Gun show lesson 15-4

[1-1917]

I got a 15-4 at the local gun show. Nothing collectable, I was just looking for a shooter that I thought my wife would enjoy. Normal cursory examination looked pretty good. I did NOT bring a dental mirror or bore light. Thumbnail inspection I saw a moderately dirty bore, no rust..

Lesson learned! Bring a bore light. If you forget one, buy one there. A mirror might not be a bad idea either. I did have my reading glasses.

When I got home and cleaned the bore better I noticed a slight dark spot (with bore light looking from the muzzle). Brushed some more and it didn't go away. Took the cylinder out to get a better look and a brass blob. What heck is that? Got a dental pick and was able to remove some brass shavings. Under the little scab of brass is a serious gouge in the barrel. No wonder the guy was in such a hurry to get rid of it. I wish I could find him again just to ask him how in the world he managed to do so much damage?

I guess at this point I'll just try getting the barrel replaced. Found a good barrel from another pinned model 15 as a replacement. At least the 15 is one of the easiest to find a barrel for. After replacing a barrel, I'll have more in this than I'll get out of it unless my wife just happens to love shooting it..

I like to think this wasn't an intentional swindle but I'm having a hard time believing that. Last few deals I've gotten on S&Ws have been pretty good so I guess it was about time for a stinker.

 

[eddiewhiteshoes]

That's a bummer indeed. I've never seen damage like that before. Hope somebody chimes in with an explanation.

 

[1-1917]

That's a bummer indeed. I've never seen damage like that before. Hope somebody chimes in with an explanation.

I spent half an hour trying to figure out how someone did that. Almost looks like they tried to use something hard to hammer out a stuck bullet from the rear. This is just a little inside the forcing cone.

 

[eddiewhiteshoes]

I agree. Probably a flat head round punch at the wrong angle.

 

[1-1917]

I agree. Probably a flat head round punch at the wrong angle.

But why from the rear? Bubba at his best I guess. Still not sure what it's going to cost me fix some idiots mistake. Make that TWO idiots mistakes!

 

[k22fan]

I bought a 629 from the classifieds here that had similar undisclosed damage. I can not tell if this is a possibility from looking at your pictures but My gunsmith thought the gouges were made by a knock out rod deflecting off the nose of a stuck bullet.

Unless you have gunsmithing skills and a lathe replacing a barrel runs $100 to $150 plus the expense of the new barrel bring it up near the value of an NRA good condition Model 15. If you could find a 2" barrel you'd end up with a higher value 15.

The lesson here is to always be suspicious of guns that are being sold with dirty barrels. Unethical sellers dirty barrels to hide damage. Be especially suspicious when it is the only gun in the store with a dirty barrel.

 

[apollo99]

I like K22fan's idea about a shorter 2" barrel.

 

[1-1917]

I like K22fan's idea about a shorter 2" barrel.

Got a nice 2" M&P, don't want one with adjustable sights.

If found a Smith here to replace it in the $100 range I'd live with it. Better to spend $150 at this point than throw away the $400 I paid for it.. )-:} Loose Loose deal.

 

[k22fan]

Were it mine I would get it correctly repaired. The mistake is already behind you. I have a S&W 1917 that I paid too much for then later had to have rebarreled. Since I have literally fired five gallon buckets of home cast bullets though it my cost per shot with it is lower than most of my guns.

15s have very pleasant recoil and are easy to shoot accurately. I'll bet your wife likes it.

 

[bananaman]

"Shame on me" I bought a GP100 from an ad on Armslist. Beautiful looking gun. Bore was dirty though. Once I got it home and cleaned it found pitting in it. It seemed to function OK at the range. I did not keep it that long. Bob

 

[CQB27]

If it's just a shooter, why not shoot it first and see how it groups? If it is reasonably accurate.....no worries, it's just a shooter anyway. As always, YMMV

 

[1-1917]

If it's just a shooter, why not shoot it first and see how it groups? If it is reasonably accurate.....no worries, it's just a shooter anyway. As always, YMMV

I have considered just trying to smooth it out a bit. It won't have anything but home cast wadcutters going down it anyway. Still prefer to just fix it right though. I did find a barrel that looks pretty darn good for $40.

 

[TNZ71]

If it's just a shooter, why not shoot it first and see how it groups? If it is reasonably accurate.....no worries, it's just a shooter anyway. As always, YMMV

Yea, I'd shoot it. If accuracy wasn't affected and it didn't spit shavings on you. I'd leave it as is.

 

[k22fan]

The gouges will recollect the same type of fouling they were filled with when he bought it. That will be worse with his home cast wadcutters than it was with the jacketed bullets that were fired though it by the last owner. My beautiful home cast bullets deserve a better barrel. Besides, I have more revolvers with good barrels than I have time for so I would not use it as is. That would leave me the options of selling it deceitfully as was done to 1-1917 or having it rebarreled. I'm not suggesting the rest of you should behave the same but I'd give it a fresh barrel then put the buying mistake behind me.

 

[1-1917]

I did find a small file that was able to reach and smooth the burr down a bit. I wouldn't be afraid to shoot it at this point but there IS a new barrel in the mail..

When I ran a cast bullet down the bore it was coming out pretty scratched up initially, after the filing and polishing, it comes out fine but in that process I noticed another issue. There is a very slight bulge, just enough to to let the bullet slip a bit easier in the middle of the barrel. I can't detect it with a straight edge on the outside of the barrel but there a wider place there. There are also a few other minor dings in the bore. I'm pretty sure someone stuck a bullet, probably two and used something like a bolt to hammer them out.

I will just chalk it up as a learning experience (hopefully for more than just me), get it fixed properly and enjoy it as a shooter.

 

[6GUNSONLY]

Sounds like there might have been a squib or primer-only round fired, resulting in a stuck bullet, then another round fired resulting in a bulged or ringed barrel, then the subsequent damage trying to remove the stuck bullet(s).

$40 + labor to install the new barrel - I've 'ad worse. Fix, shoot, enjoy, forget the $$. The government's printing more of it every day anyway.

 

[ABPOS]

Yeah, maybe have that barrel shortened.

 

[1-1917]

Yeah, maybe have that barrel shortened.

Nope, this barrel will be mounted on a plaque and used as a constant reminder to not get over enthused at a gun show.

I have a new barrel on the way and a decent deal with a good gunsmith ready to get it fixed right as soon as the barrel arrives..

 

[jimmyj]

I have seem bulged barrels that was as accurate as a barrel without a bulged.
I was issued an old worn loose M1911 that the bore looked like the inside of a chimney but was a nail driver. I never let on in spite of the other guys laughing and making remarks. Then at the range qualifications Jimmy was Top Gun. I never field stripped this old horse as I didn't want to mess up what ever made it so accurate.

 

[tops]

I saw a 6 in. 29-2 a dealer had at a good price and he told me it had a bad place (dark) in the barrel. I've seen worse barrels that shot ok so I bought it. It was as accurate and four other 29-2s I had so I figured I got a good deal. A few months later I worked on it with JB paste and it shined and stayed that way. I would never change a barrel until I found out it wouldn't shoot. Larry

 

[Targets Guy]

Good info to think about. Thanks.

 

[amazingflapjack]

Shoot it first!!!!!!!!!!!

I have seem bulged barrels that was as accurate as a barrel without a bulged.
I was issued an old worn loose M1911 that the bore looked like the inside of a chimney but was a nail driver. I never let on in spite of the other guys laughing and making remarks. Then at the range qualifications Jimmy was Top Gun. I never field stripped this old horse as I didn't want to mess up what ever made it so accurate.

I agree with Jimmy-and if the damage is just inside the forcing cone, shortening the barrel ain't gonna help! clean is and shoot it before you spend any money on it is my suggestion.

 

[1-1917]

I agree with Jimmy-and if the damage is just inside the forcing cone, shortening the barrel ain't gonna help! clean is and shoot it before you spend any money on it is my suggestion.

LOL, Yep, I'd have to shorten this one a LOT. I smoothed the gouges down a lot but haven't tried it to see how it behaves yet. I have a bunch of wadcutter reloads I can try in it just to see what happens after my polishing job. It has to be better than it was but it's still far from perfect.

 

[Jim NNN]

I spent half an hour trying to figure out how someone did that. Almost looks like they tried to use something hard to hammer out a stuck bullet from the rear. This is just a little inside the forcing cone.

Yeah, a squib removal job. My dad the engineer did that to an old Springfield 30-06 rifle rather than take it to a gunsmith who would've charged $25 to fix it back then. Marred the rifling. It's a shame, but may not have effected the way it shot.

The OP shouldn't feel too bad. If it's a good shooter, who cares. Or replace the barrel if you do care. You got it covered either way. Whatever you do, DON'T let it ruin your fun.

 

[gman51]

Yep I learned the hard way like you to inspect everything about a used gun. Burnt once was enough for me.

 

[daddy bear]

I have experience shooting three defective bores. My old 1911 has a good bit if pitting from a history of corrosive primers, I think. It shoots as accurately as the operator. I had a .30-06 rebore (by LaBounty) to .338-06. He let the bit chatter in the vicinity of the gas vent. There was no land on the bottom for a few inches. The rifle shot just fine, but you know how perfectionists are. After a few years, it got to bugging me and it went on the cheap. SIL has an old 700 .25-06 that has a visible bulge about eight inches from the muzzle. Said he bought it in a pawn shop that way for nearly nothing. The darn thing still shoots sub inch. Go figure??

Jack

 

[S.B.]

1-1917, you mean you made a gun deal without even finding out the sellers ID or seeing some kind of identification? I was under the impression every state required this, now?
Steve

 

[1-1917]

1-1917, you mean you made a gun deal without even finding out the sellers ID or seeing some kind of identification? I was under the impression every state required this, now?
Steve

The seller looked like a regular, he had a decent spread of parts set up at the show. He was just real quick to drop his price on this one. Problem for me is that it would cost more in gas to make the 5hr trip to try to find him at the next show than it's worth. I'm hoping he shows up at our local show, I'll know him if I see him. Most of those guys do a circuit. No, I do not have ID or documentation on him, not required. When I get the barrel replaced I'd like to give it to him at the next show as a present. I'm in a more cheerful mood now than I was. I think my total cost for this fix is going to be under $100. He can do what ever he wants at that point (if I ever see him again). More I think about it (after a "cooling off" period), he probably took it in trade and didn't notice the damage either. It's probably the guy that traded it in the first place that's the real scoundrel.

For a face to face transaction in Texas about the only requirement is the buyer be a Texas resident (and legal for them to own a gun). That does not require any paper or proof, just asking the question is good enough. If the buyer lies about their residence status and gets caught that is a misdemeanor. This is still a pretty free and gun friendly state.

 

[S.B.]

Short story, I bought a set of Magpul sights at a local show and they were fake so, I called people who ran the shows and they gave me his phone number. No gas on me.
Steve

 

[Arik]

..

I like to think this wasn't an intentional swindle but I'm having a hard time believing that. Last few deals I've gotten on S&Ws have been pretty good so I guess it was about time for a stinker.

While that does suck I just want to say that most people don't get that detailed when buying, or selling, a gun. I wouldn't even have thought about using dental picks and mirrors. I look down the barrel and if it looks good I'll buy it. If something is not working for me I'll sell it.

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