Do you ever wonder if Gun Control Advocates lurk or even sign up on Gun Forums?

Same old..., you absolutely, positively cannot fix, regulate or legislate stupidity. When you try all you do is place the burden on those that are not stupid. As Cesare Beccaria wrote in "On Crimes and Punishments" (1764) - "False is the idea of utility that sacrifices a thousand real advantages for one imaginary or trifling inconvenience; that would take fire from men because it burns, and water because one may drown in it; that has no remedy for evils, except destruction. The laws that forbid the carrying of arms are laws of such a nature. They disarm those only who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes. Can it be supposed that those who have the courage to violate the most sacred laws of humanity, the most important of the code, will respect the less important and arbitrary ones, which can be violated with ease and impunity, and which, if strictly obeyed, would put an end to personal liberty and subject innocent persons to all the vexations that the guilty alone ought to suffer?" John Adams and Thomas Jefferson thought highly of his papers and writings.

Point being, be very careful what you wish for, you may very well get it, and more. You might not like the outcome...
 
It is a dangerous fantasy to think criminals obey our laws, and more dangerous when the people in power use that fantasy to disarm honest men and women. Sometimes your freedom is not taken away at gunpoint, but instead it’s done one piece of paper at a time, one seemingly meaningless rule at a time. The firearms of the time were flintlock, smoothbore muskets often referred to as primitive arms in today’s world. However, these muskets were high technology in their time, representing the best the industry had to offer. The authors of the constitution intended the people to have access to the same equipment and readiness as the government to defend their own rights and those of their fellow citizens. The leaders of the new country wanted the citizenry to have ownership of the same tools as a standing army. Weapons of war in civilian hands are literally the entire point of the 2nd amendment. The actions by gun control groups, Democratic lawmakers shaming companies for not doing their gun control bidding and the ATF overreaching its authority on the pistol brace Final Rule are a pattern. It shows the goal is not to hold criminals accountable. It’s about controlling law-abiding Americans.

It is a dangerous fantasy to think criminals obey our laws, and more dangerous when the people in power use that fantasy to disarm honest men and women. Sometimes your freedom is not taken away at gunpoint, but instead it’s done one piece of paper at a time, one seemingly meaningless rule at a time. The firearms of the time were flintlock, smoothbore muskets often referred to as primitive arms in today’s world. However, these muskets were high technology in their time, representing the best the industry had to offer. The authors of the constitution intended the people to have access to the same equipment and readiness as the government to defend their own rights and those of their fellow citizens. The leaders of the new country wanted the citizenry to have ownership of the same tools as a standing army. Weapons of war in civilian hands are literally the entire point of the 2nd amendment. The actions by gun control groups, Democratic lawmakers shaming companies for not doing their gun control bidding and the ATF overreaching its authority on the pistol brace Final Rule are a pattern. It shows the goal is not to hold criminals accountable. It’s about controlling law-abiding Americans.
By the late 18th century the firearms of the time included revolvers, other repeaters, and even fully automatic, detachable magazine fed, arms. In fact, the Continental Congress ordered 100 such weapons. And, to think that the founders couldn't conceive of further development of firearms is preposterous.

From Joseph Belton's 3rd letter to Congress, June 14, 1777:

"Sir, Please to inform the Honourable Congress, that as I have heretofore asserted to them, that I can discharge sixteen, or twenty balls from one piece, one charging, by once puling tricker..."




 
The Stats on mass murder are available to anyone and "are not" cooked just because you wish they were. Australia never again had a mass murder of 50 people after the gun ban was passed. Yes they have had more than one person killed at a time by sick people but not on the scale that was previously seen. I do think Australia went overboard on some of their gun control that was passed in the panic of the moment but to have done nothing would have been far worse.

I might add the mass murder that was committed in Norway where 85 people were killed in 2011 resulted in some very Strict gun control being past and since then they have not had the mass murder that we have on almost a weekly basis.

Gun control can be tricky. What should be accomplished without taking away people's rights is keeping guns out of the hands of mentally ill people and criminals and this is never going to be accomplished when anyone in the U.S. can buy all the second hand guns they want without being vetted first.
Always half fake and full fake news that people believe. Most ‘mass murders’ in the USA are gang bangers killing each other…who were released from jail because some feel good politician or judge heard the pink say he’s sorry and won’t do it again. And then he does.
 
Have we really gotten to the point where being able to spell and write coherent sentences is so unusual that it seems suspicious?

Heckfire, I ain't sayin' thet they ain't no AI her nowheres but it aint like nun of us finishd skool or nuthin.

...and I'm sure there are AI engines specifically programmed to drop the occasional mispelling or other mistakes to seem genuine.

Fears of AI are just paranoina, there's nothing

no 1773 44 dhjksdg skjbwet ooioisdoij 9823455 run:script error propaganda protocol 7248

to fear from technology!
"He don't know talkin' good like me and you."
--Rocket the Raccoon
 
The Stats on mass murder are available to anyone and "are not" cooked just because you wish they were...
The stats are indeed 'cooked' by ridiculous definitions of what constitutes a mass shooting. Much like years ago the stats on 'children' being shot were cooked by stretching the definition of 'children' to include anyone 23 years old or younger and including those in the military.
How many times do people have to witness the media and politicians get caught lying before they start questioning everything? "No new taxes," "You can keep your doctor," "We don't know where the virus came from," "He's sharp as a tack," "Mostly peaceful protests,"...
Never forget, the largest mass murders in human history have been carried out by governments and, "It can never happen here," is not only wrong - it is often dead wrong.
 
Always half fake and full fake news that people believe. Most ‘mass murders’ in the USA are gang bangers killing each other…who were released from jail because some feel good politician or judge heard the pink say he’s sorry and won’t do it again. And then he does.
Actually according to the FBI Stats 54.3 % of people murdered are killed by people who knew each other and a large percentage of those are women killed by their boyfriends or husbands. That is exactly why Red Flag laws were passed in many States.


And if we look at your statement about criminals who were imprisoned for murder that is what I would call "after the fact" which simply means that putting the murderers in prison does not bring the dead back to life.

Rather preventing criminals from getting guns in the first place would have saved the majority of those that were murdered. Only severe and thorough vetting before the purchase of a weapon along with registration has proven effective in keeping criminals from getting guns.

Here is a "German incident" from last year about how gun control often works more of the time than it fails. A Nut Case was refused purchase of a handgun and rifle but he attempted to make his own. He attacked a Jewish Synagogue and the people saw him coming with the home made pistol in his hand. The nut case shot the gun but it misfired as his home made zip gun was not of the best quality. The German Police were on the scene in minutes and nabbed him. Again vetting prevented this nut from getting a lot of firepower that could have resulted in him wiping out the entire church crowd in seconds much as Dillan Roof did in the U.S. several years ago. He was a nutcase that should never have been permitted to own a weapon.

No system is perfect but to have "no system" as we currently have at the Federal Level is pure insanity as once a newly purchased gun is re-sold in most states it becomes lost to vetting and many find their way into the hands of criminals and psycho's.

As a matter of fact Law Enforcement has found that there is an "Iron Highway" of unregistered weapons that is in constant flow from Southern States with lax gun laws into Northern Big Cities that have tough laws which renders their gun control totally useless. Again pure insanity.

About 2 years ago in London (The London Bridge Incident) a group of nutcases wanted to commit mass murder but the British Vetting System flagged them and refused them even the purchase of a shotgun. The Nut Cases then attacked a bar full of people with knives and the bar patrons then attacked the Nut Cases with broken beer bottles and chairs and beat the "H" out of them. Again the British Vetting system worked and worked well.

As one can see gun control does work more of the time than it fails but people do not want to be inconvenienced with paperwork and they think "It will never happen to me anyway" so why should I support gun laws. Famous last words.

People will then scream that registration leads to confiscation but they ignore the fact that Europe is still awash in guns and you can still buy guns in Australia, New Zealand, Japan, Korea, Thailand and the list is endless. I had a buddy who had a penpal female in Thailand (if I remember correctly the Asian country) and he and I were both shocked out of our shoes when she sent him pictures of her "brand new" machine guns she purchased and yes they were registered. Now even we Americans are not allowed to buy brand new machine guns but they are and again they are all registered and quite legal.

I think too that people who go paranoid over registration fail to realize that the U.S. could outlaw a certain class of weapons even without registration because once a certain type of weapon is outlawed you could never use it in self defense, never take it to a public range to shoot it or take the risk of selling it and then getting caught and going to prison. In short a newly prohibited weapon owned by a law abiding citizen becomes totally useless to him even if it was before never registered.
 
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And the thing is, most liberals don’t actually want to get rid of carry pistols, rifles or hunting or even defensive shooting. A growing number of us understand that firearms are a tool to guarantee freedom and protect ourselves from the more…reactionary and violent elements of our society; we’re burning the zealots out of our political processes pretty thoroughly and we’re expanding our reach in the 2A community and in minority communities. But there’s nuance here- what is the social benefit of a seven-shot 1911 vs a 60-round AR15 pistol, what sporting or defensive or military uses are there for it, as balanced against the potential for misuse? The alternative is tight controls on who can possess firearms, which runs afoul of the 2nd Amendment and self-preservation- as we can see in real time, allowing government to determine **who** can own guns is subject to whomever’s in government.

So then, we’re left with hardware restrictions, knowing that it won’t prevent crime (an impossible task), it won’t really decrease the intensity or frequency of routine crimes committed (a BB gun, well-polished wooden blank, or a real gun are all useful for intimidating, etc) and there will still be shootings and gun violence…but there’s far fewer **mass shootings** than before. And that saves hundreds of lives.
 
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I'll just point out that Mexico has some of the most restrictive gun laws in the world, one single gun store, months of red tape to legally own one of the few types of "legal" firearms allowed, Yet the country is totally awash in firearms and violent people committing crimes with said firearms.

Spare us the "and they come from the US" nonsense. Even if that were true, the US isn't the only place on Planet Earth to acquire firearms.

Criminals don't and won't obey laws. Restrictions on law abiding people have no effect on criminals, as proven by Mexico (other than making law abiding people easier targets).

Get over it. Move on.
 
And the thing is, most liberals...A growing number of us understand... we’re burning the zealots out of our political processes pretty thoroughly and we’re expanding our reach in the 2A community
This guys on a mission, in case anyone hasn't figured it out yet. Along with a couple others. And guess who the zealots are that he is trying to burn out? And when will they be taught about political commentary here?
 
Mexico's cartels are almost exclusively armed with US weapons. Mexico treats gun smugglers much more harshly than we treat drug smugglers, and we do almost nothing to stop guns (or anything else) from going south.

U.S. gun manufacturers make up seven out of the top 10 companies whose guns are most frequently seized by the Mexican military. Colt Manufacturing, based in Hartford, Connecticut, led the list, with more than 8,500 firearms — 6.8 percent of all guns recovered in Mexico over the 10-year span. Winchester Repeating Arms, based in New Haven, Connecticut, followed in second place with over 4,000 weapons recovered. Major gunmakers including Smith & Wesson, Remington, Ruger, and Browning, also appear in the top 10.

mexico-bar-logo-1.png

Champe Barton
 
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This guys on a mission, in case anyone hasn't figured it out yet. Along with a couple others. And guess who the zealots are that he is trying to burn out? And when will they be taught about political commentary here?
Yeah, “a mission”. A mission to be a responsible, well-educated gun owner and to foster the 2A in my family so my grandkid’s grandkids can one day enjoy it the same way my great-grandparents and I did.
 
my grandkid’s grandkids can one day enjoy it the same way my great-grandparents and I did.
Well, we're going to need to repeal a heck of a lot of gun control foolishness to get back to great granddad's day. I, for one, look forward to picking up a gun and box of shells at the hardware store. Welcome to the real fight.
 
Well, we're going to need to repeal a heck of a lot of gun control foolishness to get back to great granddad's day. I, for one, look forward to picking up a gun and box of shells at the hardware store. Welcome to the real fight.
Careful...you risk becoming a burned-out zealot.
 
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