Coach: Why am I Shooting Low and Right? (Lefty)

[Rastoff]

I especially love the addendum to rule #4, about someone walking between you and the target. Even though I practice it, I'm going to start pointing it out when officiating at the range events.

Me too. That's why I say it that way.

I'm also an NRA R.S.O. and a Certified Pistol and Shotgun instructor. The NRA teaches:
1. Always keep the muzzle pointed in a safe direction.
2. Always keep your finger off the trigger until ready to shoot.
3. Always keep the gun unloaded until ready to use.

Those are great, but can be a little ambiguous.
What is a safe direction? Up? Down? Down range?
When are you ready to shoot? If I'm at the ready, am I ready to shoot?
When is the gun ready to use? I was at the Trap range and saw a guy at the trunk of his car getting his shotgun out. He was thumbing rounds into the magazine. When I asked him about it, he said that he was "ready to shoot" so he was loading his gun. It never dawned on him, until I said something, to wait until he was at the line to load.

So, I teach the 3 NRA rules in my class, but I also add the 4 rules I stated above. I find they are less ambiguous. Are they perfect? No. But they are good.

 

[ginzo]

I'm a tight wad, I use a dime!!! Works for me.

There were several mentions of using an empty cartridge on the slide to control excessive movement when dry firing. I have always been told to use a coin for this technique as it does not block the sights and has a low center of gravity.

Just my 2 bits worth (pun intended)

 

[Rastoff]

In all seriousness, the coin is too stable. A penny or dime is just too easy to keep on the gun. It won't show the minor movements that will throw your shot off by a few inches.

 

[ginzo]

Cool, so did I see somewhere in the post to use an empty casing? I can't find it? Or what is a better solution than a coin? I'm always up for improvement.

In all seriousness, the coin is too stable. A penny or dime is just too easy to keep on the gun. It won't show the minor movements that will throw your shot off by a few inches.

 

[Rastoff]

You can put an empty casing on your slide. The idea is to keep it there while pressing the trigger. The drawback is that you can't see the front sight while doing this. Thus, you can practice your trigger press with this technique, but not Sight Alignment, Sight Picture and Trigger Control all at the same time.

This is where the wall drill helps.

 

[raggededge]

I also shoot left handed and had a similar problem, for me the extra tightening of my grip moved the sights low and to the right.Try gripping hard and then relaxing a bit before before pulling the trigger.l I know it may sound silly but try shooting with your right hand possibly while sitting and see where your grouping is. This should prove to you that it isn't the sights. The other suggestions posted seem right on the mark.

 

[ginzo]

Thank you Sir, Much appreciated. I was using the dime on the front site, not the slide but I like the 22lr idea better, seems to be more precise. I do pretty well with sight alignment, sight picture etc... Maybe after some time, I can put that 22lr on the site instead of the slide, then I can work on all 3. Have passed your knowledge on to some friends who are anxious to learn better technique. (may owe you a royalty)?

You can put an empty casing on your slide. The idea is to keep it there while pressing the trigger. The drawback is that you can't see the front sight while doing this. Thus, you can practice your trigger press with this technique, but not Sight Alignment, Sight Picture and Trigger Control all at the same time.

This is where the wall drill helps.

 

[Rastoff]

(may owe you a royalty)?

I like Cherry Coke.

 

[tbc]

Lots of good advice here.

I am going to add my two cents on the low left groupings (or low right for lefties). Hope it helps.

My first suggestion is to find a good instructor in your local area. You will notice a significant difference when he coaches you one on one.

My other suggestion is to watch this video and apply Jeff Cooper's technique of a surprised break.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sKgAkwB8WRo

I applied it and here are the results with my M&P9 full size:

My low left group when I did not apply a surprised break at 7 yards

My groups when I applied a surprised break at the same distance:

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 2

 

[moosedog]

I'll jump in late here if it's ok.
Your groups are tight. That's good, but their off target slightly.
That might indicate your sight picture may be off. Are you by chance cross eye dominant? That is, shooting with your left hand and your right eye is the dominant one? You didn't say if your shooting with both eyes open or which eye.
Also, your vision may be changing. Are the sites sharp and the target blurred? Thats the way it should be. Your eyes can't focus on both target and sites and have both sharp at the same time. The front site is most important. I'd take a look at that.
Your stance needs work. You are all hunched up while shooting. If you want to be constistant, you need to stand erect and bring the gun up to your eyes, not bring your head down to the gun to meet it. When you bring the gun up, do it just as if you were pointing with your finger at the target except the gun is an extension of your finger. (We can point naturally at an early age without even thinking about it.) And have you weak hand meet up with the gun in front of your face.
You can never consistantly hunch your shoulders or duck your head the exact same each time. Give that a try. Good luck.

 

[Llando88]

Moosedog - thanks for the tips.

I'm left-eye dominant, have confirmed several times.

I do see sharp front site, and blurry target and rear site. For some reason, at this point I can't resolve having both eyes open, so for now, I shoot with my right eye closed.

I'll definitely try to not hunch over next trip to the range.

Thanks again.

 

[turnanewleaf]

Dry fire every night for 10 min. Watch and make sure sights dont move. You may need to reposition your trigger finger to ensure the sights don't move. Dry fire is the key. Next month you won't have any problem.

 

[ginzo]

Thank you sir, does this make us even? LOL.

I like Cherry Coke.

 

[Danno_man]

VIDEO0030.mp4 - YouTube

VIDEO0031.mp4 - YouTube

 

[Llando88]

Hi Coach.

First trip to the range today in about a month. I've been on a project in Abilene Tx until last Saturday.

Today I shot Federal 115 gr FMJ in the same M&P FS rental pistol I've been using. I shot 50 rounds at 7 yards in five shot groups, as usual.

So, I adjusted my stance to a more natural, relaxed posture, as many of you suggested. I was rewarded with groups that covered the point of aim a LOT better.

See picture 1 and picture 2.

Feel like I'm making good progress, thanks to all, especially Rastoff, for the pointers and tips.

Rich

 

[Rastoff]

I like that stance much better. You look much more relaxed.

The target looks better, but what are the holes in the 9 ring? Are you "stringing" your shots? Are you getting the surprise break? Are you trying to get the compressed surprise break?

 

[Llando88]

I like that stance much better. You look much more relaxed.

The target looks better, but what are the holes in the 9 ring? Are you "stringing" your shots? Are you getting the surprise break? Are you trying to get the compressed surprise break?

Ah, that.

Those rounds would be from Mrs. Llando88, who was shooting the other box of 50 alternately with me. However, being a sensible husband, I shall make no comment on her groups.

 

[W.E.G.]

I worried about my shots consistently hitting low left when shooting the Glock with fixed sights.

Until I got a sight-tool.

I adjusted the sights, and the problem magically went away.

 

[Llando88]

Just wanted to add a few other points, in case they are useful to other noobs.

I tried the Vee test, as suggested by Scooter123. I was slightly sidesaddle, AND I discovered I needed to move my finger out in order to press the trigger using the middle of the finger pad. Felt quite odd at first, but after a while I felt it enabled me to press straight back easier.

I also made sure that I was gripping front to back with my left (shooting) hand and left/right with my right (support) hand. My thumbs were aligned, but for the first time, really were't involved in my grip.

I also fitted the pistol high up in the web of my hand, and realllllyyyy tried to focus on the front sight, presssssss the trigger and wait for the shot. The sight was waving all over the place BUT I was really pleased that, even though maybe I don't have the smallest groups on the planet, all of them were more or less centered on the target and not low and right.

 

[Rastoff]

Ah yes, the missus. We'll leave that alone.

Now, try speeding up a little.