Firing pin hole - Is this something to worry about?

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Hfrog355

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5" Gen 1 Pro Series in 9mm. Hard to say how many rounds are on it, but it's a decent amount. 7k? Gun has never given me issues and I really like it. I generally shoot 124gr ammo, but am not picky about who makes it. Always brass cased. Rarely, if ever +P.

Well, I got 2 failure to ignites at a match today. It was in the middle of stages, so I didn't get to inspect the rounds to see what the primer looked like. It's worth noting that I was short ammo for the match and had to buy a box (Norma 115gr), from a participant. It was factory new though, so I wouldn't have guessed it would have caused an issue. Anyway, after the match, I was inspecting the gun and noticed this:

htuzrD4l.jpg


I had never noticed that chip around the firing pin hole before. For all I know, it happened today. Is this something to be concerned about? I assume it's not good, per se, but is this going to cause further issues?

Thoughts?
 
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That is normal. Mine are all the same way. I believe it's designed that way to help with primer drag. I can't recall the exact purpose atm.
Either way, nothing to worry about.
 
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I've had one or two out of each box of Winchester 124 grain NATO that failed to ignite, everything else I've shot through my 5 inch has gone off fine.
I assumed the NATO ammo has harder primers. Norma might be the same.

I had an ignition problem with some .45 Colt handloads this spring in my Flattop Convertible SA, loads were with Winchester primers.
I went to a heavier hammer spring, swapped out hammers, and still couldn't figure it out. When I held the trigger in and lowered the hammer, the FP appeared to have normal protrusion into the frame.

I didn't suspect the primers might be too hard at first.
All of the loads that failed to go of in the revolver ignited fine in my Rossi lever carbine, so I switched to Federal primers in my handgun loads, problem solved.
 
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I suspect that after that many rounds, your striker channel may be gummed up from lube and powder residue that has found it's way in there.
Pull the back plate off and inspect and clean the channel and the striker. If you find it full of gunk, that will be the problem.

If it's clean and clear, you might just need a new striker spring.
 
Your gun is super dirty. Do you clean it regularly? It's possible that you have some dirt built up in the striker chamber and that could be causing issues. Also, with 7K rounds through the gun, it's probably time for a spring refresh.

The firing pin hole has a couple scratches on the side opposite the ejection port, but otherwise looks OK. The big divot at the bottom is normal and it came from the factory that way.
 
Rastoff said:
Your gun is super dirty. Do you clean it regularly? It's possible that you have some dirt built up in the striker chamber and that could be causing issues. Also, with 7K rounds through the gun, it's probably time for a spring refresh.

The firing pin hole has a couple scratches on the side opposite the ejection port, but otherwise looks OK. The big divot at the bottom is normal and it came from the factory that way.
Click to expand...

Yes it is. Eh, sometimes. This is a gun that only gets used for games, so I don't lose a lot of sleep about cleaning it. Like I said, it has been extremely reliable, so when it choked, it caught my attention.

I did think to check the firing pin assembly and channel. They were a little dirty, but not bad. Gave everything a wipe down. I have never replaced the striker spring, so that might be a good idea.

I was mostly concerned about the big divot. Good to know that's as designed. I couldn't remember if that was there or not. It does look pretty uniform for something that I was suspecting to be a breakage.
 
The bevel below the firing pin hole is, as has been stated, totally normal and part of the design. I’m betting your problem is ammo related. I have around 40K through my issued training M&P 1.0 and well over 10K through my personal training 2.0 CORE - I don’t think I’ve ever touched the striker channel on either.

I just finished up a 10,000 round test on a Trijicon SRO using a 2.0 CORE. The 10,000 rounds were fired in seven shooting sessions. The slowest firing was 1,000 rounds in a bit over an hour. The last 2,000 rounds were fired in about 35 minutes. The pistol was cooled by dunking the slide/barrel in water and watching out for the steam and splashing boiling water coming up through the magazine well. I did do a couple quick cleanings of the pistol during the test but never pulled the striker assembly.

We’ve got guys who have hundreds of thousands of rounds through M&Ps with abusive training cycles and minimal maintenance. The most common problem is ammunition that doesn’t go bang. In some cases a heavier primer strike ( like Beretta with the Mil-Spec hammer spring) will make them go. In most cases it won’t.

I’d use some of your proven ammunition and put a few hundred rounds through the pistol in practice. I’ll bet it runs fine.
 
RE: Dirt

Dirt and rust are the enemies of firearms. You don't have to go all OCD about it, but cleaning is a good thing. And, regular cleaning will generally eliminate the need to deal with rust.

I was at a USPSA match and a lady there was having some trouble with her gun. As a normal part of troubleshooting, I asked when the last time she had cleaned her gun. A busy body standing nearby snorted and said (imagine a very haughty tone), "That's why you should have a Glock. I never clean my gun and I've never had a malfunction." He was the next shooter up and the very first round malfunctioned. He had a second malfunction in that same string. Afterward I asked if he was going to clean his gun now. He responded, "No, that was just an ammo issue." He was using factory new ammo. I'll bet you lunch he's still telling people he's never had a malfunction with that gun.

The lady's issue wasn't a cleaning problem.


The point of this whole discourse is that cleaning can't hurt. Not cleaning can. I'm not saying that dirt is definitely the cause of the OP's problem, just that it can contribute. In his case I'm leaning more toward the spring.

I'm not obsessive about cleaning my guns, but I do clean them at least every 500 rounds or so. If I had time/money to do more competition, I'd probably clean them once a week or so. That's just me.
 
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I agree with much of the prior post so I’ll clarify.

The guns I carry on duty and off are clean and properly (meaning minimally for Glocks and M&Ps) lubed.

My range guns get abused. My partner’s guns get abused. I see thousands of guns firing lots of rounds every year. Many of them are not maintained well.

If you are using the gun for defense or you really want to win you should clean it. At the same time...

The M&P is a tank. I’ve sprayed saltwater on mine (range gun), thrown it in dirt, mud, sand, water, more of all of the above, shot it and other M&Ps at round counts that are physically impossible for a single person to accomplish. The spring, striker, or channel could be the issue, but since he said it was cleaned, and this issue occurred with a specific type of ammo, my experience tells me he should try other ammunition.

The T&E I spoke about of the optic happened in less than a month... 10,000 plus rounds out of one M&P with ZERO malfunctions. It was done with no doubt the gun was up to the task because 10K is nothing for my unit. If the gun is the problem there is something wrong with the gun or the OP is using a rediculous amount of lube and it’s causing hydro-lock of the striker. Dirt is NOT the problem. The spring could be the problem but I really doubt it.

But hey... I’m only pixels on a compute screen so make your choices.
 
I inspected the striker assembly again. The spring feels a little lighter, compared to another unit I have which sees less use, but that could just be confirmation bias. Doesn't seem materially weaker. It's like $18 for a whole new assembly, so I may get another one just cause it's cheap to do.

Because of my experience with this gun, I'm also leaning toward it being ammo related, now that we've cleared the "chip" below the firing pin hole as a suspect.

My carry guns are a different matter entirely when it comes to maintenance.
 
Here's my experience with failures to fire with my M&P 40c. It was totally reliable until it approached 10,000 rounds, at which time I began to experience infrequent, but persistent failures to fire. (It was thoroughly cleaned and lubed after every use.) I cleaned the striker channel (which wasn't too dirty) and installed a new striker mechanism. That did not cure the FTFs. I called S&W customer service, and they took back my 40c for a factory rebuild. They replaced the entire trigger mechanism as well as the slide lock. That didn't work either, as I continued to have FTFs. I started to push on the back of the slide whenever I had an FTF, and sure enough, they were being caused by a very small, barely visible out-of-battery condition. A new recoil spring assembly put an end to the OOB condition and to the FTFs. My 40c has had 6,000 rounds and zero malfunctions since. So don't overlook the possibility that a weak recoil spring assembly is the source of your problem.

And FYI, the striker, the recoil spring assembly, and the rebuild were all free, as part of S&W's lifetime service policy. So call customer service and plead your case. With 7,000 rounds, you might get a striker and an RSA for free. Disclaimer: My free stuff was received three years ago, and S&W may not be so generous these days. But it doesn't hurt to ask.
 
swsig said:
So don't overlook the possibility that a weak recoil spring assembly is the source of your problem.
Click to expand...
Indeed. Springs can always cause issues and they do wear out. The flat RSA we have in the M&Ps tends to last a lot longer than the round type. Still, it's a good thing to replace them at about 5,000 rounds. They're inexpensive and easy to replace. No reason not to.
 
I know that Glock publicly acknowledged that their RSA's should be replaced every 5,000 rounds. They are about $16 at MidwayUSA.
A small price to pay for longevity, kinda like getting an oil /filter change on your car.
 
Hfrog355 said:
5" Gen 1 Pro Series in 9mm. Hard to say how many rounds are on it, but it's a decent amount. 7k? Gun has never given me issues and I really like it.
Thoughts?
Click to expand...

FWIW: at 5K rounds/5 years you should, per factory, replace:

Trigger return spring, recoil spring assembly, slide stop, magazine springs and followers and coil pins.

At 10 K/10 years add: striker assembly, trigger bar assembly.

If you do a search in the gun smithing section, you should find the entire armorers to-do list.

Since 2006 and ???? rounds, I've never replaced my coil pins or mag innards or the slide stop, but I've got them on hand. I skipped the trigger return spring replacement at 5K and did the trigger and striker assemblies a couple years ago.
 
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Washington State Patrol had some serious issues with the striker channel a few years ago (1st generation M&P 40s). Every single one had to be completely armorer serviced due to ... something I can't recall now. Mere cleaning will not solve it.
 
southchatham said:
Winchester is garbage these days, that's your issue.
Click to expand...
No, it's not ( well their bulk .22LR is).
For practice in 9mm and .45, I shoot Blazer Brass, Federal American Eagle and Federal Champion, Remington UMC , PMC, and Winchester White Box.
The WWB is just as good as any, and more accurate than most.

In 9mm, Winchester 124 grain NATO shoots more accurately than any of the others.

For defense ammo, the Winchester Ranger-T is right up there with Federal HST and Speer Gold Dot ammo. One of the top three.

Winchester has ammo contracts with many LE departments and agencies, and Winchester currently provides 9mm ammo for the military.
Just because you don't like it doesn't mean it's "garbage".
 
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