C prefix m&p 38

[GUMPOND1]

While looking in the safe for my s prefix m&p for JP@AK s survey I also found a C prefix M&P 38. Is there a difference other than the prefix letter?
This one is sn# C196636 w/ a 6 " barrel. All serial numbers match including grips. No patent dates on barrel. fixed sights. 4 line address on right side. I assume this is a later version than the S prefix. How much later?? Thanks Bill

 

[wheelgun610]

That serial # is pretty consistent with several known to have shipped in 1951. Just keep in mind that they didn't ship in serial number sequence, so it could easily have shipped at a later date....

Mark

 

[Wiregrassguy]

Yes, there is a difference between the S and C prefix M&P's. The C prefix began in 1948 and ushered in the short throw action on the M&Ps that had previously only been implemented on the K frame target guns. An easy way to tell the difference is the shape of the hammer. The top M&P S prefix snub shipped in 1948 and has the long throw action. The bottom C prefix snub shipped in July 1949 and has the short throw action, AKA the "speed hammer."

Before I get corrected, there were some S prefix M&Ps that came with the short throw action. As pretty much always with S&W there was a brief transition as the mod was implemented in the latter days before the S prefix ended. I don't know how many may have been produced but it wasn't a substantial number.

 

[Targets Guy]

As I was told by a member the tell for the short throw is that little notch just below the hammer tail.

Here it is on the K22

 

[Targets Guy]

and on a 1950 C prefix .38

 

[Targets Guy]

Yes, there is a difference between the S and C prefix M&P's. The C prefix began in 1948 and ushered in the short throw action on the M&Ps that had previously only been implemented on the K frame target guns. An easy way to tell the difference is the shape of the hammer. The top M&P S prefix snub shipped in 1948 and has the long throw action. The bottom C prefix snub shipped in July 1949 and has the short throw action, AKA the "speed hammer."

Before I get corrected, there were some S prefix M&Ps that came with the short throw action. As pretty much always with S&W there was a brief transition as the mod was implemented in the latter days before the S prefix ended. I don't know how many may have been produced but it wasn't a substantial number.

You are correct again.

From a note I took in mid Sept of this year: "The 1st short action hammer was assembled on Oct 21, 1947 s/n S924878."

I just "won" a 1947 6" M&P s/n S944xxx and it still has the long hammer action.



I still haven't heard when it shipped but it will be sometime in 1947.

 

[DWalt]

"From a note I took in mid Sept of this year: "The 1st short action hammer was assembled on Oct 21, 1947 s/n S924878.""

There are many examples of M&Ps with SNs higher than S924878 having the long action. The generally accepted SN for the start of the short action M&P with the high-speed hammer is S990184, although some M&Ps with the long action having slightly higher SNs are known.

 

[larryofcc]

While looking in the safe for my s prefix m&p for JP@AK s survey I also found a C prefix M&P 38. Is there a difference other than the prefix letter?
This one is sn# C196636 w/ a 6 " barrel. All serial numbers match including grips. No patent dates on barrel. fixed sights. 4 line address on right side. I assume this is a later version than the S prefix. How much later?? Thanks Bill

I have a NIB 5" M&P # C133451, no XXX's, shipped 3-1951. Big Larry

 

[Targets Guy]

"From a note I took in mid Sept of this year: "The 1st short action hammer was assembled on Oct 21, 1947 s/n S924878.""

There are many examples of M&Ps with SNs higher than S924878 having the long action. The generally accepted SN for the start of the short action M&P with the high-speed hammer is S990184, although some M&Ps with the long action having slightly higher SNs are known.

Thanks. I now have a new note.

It still hadn't happened to this one; S/N 976xxx.

 

[JP@AK]

From a note I took in mid Sept of this year: "The 1st short action hammer was assembled on Oct 21, 1947 s/n S924878."

That was a pre-production gun using the new "high speed" hammer. S&W's nomenclature was "high speed hammer" not the often used "speed hammer" terminology (just to be specific). See the term on a gold box - on the right hand side of the box top. This box is from a K-22, but it is the same on the M&P boxes.

The statement regarding the S924878 comes from some notes by Hellstrom and includes this item: "like K-38 but not swaged at spur."

The actual first production M&P with the short action was S990184, assembled in the Spring of 1948 , and shipped to Mesbla, Brazil. The date associated with it is April 7, 1948, but it isn't clear whether that is the assembly date or the ship date. I believe it is the latter, since some short action guns were shipping in March. The information on S990184 also comes from Hellstrom's notes.

As others have stated, there was a transition period when guns with serial numbers higher than S990184 showed up with either of the two action types. The lowest number I have so far located with the "high speed" hammer is S990806. It shipped in March, 1948. S990658 has the older long action, as does S991315.

The late S990xxx and a large portion of the S991xxx revolvers were chambered for the .32 S&W Long with the long action, so that creates a large gap in the .38 M&P production sequence (at least as measured by serial numbers). When the numbers shift back to the .38 the incidence of long action guns diminishes significantly, with the vast majority having the short action.

The highest number on a long action .38 in my database is S996765. It shipped in June, 1948.

I hope this clears up some of the questions about the switch to the short action on the M&P revolvers.

 

[JP@AK]

M&P revolver number C1 was assembled on March 22, 1948. It was the first revolver to have the C prefix (which may sound like a truism, but as many of us know, the first example of many models or model changes doesn't always have the lowest serial number).

As far as anyone has been able to determine, no C prefix gun was ever built with the older long action. From C1 on, the M&P had the short action with the high speed hammer.

I don't have a ship date for C1. Sorry.

 

[DWalt]

I logged a mention of S9985xx as having a long action, but nothing more than that.

 

[JP@AK]

I logged a mention of S9985xx as having a long action, but nothing more than that.

Yes. I believe that one is in my database (at least the first four digits match). It is a .32 Long with a 2" barrel. It went to a shop in Illinois in August, 1949. I believe all of the S prefix .32 M&P revolvers that I have identified had the long action (I would have to check to be sure) except for that one. It actually has the high speed hammer and is listed as a "fish hook" hammer.

If you want to privately give me the last two digits, we can figure out if we are talking about the same revolver.