Can anyone match or come close to the finish on a 1912 S&W?

[oldmcdonald]

The barrel on my Model of 1905 has a larger blood spot? or bleached-out spot on the barrel. The gun is otherwise nice with about 85-90% original shiny blue/black factory finish. The spot bothers me & I am wondering if anyone knows of a refinisher capable of removing & refinishing the barrel to match (or come close to matching) the rest of the gun. The barrel doesn't have any pitting, & has strong lettering.
Thanks for your suggestions.

 

[gmborkovic]

Mr. oldmac, simple answer, no!. Wait till time travel is perfected, and travel back in time. Dont frustrate yourself. Just buy a perfect 1905 and be happy.

 

[mikepriwer]

Most, if not all, refinishers can remove a barrel. Even I can remove a barrel! Most, if not all, refinishers will weaken any roll markings, in an attempt to make the surface true, or take out pitting, dents, dings, etc.

If it were me, I would try Brownell's Oxpho cold blue on a warm barrel, after rubbing the surface with 0000 steel wool. Generally it will not affect or change any already-blued area. Try to confine the work to the area where the blue is missing. When it's about where you want it, do one more coat, including about a 5 - 10% larger area, to make it blend better.

Mike Priwer

 

[mrcvs]

Let's start with photographs of the entire firearm and the blemish. Sometimes less is more.

 

[Inland7-45]

I would leave it the way it is and enjoy it for what it is the way it is. There really is no way to bring the original perfection back . In most cases attempts to correct issues like this will just attract more attention to the flaw.

I remember a very nice 1930s Colt Govt model in .38 Super that still had the original box. The gun was just about perfect except for two spots on the left side of the slide. The flaws consisted of some shallow pits about an 1/8 " in diameter. There were silver circles around each pit that were made when someone tried to clean up the flaw. I saw this gun at a show where the owner was asking a Colt collector to appraise the gun. The collector quoted a price and told the owner that the gun would have been worth more if left alone.

I have a few older guns that are otherwise nice except for a few flaws. I am glad that the previous owner left them as is.

 

[Catwrangler]

To the OP- I respect that you're an "old head" on the forum, but even most other collectors would overlook a wart or two on an 111 y.o. revolver. Even a sock drawer gun that has never been holstered and rarely fired will have small issues. Granted I'm an accumulator and shoot what I own. My limited group represent J, K and L frames are models that spoke to me. Do they have slight turn lines, slight muzzle wear and signs of use, yes; but this won't keep me up at night. You'd turn up your nose at most of my little group, but each and every one is MY gun and value comes with that.

 

[Bullet Bob]

Turnbull's shop can, but they charge what their work is worth.

 

[Rpg]

Turnbull certainly could do the work.

However, I understood he'd stopped working on Smiths some years ago.

 

[2152hq]

1912 mfg should be right about in the transition betw the use of Charcoal Blue and the (then) new American Gas Furnace Blue (Carbona Blue).

There is a slight difference in appearance.
Plus after a century of exposure to the atmosphere of many types of chemicals, oils and light, wipe downs, etc.. what was the new look then and what the new finish will look like now are usually 2 different colors or shades however slight. An exact match of a new blue to the existing color is a tough thing to do especially with such a high gloss polish. The fact that it's defined area within otherwise nice original polish and blue doesn't help trying to restore it.

Matching in a missing piece or won area in this type of bluing is difficult.
Not that it can't and hasn't been done.
The worn area must be polished to the same degree and direction of the metal that exists under the orig bluing around it. Not higher gloss and not less.

No be honest, sometimes Hot Salt Blue is used to repair this type of damage and it works quite well.
Either way the 'smith will be rebluing the already nicely original blued surfaces with what ever way they use and in the process attempting to bring the damaged and now polished 'in the white' area back up to match it in color.

You should call DT and ask them. You never know what the response will be.
Working on entire restorations of S&W DA revolver has never been one of their desires even when I worked there in the early 90's. I can't remember even doing up even one there.
They took too much time to polish and didn't turn enough profit $$. Simple as that.

A one part restoration like this bbl may be seen differently. Try them and see.
Worth a call.

There were a couple other shops that were doing the same type of bluing and restoration work but I won't recommend them anymore, nor bother to name them. They seem to have changed ownership or have otherwise let their skilled 'smith's leave.
Some others that advertise the work just turn around and send it to DTR so you pay a middleman extra charge for nothing.
Same with case color hardening, though there are quite a few around now that have figured out what was the magic of it all and are doing great work in that area.

 

[Wiregrassguy]

oldmc, you might want to take a look at the [ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LNrX9LFzjUU"]Blue Wonder Gun Blue [/ame]videos on youtube. While you are there, check out [ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_nWVI_3Lo0Q"]Mark Novak's videos[/ame] on conserving vintage firearms.

 

[rct269]

Most, if not all, refinishers can remove a barrel. Even I can remove a barrel! Most, if not all, refinishers will weaken any roll markings, in an attempt to make the surface true, or take out pitting, dents, dings, etc.

If it were me, I would try Brownell's Oxpho cold blue on a warm barrel, after rubbing the surface with 0000 steel wool. Generally it will not affect or change any already-blued area. Try to confine the work to the area where the blue is missing. When it's about where you want it, do one more coat, including about a 5 - 10% larger area, to make it blend better.

Mike Priwer

What he said! Done with CARE, you will be amazed with the results. I say this as an observer. The closest I've come is the same only different. I relate it here only to demonstrate the FACT it can be done.


Once upon a time, June '59, I bought one of those post-war/pre-war .32 Regulation Police Targets (1 of 196 produced at the behest of Herbie Harris, a Chicago S&W distributor----from Herbie Harris---brand new in the box---$135.) I didn't even open the box to look at it---should'a known better, right?!! Well this purchase was made after driving 600 miles out of our way with my new bride---on our honeymoon---her introduction to the world of lunatic fringe gun collectors--and I was disinclined to push my luck any further---get in, get out; and get on the way!!

Time passes, and I open the box, and unwrap the gun. There's a sliver of "in the white" metal adjacent to the sight channel---pretty much full length of the sight tang--no more than 1/16" wide at the widest point. Here's where "the same only different" comes in: I used a Birchwood Casey touch-up pen. I followed the instructions. I ended up with a PERFECT MATCH after multiple applications----FOLLOWING THE INSTRUCTIONS EACH AND EVERY TIME!!

PERFECT MATCH translates to the gun was sold 30 or so years later for $2,000 after a lengthy and painstaking examination by the buyer. Was I proud of my subterfuge? No, but I was impressed with the results. And now, some 60 some-odd years after we left Herbie's store, I'm still impressed enough to tell this tale.

As an addendum, Turnbull most certainly could do this deed with your gun---but they won't. This I know from a face to face episode with the Turnbull folks maybe 20 some-odd years ago, but that's a tale for another time---if anybody's interested.

Ralph Tremaine

 

[Rpg]

I'd love to hear that story. ^^^^^^^^?

 

[rct269]

I'd love to hear that story. ^^^^^^^^?

So shall it be--------------------------

But first-------------------

Yes, Turnbull quit fooling with S&W's years ago. The reason is he's in business to make money, and the more the merrier! There are a whole bunch of other guns for Turnbull to restore/refinish which are a damn sight easier/quicker to do than S&W's, because of their many varied surfaces---which goes to explain why S&W has/had(?) about a gazillion different hard polishing wheels---each one for a specific surface on a specific gun---which is how/why they did such a great finishing job. There are some pictures of these wheels hanging on a wall in the 1954 Gun Digest article "From Raw Steel To Smith & Wesson"----and there's A BUNCH (but no where near all of them)!!

Okay---the Turnbull tale:

By way of introduction, I raced sports cars from 1962 through 1973---a "Weekend Warrior". From 1974 on I continued in that activity, but turning wrenches instead of steering wheels for friends with similar afflictions. One such friend and I are heading for Watkins Glen for a race weekend upcoming. Watkins Glen is in upstate New York---as is Turnbull.

In the beginning of this tale, the Boss Lady and I are at a gun show at the Nashville Fairgrounds. Now the only reason the Boss Lady is at a gun show is because there's an antique show in an adjoining building at the same time---and needless to say, I'm obliged to do the antique show with her---call it "togetherness".

Here's a .44 H.E. 4th Target. The only thing wrong with it besides the Satin Blue finish is it's absolutely slathered with oil----which I deemed to be camouflage. We go on and do the rest of the show---and come back to this .44----'cause Satin Blue or not, I need one----and with God's help I'll come across one in Bright Blue sometime before I die.

"Do you have anything I can use to remove this oil?" The man produces a roll of paper towels. (He's obviously prepared to deal with such nit-pickers as myself.) I began to wipe. The Boss Lady begins to talk: "C'mon!! Let's GO!!"

The price of the .44 is not bad, and comparing that price with the wrath of the Boss Lady is NO contest!! I buy the still mostly covered with oil .44, and off we go.

The oil's now gone, and a turn ring resembling the Grand Canyon of The Colorado remains. I call Turnbull's: "Can you refinish a Satin Blue S&W cylinder to match the rest of the gun?" "Yes."

Back to the racing business: I tell my friend/owner/driver of the race team we need to make a side trip while we're in at Watkins Glen---50 miles or so down the road. No problem!

We arrive at Turnbull's. BLAH-BLAH-BLAH refinish this cylinder to match the gun. "Who told you that?" (That we could) "I don't know." "Well, I'm in charge of the bluing, and I'm telling you we can't!" He continues: "Bluing is a living thing---it reacts to its environment. We can refinish that cylinder, and will be exactly as it was when it left the factory 50 years ago, but it won't match the rest of the gun as it is now." (which is as good as it was when new---but 50 years older) He continues: "Now we can do that cylinder 50 times, altering the several variables in the process as we go, and we MIGHT get a match to the gun as it is now twice! How do you like those odds?!!" I allowed as how I didn't like them much at all, and we went back to the racing business. We were pretty good at that---winning the national championship three years in a row!!

The end of this tale is I sent the gun back to the factory. They refinished the whole gun in Bright Blue. It was a thing of beauty---absolutely flawless, and cost next to nothing.

The after story has been told before, but I'll tell it again. I sold the gun as it was (with the funky cylinder) with the proviso I'd have it refinished in Bright Blue---and the buyer told me to ask that no service/refinishing marks be applied to the gun. I told him I'd ask, but was pretty sure they would not comply with my request. Well they DID comply with my request (with no comment/argument whatsoever), and back it came---completely refinished---absolutely flawless---and NO markings. I'd sold the gun for $1,000. It'd cost $850. The factory refinish cost lunch money. The buyer resold the gun as an original bright blue for $4,000.

Some folks got it, and some folks ain't got it!-------and let the buyer beware!!

Ralph Tremaine

 

[outta_ammo]

Most, if not all, refinishers can remove a barrel. Even I can remove a barrel! Most, if not all, refinishers will weaken any roll markings, in an attempt to make the surface true, or take out pitting, dents, dings, etc.

If it were me, I would try Brownell's Oxpho cold blue on a warm barrel, after rubbing the surface with 0000 steel wool. Generally it will not affect or change any already-blued area. Try to confine the work to the area where the blue is missing. When it's about where you want it, do one more coat, including about a 5 - 10% larger area, to make it blend better.

Mike Priwer

Another vote for Oxpho Blue