Carrying W/Empty Chamber

[Erich]

whatever that is

"Observe, Orient, Decide and Act"

 

[WC145]

Originally posted by Erich:

whatever that is

"Observe, Orient, Decide and Act"

Thank you, Erich. I understand the concept, never heard the acronym. In reading up on it a bit I see it is military jargon. Who started using it in relation to martial arts/self defense?

 

[Double-O-Dave]

I'm not Erich, but Google the "OODA loop" and you'll get a good education. It was invented by Col. Boyd, USAF a real eccentric, and a genius to boot. The Air Force brass hated him, the Marines loved him and honored and revered him. I teach conflict management and mediation and this is one of the first things on the syllabus.

Regards,

Dave

 

[WC145]

Originally posted by Double-O-Dave:
I'm not Erich, but Google the "OODA loop" and you'll get a good education. It was invented by Col. Boyd, USAF a real eccentric, and a genius to boot. The Air Force brass hated him, the Marines loved him and honored and revered him. I teach conflict management and mediation and this is one of the first things on the syllabus.

Regards,

Dave

Thanks. I did do some reading on the subject and I see that Col. Boyd took the natural, human decision making process, conceptualized it and created a lesson plan and the rest of the world took off with it. I don't know how I've missed the term since it looks like everyone from real estate agents to politicians is tossing it around. I was taught and, in turn, teach the same idea without the acronym. I guess it's another one of those things that was always around but didn't get much attention until it was given a name.

 

[230therapy]

I understood your statement and your reasoning, your idea (without the OODA loop reference) is a boxing strategy that's been around forever - stick and move. My point was that in a self defense situation you capitalize on that moment and your position of advantage by staying close and maintaining the bridge. That allows you to control the opponent (to some degree) and to know by feel how it is that they are trying to move or retaliate. You do everything you can to overwhelm them and end the fight or create an opportunity to go to your gun.

To hit and move, hit and move, and so on, can work great in the ring and wear your opponent down for a finishing blow or move. But on the street anything you do that drags out the fight any longer than necessary is just more time for something to go wrong and it only takes one hit to turn a fight around and for you to find yourself losing.

Also, don't believe that your blow is guaranteed to disrupt his "OODA loop", whatever that is. I've hit plenty of people with good hard shots only to have them shake it off or not even notice. When you start believing that what you have is going to work the first time, every time, you can start expecting your first good ass whoopin' because it won't be long before someone comes along and debunks your theory.

We are talking about the same thing.

RE: theory on OODA loop reset

Not talking about about punches (except in extreme circumstances, but that's an exception); I'm talking about serious lethal damage such as bullets penetrating the body.

 

[G-ManBart]

Originally posted by TwoGunsStanding:
Regarding logic (one man's logic is another man's insanity - ever watch a debate? Both sides are logical). If speed and readiness were all that we were concerned with, police departments would NEVER require security holsters. A high security holster translates into a slower draw. If vital seconds can and ARE sacrificed at the officer's expense due to policy, a CCW carrier should have the OPTION to choose how they carry. That's what makes it a free country!

Most of the companies that sell Level II and III holsters suggest a recommended number of minimum draws in training before carrying the holster for real. They then suggest a certain number or reps per day/week for a certain period to ensure the new draw motion is fully ingrained. The difference between a Level I and a Level III holster might be a tenth of second or so...something like that. Without training it would be different, but that would be a bad idea.

Just spent four days going through a recert class and they went over some recent statistics. 3yds, 3 seconds and 3 rounds is the typical engagement....I'd hate to waste any of that time with a holster I wasn't trained on! R,

 

[TwoGunsStanding]

Big Foot & rj8806. I just put you guys on my permanent reading list. You both seem to be able to think and comment without getting overemotional. Thanks for the support.