I recently traded in my S&W 40 Shield 2.0 for a 357 Wheelgun. There was nothing wrong with the 40, it was probably just me due to arthritis, however, the recoil really would start arthur to mis-behaving, yet my 9 mm Shield never has! I recently just bought a Glock-22 40cal at a Gun Show. I love it! There is zero recoil and it just flat out whups that 40 Shield...I hate to admit that but its true, arthur hasn't acted up either.
Is the 40 S&W a must have cartridge?
- Thread starter lrrifleman
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Echo40
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Folks have a weird habit of splitting hairs when it comes to survival. What difference does it make whether a stop is psychological or physiological?
What really matters is results, so regardless of whether it be due to incapacitating physiological damage to vital organs or just a potent combination of pain and fear, if one particular cartridge has a higher volume of stopping a threat than others, then that's all that really matters.
In other words, even if factually speaking, more thugs cease attacking someone with say a .357 Magnum than a 9mm Luger simply because the gun emits a more intimidating muzzle flash and report when fired, what difference does it make?
Which brings me to my next point, another thing folks have a weird habit of doing when it comes to self-defense is expecting that every last thug on Earth is under the influence of narcotics so strong that their ability to feel pain is inhibited, which while that may be a possibility, there's always one vital factor or perhaps some misunderstanding at work here.
While certain narcotics can indeed inhibit pain, fear is another factor, and I have personally had the misfortune of being exposed to enough people who were either high or suffering from withdrawal symptoms to safely say that more often than not, druggies are jumpy, scare extremely easily, and are often completely paranoid. As a result, I am confident that getting shreaded to bits by buckshot would likely be psychologically traumatic enough for them that however many seconds they may have left to live, they're probably too freaked out by the sight of all their structurally superfluous new orifices leaking vital fluid at an alarming rate to be in a state of mind to continue attacking.
Furthermore, folks who are strung out on drugs usually have an elevated heart rate and blood pressure by default, so you can imagine how much faster their heart would be going during a violent confrontation, especially ones in which bullets are flying in their direction, and even more so once they've been shot, ergo while a normal human being might theoretically be able to to remain physically active for a moment after a bullet has torn through their heart, it would seem highly likely that said length of time would be considerably less for one who's heart is beating a mile a minute.
Last but certainly not least, I would like to once again request detailed, verifiable accounts of these situations in which someone was shot through the heart, yet kept on attacking, essentially ones in which the attacker remained active long enough to actually inflict significant bodily harm to their intended victim before succumbing to their wounds.
Honestly, I'm hearing a lot of "ifs and buts" here, but so far nobody has presented any evidence to support these ifs and/or buts. So unless you've actually got something to support these claims beyond words, please refrain from making any further bold statements like how 9mm FMJ is just as good or better than larger caliber expanding bullets, let alone a barrage of bullets of equal size such as a 000 Buck shotshell.
What really matters is results, so regardless of whether it be due to incapacitating physiological damage to vital organs or just a potent combination of pain and fear, if one particular cartridge has a higher volume of stopping a threat than others, then that's all that really matters.
In other words, even if factually speaking, more thugs cease attacking someone with say a .357 Magnum than a 9mm Luger simply because the gun emits a more intimidating muzzle flash and report when fired, what difference does it make?
Which brings me to my next point, another thing folks have a weird habit of doing when it comes to self-defense is expecting that every last thug on Earth is under the influence of narcotics so strong that their ability to feel pain is inhibited, which while that may be a possibility, there's always one vital factor or perhaps some misunderstanding at work here.
While certain narcotics can indeed inhibit pain, fear is another factor, and I have personally had the misfortune of being exposed to enough people who were either high or suffering from withdrawal symptoms to safely say that more often than not, druggies are jumpy, scare extremely easily, and are often completely paranoid. As a result, I am confident that getting shreaded to bits by buckshot would likely be psychologically traumatic enough for them that however many seconds they may have left to live, they're probably too freaked out by the sight of all their structurally superfluous new orifices leaking vital fluid at an alarming rate to be in a state of mind to continue attacking.
Furthermore, folks who are strung out on drugs usually have an elevated heart rate and blood pressure by default, so you can imagine how much faster their heart would be going during a violent confrontation, especially ones in which bullets are flying in their direction, and even more so once they've been shot, ergo while a normal human being might theoretically be able to to remain physically active for a moment after a bullet has torn through their heart, it would seem highly likely that said length of time would be considerably less for one who's heart is beating a mile a minute.
Last but certainly not least, I would like to once again request detailed, verifiable accounts of these situations in which someone was shot through the heart, yet kept on attacking, essentially ones in which the attacker remained active long enough to actually inflict significant bodily harm to their intended victim before succumbing to their wounds.
Honestly, I'm hearing a lot of "ifs and buts" here, but so far nobody has presented any evidence to support these ifs and/or buts. So unless you've actually got something to support these claims beyond words, please refrain from making any further bold statements like how 9mm FMJ is just as good or better than larger caliber expanding bullets, let alone a barrage of bullets of equal size such as a 000 Buck shotshell.
10mm_Shooter
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No you don't need a .40...… but you do need a 10mm 
1775usmarine
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Umm for me it now is since I acquired a CHP 4006TSW. Well just bullets or a mold as I have enough brass that probably comes out to less than a penny a piece.
The .40 S&W is a must have cartridge for me because I own ten handguns that need that cartridge.
MyDads38
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A must have? No. I never wanted a 40 cal, since I had 9mm and 45 auto's. But at one point I wanted something different. So I traded a Ruger 9mm for a new S&W SD40VE. That was the start/beginning lol. I now have 4 - 40 cal handguns. It's not my favorite caliber to shoot, but I shoot it as well as my other calibers.
Biggfoot44
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When .40 was first invented, I considered it a pointless political compromise, to fill a non-existent gap . Subsequently it has " execeeded my initial expectations " . ( Not meaning it was superior , but rather that it turned out to be an additional viable option .) I was quite confident in the capabilities of 9x19 , * with ammo of my choosing * , and wasn't stressed over the capacity of .45acp .
The arguments about not dealing with an additional ctg has a flip side . During the periodic ammunition panics , the most popular cals, are also the first to disappear off of the shelves . During the most recent shortage , in many regions, .40, and .357Sig were available long after supplies of 9mm, .45acp, and .38spl were cleaned out . ( And for those who plan for reloading to be their backstop against shortages , remember that primers disappered as quickly as popular loaded ammo .
But with the market fluctuations of the moment , good quality .40 pistols are available at dirt cheap prices .
The best thing about .40 to me, is that with a conversion bbl in my 10mm , .40 is readily available cheap , mild plinking ammo .
The arguments about not dealing with an additional ctg has a flip side . During the periodic ammunition panics , the most popular cals, are also the first to disappear off of the shelves . During the most recent shortage , in many regions, .40, and .357Sig were available long after supplies of 9mm, .45acp, and .38spl were cleaned out . ( And for those who plan for reloading to be their backstop against shortages , remember that primers disappered as quickly as popular loaded ammo .
But with the market fluctuations of the moment , good quality .40 pistols are available at dirt cheap prices .
The best thing about .40 to me, is that with a conversion bbl in my 10mm , .40 is readily available cheap , mild plinking ammo .
I have a S&W M&P .40 compact 4" barrel. I bought a 9mm barrel for it for $50. I have less than $100 into it not counting the extra magazines. I shoot 9mm at the range due to cost and carry the .40. It seems like a good combination.
I just made a trade on a whim, that landed me a .40 Sig P229 with box & a couple of mags. I've owned 40's before, and never disliked any of them. (well, maybe that Glock 27, it had a very "easy to engage trigger", and no safety).
However, the thing that made me trade for this one, was the DAK trigger. I've heard pros & cons on it, but decided to find out myself. So far I like it just fine, although I do wish it had a safety.
I'll take advantage of every good deal I see on a .40 while they're on the downslope. It's a very capable round, and my caliber of choice between a 9mm & a .40 S&W.
However, the thing that made me trade for this one, was the DAK trigger. I've heard pros & cons on it, but decided to find out myself. So far I like it just fine, although I do wish it had a safety.
I'll take advantage of every good deal I see on a .40 while they're on the downslope. It's a very capable round, and my caliber of choice between a 9mm & a .40 S&W.
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otis24
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I think the .40 is a good round. However, I also think that the advancement in ammo design had negated many advantages of one caliber over another. If the cost and availability of .40 caliber ammo was comparable to 9mm, I would probably own a .40. But, the increased cost alone prohibits me from choosing that caliber over 9mm.
.40SW a 'must have'?
My answer would be no.
I have several 9mm (don't like them but ya gotta admit they is cheap to feed) and I have two Smith E series Smith .45's that I really LOVE. However, I'm a revolver shooter and I'm nuts about my Smith revolver collection.
The other day, while at the Ft. Worth Gun Show, I saw a Smith M&P in .40 brand new and could not pass up the price. The gun I wanted to buy was way over my budget and the darn fool that ran that table was really hard to get along with. One table over, I got the M&P in .40 for way under what I went to the show to spend. A really nice shooter for a great price and the folks that ran the table fell all over themselves to take my check.
Shooting the darn thing a few times, I was really surprised how much I liked it. Accurate as all get out. First shot was dead in the bull!
Now the gun is not my two prize E series Smith's and it sure as thunder not my trusted 36, 37, 19, or 28 Smiths. All of them are after my own heart. But the gun shoots like a Smith, and was a great price. How can you argue with that?
Not a 'must have' anyway you wish to cut the pie. But one I really do enjoy, and would carry to defend those I love any day of the week, and twice on Sunday.
Bob Ft. Worth, TX
My answer would be no.
I have several 9mm (don't like them but ya gotta admit they is cheap to feed) and I have two Smith E series Smith .45's that I really LOVE. However, I'm a revolver shooter and I'm nuts about my Smith revolver collection.
The other day, while at the Ft. Worth Gun Show, I saw a Smith M&P in .40 brand new and could not pass up the price. The gun I wanted to buy was way over my budget and the darn fool that ran that table was really hard to get along with. One table over, I got the M&P in .40 for way under what I went to the show to spend. A really nice shooter for a great price and the folks that ran the table fell all over themselves to take my check.
Shooting the darn thing a few times, I was really surprised how much I liked it. Accurate as all get out. First shot was dead in the bull!
Now the gun is not my two prize E series Smith's and it sure as thunder not my trusted 36, 37, 19, or 28 Smiths. All of them are after my own heart. But the gun shoots like a Smith, and was a great price. How can you argue with that?
Not a 'must have' anyway you wish to cut the pie. But one I really do enjoy, and would carry to defend those I love any day of the week, and twice on Sunday.
Bob Ft. Worth, TX
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I love my Sig P224!
Most of the time, my 224 is my EDC. IMO the DAK trigger eliminates the need for a safety. The sturdy frame absorbs a lot of the recoil.
I went browsing for .40s, as a result of this thread. I didn't see any deals I couldn't live without. The expensive models haven't come down in price that much.
Most of the time, my 224 is my EDC. IMO the DAK trigger eliminates the need for a safety. The sturdy frame absorbs a lot of the recoil.
I went browsing for .40s, as a result of this thread. I didn't see any deals I couldn't live without. The expensive models haven't come down in price that much.
This.
If you have a 10mm, you can load down to FBI lite spec, which is only about 75 fps faster than .40; virtually the same.
Or you can change to a slower powder and make serious 10mm stuff.
Remington 10mm ammo = FBI Lite
Sig 10mm ammo = 10mm power.
JohnHL
Member
Is the 40 S&W a "must have" cartridge?
ABSOLUTELY!!!
Not since the debut of the 357 Magnum in the mid 1930s, has a "new" handgun cartridge had such a profound and widespread effect on Law Enforcement and the civilian shooting population.
It wasn't the "wonder nine" (found lacking) that finally replaced the 357 Mag revolver with a semi-auto in the holsters of America's LEOs.
It was the 40 S&W.
And the rest of America followed.
Not owning a 40 S&W is like not owning a 9mm or a 45.
The 40 S&W has been THAT historically significant.
John
ABSOLUTELY!!!
Not since the debut of the 357 Magnum in the mid 1930s, has a "new" handgun cartridge had such a profound and widespread effect on Law Enforcement and the civilian shooting population.
It wasn't the "wonder nine" (found lacking) that finally replaced the 357 Mag revolver with a semi-auto in the holsters of America's LEOs.
It was the 40 S&W.
And the rest of America followed.
Not owning a 40 S&W is like not owning a 9mm or a 45.
The 40 S&W has been THAT historically significant.
John
Lots of replies
I like it.
In my opinion here is no such thing as a must have cartridge. The .40 S&W answered a question that nobody asked but, fine, it works, if you like it, buy it. .357 SIG is no different as far as I am concerned. After the small center fire pistol cartridges starting with .25 ACP, then .32 varieties, then .380s, then 9mm, then .45, it seems to me that those basic calibers solve every problem you could come up with. 10mm is very specialized and its different in many ways but .40 S&W not so much.
YMMV
And I can see from the reply right before mine that the YMMV is a definite fact. I see no historic wonderment in the .40 whatsoever and I wonder who even uses it these days but I could be wrong.
I like it.
In my opinion here is no such thing as a must have cartridge. The .40 S&W answered a question that nobody asked but, fine, it works, if you like it, buy it. .357 SIG is no different as far as I am concerned. After the small center fire pistol cartridges starting with .25 ACP, then .32 varieties, then .380s, then 9mm, then .45, it seems to me that those basic calibers solve every problem you could come up with. 10mm is very specialized and its different in many ways but .40 S&W not so much.
YMMV
And I can see from the reply right before mine that the YMMV is a definite fact. I see no historic wonderment in the .40 whatsoever and I wonder who even uses it these days but I could be wrong.
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The only reason to own a 40 is that you can buy guns chambered for it really cheaply right now. Other than that, IMO, there's no reason to own one. I never owned one because I shoot a lot of 9mm and 45acp and always thought that the would the 45 would be adequate if needed for self defense. Also , the ammo is much more expensive than the other two. I always looked at it like the 41 magnum--the solution to a problem that didn't exist.
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amd6547
Member
I've been a 9mm fan since before there was a 10mm, or a .40.
But the deals on 40's couldn't be ignored, so I bought a Gen4 G22. Described by the vender as "very good", it turned out to be like new. Not bad, for $319, including night sights.
At the range, I found it shot about the same as my Glock 17.
I enjoyed shooting it so much, it became my house pistol.
But the deals on 40's couldn't be ignored, so I bought a Gen4 G22. Described by the vender as "very good", it turned out to be like new. Not bad, for $319, including night sights.
At the range, I found it shot about the same as my Glock 17.
I enjoyed shooting it so much, it became my house pistol.
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I had a 357Sig with a 40 conversion. I shot less than 250 round through the 40. I had a ball with the 357Sig. There was a lot I could do on the loading bench with 357Sig. That gun was one I should have kept.
I keep looking for a stupid cheap police trade-ins in 357Sig/40 and 10mm just to round out available calibers.
I keep looking for a stupid cheap police trade-ins in 357Sig/40 and 10mm just to round out available calibers.
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