Is the .380 enough?

[Ole Joe Clark]

Not attempting to start a war, (pun intented). just some food for thought.

On page 100 of the September edition The American Rifleman is the monthly article called: "I have this old gun...." And in the issue that I received yesterday the featured firearm is a FN Browning Model 1922. This is the same model that arguably started WWI on June 28, 1014. The Bosnian nationalist "fired twice at Franz Ferdinand and his wife Sophie, mortally wounding them."
I see "experts" saying the .380 is not a good carry arm, the minimum is ?????. In this case it was more than enough, and a .22 LR is more than enough a lot of times.
I'm not an expert, but I think it safe to say that whatever caliber that a person can handle safely and shoot well is the best carry gun for him or her.

Have a blessed day,

Leon

P.S. If you are not a member of the NRA and like to read about old firearms, now is a good time to join.

Copyright for the above mentioned article is owned by the National Rifle Association, 11250 Waples Mill Road, Fairfax, VA 22030-9400

 

[Mule Packer]

Leon, I think most of us here will agree that bullet placement is key. That being said, however, there are a few things to consider in that particular shooting.

First, the shooter was pretty much within what I call "belly button distance." He was just a little over four feet away.

Second, the Archduke and Duchess were seated in a vehicle...no chance to either flee the scene or attack their assailant. (This is significant because in a self-defense situation, we want a bullet with stopping power.) Ferdinand and Sophie probably could've remained somewhat ambulatory for a short time after being shot (even considering the seriousness of their wounds) and, had they not been constrained and had been of a violent nature, they could've attempted an assault on the shooter. After the shooting, they both remained seated upright in the vehicle while traveling to the governor's home for medical care.

Third, the first shot hit Ferdinand in the jugular, yet he remained alive until they reached the governor's house. In fact, when he was asked about the extent of his injuries, he replied, "It's nothing."

So, while a .380 is certainly deadly, a heavier, more powerful cartridge would undoubtedly be preferred to produce increased shock and stopping power.

That being said, do I occasionally carry a .380? You bet...a Ruger LCP when it is difficult to conceal something more powerful. Do I feel inadequate? Not really, but I have to realize its limitations. As I alluded to previously, the .380 is a "belly button gun." It was designed to be used up close and personal.

I'm not going to be using it to take shots at 25 yards. It won't be used to stop a charging black bear. Nope. It is to be used when I'm confronted in the parking lot of the grocery store late at night by Jimmy the Creep demanding my Social Security check. Yep...belly button distance. Close enough to effectively empty the magazine into the designated target...enough to either stop or completely discourage further unwanted behavior.

Just my view from the saddle.

 

[STCM(SW)]

I also CC a 380 sometimes, PPK clone and don't feel under gunned.

 

[chiefbob81]

380 enough?

With the new superior bullet designs, powder improvements, yes a 380 will do the job. Especially if you empty the gun on target.

 

[RoyM52]

Nice Schrade pocket knife

 

[OKFC05]

"I'm not an expert, but I think it safe to say that whatever caliber that a person can handle safely and shoot well is the best carry gun for him or her. "



I can kill a 300# pig with a .22 short (captive animal), but I am not stupid enough to go wild boar hunting with a .22.
Apples and oranges: adequate defense not the same as can kill a defenseless individual, and a carry gun should be for defense, not execution.

 

[Borderboss]

With the pocket 9s that are available, I don't see a reason to carry a 380 unless you're recoil sensitive.

 

[TomkinsSP]

A .22 short is enough, just put it though an eye socket. A .22 LR will probably penetrate the skull. More people have died from the .22LR than any other round. .32acp fmjs penetrate a torso, A .380acp properly placed will work just fine.

I carry a .38 special, it has a proven track record. .38 Super and .357s even more so, but with a huge sound signature.

.40S&W, .44 specials, .45acps can both kill and cause significant injury even with pariphreal hits.

JMO, rule one always carry, rule two hit what you aim at.

 

[SOS24]

My personal feeling is proficiency and accuracy with what you choose is more important than caliber, at least when talking the major defensive calibers.

Here is a summary of a real world study on shootings that seems to reach the same conclusion.
YouTube

 

[robertrwalsh]

As noted by others previously, the whole idea of a self defense pistol is NOT to kill the other guy, it is to prevent the other guy from killing you. A certain amount of power is desirable to help ensure this.

Little known fact, the Arch Duke was wearing a really excellent (for it's time) bulletproof vest. As he was hit in the neck it did him little good. The U. S. Secret Service thought so much of it they special ordered one for William McKinley. It arrived two weeks after he was shot to death. His successor, Teddy Roosevelt, was the victim of at least one assassination attempt. A folded up bunch of paper in his inside coat pocket (speech notes) saved him from a significant injury. Anemic cartridge.

 

[Pisgah]

When it comes to self defense, the question of which cartridge is "enough" is really sort of moot. The question should be, "Would I want to be shot with this?" If your answer is "No", that'll be the answer from the vast majority of people you're ever likely to have to point it at.

 

[Ziggy2525]

It seems to me it depends on how you see your risks. If your main risk is random violence at the ATM or gas pump, I think .380 will convince a bad guy he has something better to do than harm you as well as any. They just want an easy target.

If I was a LEO that had put some really bad people away, where revenge was their motive, I’d want something with a lot of really big boolets.

 

[Protected One]

Not attempting to start a war, (pun intented). just some food for thought.

On page 100 of the September edition The American Rifleman is the monthly article called: "I have this old gun...." And in the issue that I received yesterday the featured firearm is a FN Browning Model 1922. This is the same model that arguably started WWI on June 28, 1014. The Bosnian nationalist "fired twice at Franz Ferdinand and his wife Sophie, mortally wounding them."
I see "experts" saying the .380 is not a good carry arm, the minimum is ?????. In this case it was more than enough, and a .22 LR is more than enough a lot of times.
I'm not an expert, but I think it safe to say that whatever caliber that a person can handle safely and shoot well is the best carry gun for him or her.

Have a blessed day,

Leon

You had to do it didn't you???

 

[Ole Joe Clark]

I personally don't own a .380, but I have considered the M&P .380EZ for my wife. She has trouble with the slide on a Shield 9mm. She has a Colt Detective Special, but it has a terrible trigger.

I hope they come out with a 9mm in the EZ platform. I don't want to get into .380 reloading either. I reload almost everything I shoot.

Have a blessed day,

Leon

 

[TomkinsSP]

As noted by others previously, the whole idea of a self defense pistol is NOT to kill the other guy, it is to prevent the other guy from killing you...

Correct, the goal of a SD shooting is to STOP the illegal assault upon your person (or that of another innocent.) One highly effective way to STOP an illegal assault is to disrupt or disconnect the criminal perpetrators central nervous system, usually resulting in severe injury or death.

We don't shoot at hands, arms, legs, feet. Some people, understanding thier abilities with a handgun choose to aim center mass, larger calibers may turn peripheral hits into "stoppers", but for those who hit what they aim at, pretty much any caliber will do.

 

[Wise_A]

I think the problem is more the guns than the cartridge. By the time you get down to a pistol sized to take advantage of the .380 ACP, the sight radius is rather small and the sights themselves are typically pretty lousy.

I personally don't own a .380, but I have considered the M&P .380EZ for my wife. She has trouble with the slide on a Shield 9mm. She has a Colt Detective Special, but it has a terrible trigger.

I hope they come out with a 9mm in the EZ platform. I don't want to get into .380 reloading either. I reload almost everything I shoot.

Just suck it up and show her the 380EZ, even if it's only a stopgap between now and whenever she grows confident-enough to operate something more conventional.

Also, side note, I frequently see a lot of shooters have problems because they're being too gentle in their manipulation.

 

[Rustyt1953]

.380, .381, whatever it takes.

 

[oldiesradio1560]

Since the mid 70's I've owned nothing but Smith 2 or 4" .357 magnums until February of this year when I brought my first automatic a .380 Shield EZ. I Love my .380! What I found out was that I can put more rounds center mass Faster with the lower recoil. I believed in the "shock and awe" of my. 357's but putting more rounds in the right place is really king.

 

[roundgun]

My 81 year old neighbor carries a .380 everyday, says 9mm is too much recoil for his tired bones. I tell him .380 is better than no-80.

 

[alwslate]

Watch some of the crime shows on TV like "The First 48" and you will
surely think the .380 is enough. There are many people laid to rest with
the little .380 on a regular basis here in the US. I carry a Ruger LCP
most of the time any more because it's handy and I avoid risky places.