaired with the modified firing pin, I can't imagine they made a one-off custom one just for me to test for them. I understand they may have old inventory sitting around they haven't depleted yet, but when they have come up with a new part design that solves a chronic problem with this gun, costing them a fortune in Fed-Ex, shop costs, and replaced guns, (not to mention squandered customer loyalty), why are they not fixing the problem once and for all with this $1 part?

David
 
Well, now I have to check my "new" firing pin. Stand by for updates.
BTW, they replaced the trigger bar on mine, also. Not sure why.
 
What I can't understand is how come so many work perfectly out of the box while others do not?
 
RV4driver:

From the symptoms you described after you got your BG back, it sure sounded like you got the old firing pin. I just couldn't believe it until I got mine back and actually measured it.

David
 
buckshotshorty said:
What I can't understand is how come so many work perfectly out of the box while others do not?
Click to expand...

I have wondered the same thing. My hypotheses are as follows:

- Most gun owners don't shoot much. My BGs never start acting up until about 30 rounds into any shooting session. So if I had only put a mag or two through in any session, I'd never experience it.

- Others happen to use ammo their BG "likes". Federal works really well most of the time for me (although with one gun I had a couple rare FTFires even with it). Winchester WB is so consistently bad in these guns that it is my go-to ammo for testing. But I don't accept ammo-finickyness as acceptable (with any brand name ammo). Win WB cases, BTW, are a several thousandths of an inch shorter than the other brands I measured, affecting headspacing.

- Many have just gotten lucky, getting one that happens to work. But I think that if the design of the firing pin is incorrect, it is only a matter of time and just the wrong conditions before it acts up. It's odd that I have had three lemons in a row, implying that the ones that work are the exception.

FWIW,

David
 
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[/QUOTE]

Just measured my recently returned FP.

OAL is 1.435, Throw is 1.094, cut to rear of FP is 3.405

The pin definitely protrudes farther than it did before. So, since it has a longer throw, and protrudes farther, but still doesn't set off primers with the factory hammer spring, but does with the Galloway spring, it must be a hammer spring issue, with MY gun. I put a spent .380 case in the barrel, put into battery to see how close the case head was to the pin, nice and close, so it's not a headspace issue. I guess, the heavy spring goes back in, and I deal with a 12lb pull. Whoopie!
I also figured out why the slide stop is so stiff, and doesn't lock the slide after the last round. There is too much play in the slide stop, allowing the tab that is supposed to be raised by the step in the follower to be over-ridden. Either that or the tab is SLIGHTLY too short. Maybe a combination of the two. The ProMag magazine that I bought (because, you know, Smith determined that a SD gun with low round mag didn't really deserve a back up), seemed to work better than the Smith mag, but still catches a bit.
And I've had two in a row that didn't work.
 
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RV4Driver:

It definitely looks like you have the "new" firing pin. Your measurements actually look like the cut is deeper than on my "new" firing pin. One or both of our measuring methods may be slightly off; I find it very difficult to measure the "throw" with a conventional caliper.

Or maybe S&W hasn't standardized its dimensions yet. (Ironic that the concept of precise interchangeable parts was a technological breakthrough first implemented on firearms around 1800, but that S&W doesn't seem to have mastered it yet!)

Whatever the case is with the firing pin, your gun appears to have other issues. Every time I think I have figured out what ails these guns, it turns out they have other problems. For a long time I thought it was because the right side of the hammer was dragging on the slide, slowing it down. I spent a lot of time working on mine, experimenting with shims, etc. Didn't make any difference.

I thought finally the new firing pin was the cure. But between the inconsistent dimensions of the firing pins, and not knowing which one you're going to get, and now you having problems apparently not related to the firing pin... it's still mysterious and discouraging.

I should shut up and just accept the gun they finally fixed, while continuing to send the third one back and forth until it, too, is fixed. But this gun and its quirks still fascinate me. I'd love to spend a day looking over the shoulder of the S&W gunsmiths and engineers as they try to figure this thing out.

Good luck with yours, and keep me posted!

David
 
I have had two BGs. The first was the original with the insight laser and then the M&P with the Crimson trace laser. The first was used when I got it and I put 150-200 rounds through it with no issues. I sold it to get the M&P version. I did not put any rounds through it before I put the Galloway trigger kit in. I had one light strike in the first 50 rounds with that kit. I have gone on to put approximately 380 rounds through it with no issues after that first one. Only problem I have been dealing with is a mag release that keeps breaking. anyone else have this issue? I think I may have finally figured it out. The mag is very sharp where is engages the plastic catch. Over time and a few mag releases it begins to cut away the plastic and eventually there is not enough plastic to keep the mag in reliably. So filed down the mag in those areas and hope this third catch from S&W survives.
 
Hi All.
I recently purchased a 380 Bodyguard with the intentions of using it for concealed carry. This weekend was the first time I had it out shooting. Here's my problem. After firing about a dozen shots it will no longer function. I pull the trigger and nothing happens. The hammer will not move. I'm wondering if anyone else has had this happen or heard of this problem.
Thanks in advance for any replies.
 
So I have been reading these threads on the BG380 for awhile hoping to find that "magic" fix for the little *******. Have an older model with the insight laser and I really want to love this thing but it continues to piss me off at times. It is truly a blast to shoot and easy to carry as I'm sure you all already know.

I can honestly say I have never had a light strike but it loves to stove pipe rounds. Been down the whole road of different ammo, clean mags etc, etc, etc. In its defense I do shoot it a lot and this stove pipe thing happens on a regular basis now.

So here is the stupid question... Has anyone used a slide lube on their 380? If so, did it make a difference?
 
db4570 said:
...I can't believe it. It has the OLD version firing pin in it! Why would S&W replace my firing pin in one gun with a new, modified design, and then when I send in the next gun, go back to the old design? If they even replaced it.

How hard is this?...
Click to expand...

David, it appears you have a lot to learn about S&W customer service. :D

I don't know how long you have been dealing with them but many of us here have experience going back four, five, or even more decades. Does the fact that you don't understand/appreciate the nature of some of the various responses you have gotten indicate you have a little less than that? :D

Just kidding you. Really, I am not trying to be difficult but it seems safe to assume S&W has some sort of problem here that is not going to be cured by something as simple as running a new batch of firing pins or they would have done that a long time ago. I could be wrong about that, and what might be going on I have no idea, but they definitely have a problem - or combination of problems.

My record is 0-2. (2 unreliable guns) There won't be a 3. S&W didn't get the job done right on this gun and I am tired of fooling around with it at the retail end. I might give them one more chance to fix gun number 2, but it isn't going to be right now.
 
Jarrett said:
So I have been reading these threads on the BG380 for awhile hoping to find that "magic" fix for the little *******. Have an older model with the insight laser and I really want to love this thing but it continues to piss me off at times. It is truly a blast to shoot and easy to carry as I'm sure you all already know.

I can honestly say I have never had a light strike but it loves to stove pipe rounds. Been down the whole road of different ammo, clean mags etc, etc, etc. In its defense I do shoot it a lot and this stove pipe thing happens on a regular basis now.

So here is the stupid question... Has anyone used a slide lube on their 380? If so, did it make a difference?
Click to expand...

For all the trouble S&W has had fixing the FTFire problems with my 3 BGs, any feeding or extraction problems have been fixed by them perfectly, the first time. So just send it to them and get it fixed once and for all.

David
 
db4570 said:
For all the trouble S&W has had fixing the FTFire problems with my 3 BGs, any feeding or extraction problems have been fixed by them perfectly, the first time. So just send it to them and get it fixed once and for all.

David
Click to expand...


And when the pistol is returned what is their explanation? Are they just polishing things up?
 
I had a long conversation today with the supervisor at S&W repair that I have had previous dealings with. I learned some very interesting things:

There is NO redesign of the firing pin. I'm sorry I gave that information.

I joked in an earlier post about how I'm sure they didn't make a custom firing pin just for me; well, it turns out that's exactly what they did. They will tweak any particular gun based on its operation and measurements. A firing pin throw that is correct for one gun might be too long for another, piercing the primer.

The technology of "interchangeable parts" has not yet been perfected by S&W.

So the firing pin is NOT some final magical cure. It might be for some guns, it might not for others. The S&W guy said there are still any number of things that could be causing FTFire with these guns.

David
 
Just a thought
Is it possible the gun has second strike
Capability because there are design issues
SW could not resolve
 
Wanted to add here that my MPBG, which I bought about 2 weeks ago, is flawless. So far it feeds any and all ammo, is accurate for a pocket pistol (fist-sized groups at 14 ft), and adding a Pachmayer grip makes it easy (almost pleasurable) to shoot. I've had 5 or six different makers ammo in it, and it fired them all. The primer dents are pretty deep with my pistol, I think if they were any deeper I might have a problem with puncturing. ONE failure to lock the slide back in the first 20 rounds, then it has all been fine with both mags. The date on the envelope containing the fired casing is 8/2015.
Not trying to diminish in any way the problems folks are having, just throwing in my experience. I say this because if I were in the market for a pocket 380 and read a forum like this, I would have serious second thoughts about the BG.
One last thought: this Bodyguard 380 replaced a *** Diamondback DB380 that could not get through an entire mag without some varied type of malfunction. The DB380 is truly, truly, worthless. My BG380 = perfect.
 
So refreshing to hear a positive on a newly purchased Bodyguard. I sincerely hope Smith figures out all the problems David and others are having with theirs! Good luck and happy shooting! - Rick ;)

Oh, and shame on me! Welcome to the forum. You will surely enjoy this one and it will definitely be one that you can contribute to!
 
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Thanks Rickgus. I hope SW gets it together, too. Maybe they have.
I've been through what David has been through, although in my case it was with a Colt Officer's Model in the mid 80's. If you recall, they were having a "working strike." My Officer's model was sent back to them, and when it returned to me it had filing marks on the slide, and the slide would not even rack backwards. Colt management stepped up and replaced my pistol with a better one for my trouble. Colt was releasing pistols with really poorly done handwork. So much for Union workers. But Colt straitened it out - my 1991A1 is also flawless and always has been.
Back on topic, I noted a suggestion that there may be design flaws in the BG380; things like "second strike functionality" is there because of a design flaw. Ridiculous. The BG operates such that it drops the firing pin on every trigger pull. To suggest that a company like Smith would release such a thing.... ugh. However, this is not to say that the employee pistolsmithing could not be improved, and that's where I think the problem is. I suggest that rather than a single round be fired for testing, run a couple of mags through it. That would likely reveal any of the light strike issues.
Any way one slices it, I think is a black eye for Smith, and they need to stay on the ball and make pistols like mine - works out of the box, every time.
I really dig my Bodyguard, and sincerely hope others will be taken care of by Smith in a speedy manner.
 
db4570 said:
I had a long conversation today with the supervisor at S&W repair that I have had previous dealings with. I learned some very interesting things:

There is NO redesign of the firing pin. I'm sorry I gave that information.

I joked in an earlier post about how I'm sure they didn't make a custom firing pin just for me; well, it turns out that's exactly what they did. They will tweak any particular gun based on its operation and measurements. A firing pin throw that is correct for one gun might be too long for another, piercing the primer.

The technology of "interchangeable parts" has not yet been perfected by S&W.

So the firing pin is NOT some final magical cure. It might be for some guns, it might not for others. The S&W guy said there are still any number of things that could be causing FTFire with these guns.

David
Click to expand...

NewBG380 - I think you hit it on the head when you said maybe individual pistolsmithing at Smith could be improved. If you read David's post it really sounds like the cure could be dependent on which gunsmith receives your returned BG. It is obvious in David's research and pics to support it, the second BG and it's problems were solved by the gunsmith trimming the firing pin back a touch to allow more throw. His expertise in making this BG an acceptable firearm surely was not shared with his fellow gunsmiths and life goes on. Smith will come right out and tell you, there is no improved firing pin out there! Each BG returned stands on it's own and successful repair is dependent on which gunsmith is selected to repair your BG. This is why some BG's function without issues and others have them! Sad as it might be!
 
richr1226 said:
I tried the Galloway firing pin and extra power hammer
spring in my Bodyguard 380 to try and cure the light
strike problem. I would still get an occasional light strike.
I will be sending this firearm back to S&W.
Click to expand...

Update;
I sent my BG 380 to S&W for repair. The paperwork indicated
that the firing pin was replaced. I fired 100 rounds of PMC ammo
through this weapon without any light strikes. The primer indents
look deeper than those with the old firing pin. I will fire at least
200 more rounds of ammo through this pistol before I will carry it
as a self defense weapon.
 
I have bought 4 BG380's over the time they were out. I would buy and use them until I decided on something a little bigger. Then I would trade them in on that something. I was lucky and never did have any problem with any of mine. What I decided was that they were not going to be reliable do to all the problems everyone else was having so after the Ruger LCP Custom came out I have never looked back. Traded my last BG380 in on the custom and it is reliable and just perfect for me. The only thing I like about the BG380 better is last shot hold open slide, but I can deal with that.
I do not like the regular LCP but the custom is great.
 
Thanks for the write-up David. I had all but given up.

I have the M&P BG 380. I am an M&P Armorer and have changed triggers on all my other M&P's, so was comfortable doing the Galloway mods and XS sights.

When I bought it the FTF was about 1 in 6 (Never a full mag without FTF), I wasn't too concerned since I was doing the Galloway short stroke trigger and tool steel firing pin. 100 rnds later and Galloway kit, better, but still FTF - I was surprised. I had to run through the state qual course with it and just double-actioned the FTF to get through the course.

Called Galloway and they blamed the ammo (so much for 100% satisfaction). So I ran a test of 12 ammos with OEM and Galloway kit (PITA) to show it wasn't the ammo - which got me to the right conclusion {pssst, it's the pistol stupid}.

Although it was a very bad customer experience with Galloway, they did point me to the root of the problem. I ordered more springs from Galloway to see if that would make a difference, it didn't. Next I tried removing the firing pin blocker thinking this was preventing the firing pin - without blocker no change in operation or FTF.

Damn, just one more step, you have discovered it is the other indentation, on the firing pin retaining pin, not the blocker.

Thank you, thank you, thank you. This is by far the most accurate and comfortable of the 380's and now I can get it up and functioning.

Since I have both OEM and Galloway firing pin I can experiment now, the only drawback is that it is a serious PITA to remove the firing pin, mod, re-install, test, remove, repeat.

With your pic I'm going for once and done mod. Will see if I can mod the firing pin as your picture indicates and get it reliable.
 
New member here, a long time follower of this forum. I have quite a few j frames and model 386sc in .357. My main interest in the S&W brand is the .380 Bodyguard. Have 3 of them, all with lasers. carry one every day in my weak side front pocket.

Have been very interested in David's experience with his BG's. He has been a real fount of information, much appreciated. I have had no problems with my BG's except with Fiocchi 90gr. XTPHP's. Many fail to fires, but on 2nd or even 3rd pull they have ignited. A little googling I have found others complain about hard primers with the Fiocchi. Also have had problem ejecting unfired rounds with a cartridge I will not name. The cartridge is a jacketed hollow point and is 20/1000" longer than the Fiocchi. So, am carrying the Federal Hydrashok and it has been very reliable. I try to use PMC for range ammo and don't remember ever having a failure to fire with it.
Have replaced all firing pins with the Galloway. I got a bad Galloway firing pin and they sent me a good one. I've had good experience with the company.

Keep my guns very clean and lube the rails and sides of hammer with TW25B, a synthetic lubricant.

S&W sent me a new Crimson Trace to replace the original laser in one gun. Well, a long rambling post but hope to be able to share information on the BG in the future and really enjoy gleaning information from other owners.

Long live hammer fired!
 
well i will add to the list of firing issues.
i just sent my bg380 back to smith for the light strikes and a couple other things. got 650 rounds through it with 7 types of ammo on 6 magazines.....
lots of light strikes, even when they go off first pull it still a light hit, hope i get lucky there first try. also had a recent problem with a couple fail to feed all the way into the chamber, mostly hp ammo, likely a ramp polish if they don't do it right my gun smith may have to. and the third is slide lock back, it misses the top of the notch by just a little. if i push it up it's all good else it autoloads, not horrible except sometimes it does not pick up the round that's a problem. sad since i own 6 other various s&w's and all work great. so now i am on the lets see list, summers over so i switch off to something larger, hope it comes back all good because i really do like the gun.
JohnP
 
My BG 380 is perfect, however, if I had all the problems you guys are having I would totally dump that gun, sell it, and buy another brand.

I said before, this is a huge black eye for SW, their brand in general and especially their customer service. If they can't fix a gun, knowing the problem, and then having the nerve to send it back to the customer with the same problems, I think that speaks volumes for the company. So if i was having an issue, I'd start looking at Ruger.

Screw brand loyalty, a backup pistol is too important for that.
 
Be careful with those Galloway firing pins. I noticed that I was getting really tiny primer indentations from them tapping the primers just a little when loading a round. I know it probably isn't enough to touch off the round, but still. A firing pin that's too long is just plain dangerous.

I'd also avoid modding the firing pin yourself. We are talking a few thousandths of an inch. And it's very hard to measure with normal calipers. Cut that notch a little too deep and you can get a pierced primer. I'm thinking that would be bad. I understand from S&W that the firing pin is not the ultimate fix. It is one thing they try, depending on how it tests when they work on it.

I took BG#3 to the range Sunday to test it, and it fired fine. No FTFires. So they fixed something besides the firing pin. But the slide failed to lock back. Dang! So, back it goes.

Send them back to S&W for repair. Here's a little secret: they usually throw a new mag in the box when they return it. So after 7 trips (with three guns) back to S&W so far, I have enough spare mags to last me a while. YMMV.

David
 
I just picked up the laser-less M&P version today , brand new , i`m really likeing the looks of it so far, the test fire date was 6/5/15 and starts off with a KCK serial #. I traded in my older laser version one for it , had over 900 rounds through that one and it`s had it`s share of issues but it was dependable for my needs , it was a KAH serial from 2013 , it liked the speer lawman cartridges and i could fire those all day and not have a problem , i also used blazer aluminum cased ammo for practice and had no issues with that either , but it would light strike off and on with no rhyme or reason. So im hopeing my new BG will be better !!
 
I got a BG about 3 weeks ago and I'll just count myself lucky but I've have NO issues with WB, or any other ammo I fed it so far (400 rounds as of today).
 
I received my BG 380 back from S&W to repair the light strikes.
Guess what, still light strikes. I ran 100 rounds of factory ammo
With 5 failures to fire.
The work order stated firing pin replaced
I am debating to return the BG for repair again or sell it
 
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