K-22 AMMO

[cpt-t]

A Shooting Friend of mine was over at my house. And I was showing Him my 17-2, 17-3, and 617. And He asked me what type of ammo did I shoot thru them. And I told Him Major Brand Standard Velocity Ammo is all I had ever used in them. He asked if I could use 22LR High Velocity Ammo & Stingers or even 22 Shorts. And I didn't really have an answer for Him. I just thought I was suppose to use Standard Velocity 22LR Ammo. Can I safely use 22LR High Speed & Stinger Ammo or 22 Shorts in them, or could that cause me to damage any of my guns. What types of 22 Ammo works the best for You Guys in your K22`s. There are as You All know some pretty expensive 22LR out there, do I need the really expensive Ammo. Thanks In Advance.
ken

 

[Usmc5811]

Don’t quote me but I’m pretty sure you can use all. Probably have to give it a good cleaning after shooting shorts and switching to longs. My experience they will eat any 22 you put in it.

 

[lrrifleman]

As a rule, I will not put jacketed bullets through either my K22 or my K38s. Because they don't make them anymore, they get a steady diet of lead. Only my PPC K38 sees a jacketed bullet, and that is when it pulls nightstand duty. Perhaps I am being over cautious, but I want my children's grandchildren to be able to enjoy these revolvers, as they left the factory.

 

[brucev]

There is not any SAAMI .22 LR ammunition that you cannot use in the S&W 17 series. I have a S&W 18-3 that I consider my most favorite revolver. It has in the past and will in the future do excellent service with everything from the standard type .22LR target loads right on up through the Mini-Mags, Stingers, Yellow Jackets, etc., etc. HTH. Sincerely. bruce.

 

[usm1rifle]

I find that CCI Stingers shoot best in my pre-17s and the nickel cases extract easier. You are not going to hurt any K22 with SAMI approved ammo.

 

[JP@AK]

Captain

As others have said, any K-22 Masterpiece or .22 Combat Masterpiece will handle all SAAMI rated commercial .22 Short, Long or Long Rifle ammunition with no ill effects.

Two caveats are in order, however:

1. Using Shorts or Longs can cause a buildup of lead and lubricant in the charge holes, making Long Rifle ammo difficult to seat or extract. If you shoot either of the shorter length ammo, be sure to scrub out the charge holes afterward, to avoid the problem.

2. The K-22 can be finicky about the ammo it "likes." Some brands will shoot better in one gun than another and other guns will like different ammo. You may have to experiment a bit to determine which brand your particular revolvers handle the best. I have one that likes Remington and doesn't shoot CCI worth a darn.

Summary:

Higher velocity stuff is fine in any K frame .22, so long as that gun shoots it accurately. The pressure difference is negligible and no harm will come to your gun from using Stingers or Vipers or any of the other "high speed" ammo.

 

[JP@AK]

Using Shorts or Longs can cause a buildup of lead and lubricant in the charge holes, making Long Rifle ammo difficult to seat or extract. If you shoot either of the shorter length ammo, be sure to scrub out the charge holes afterward, to avoid the problem.

I should backtrack a bit on this. The problem I described can definitely occur with Shorts. Since I have never (that I can recall) shot any .22 Long from my K-22 revolvers, I cannot say for certain they will cause the fouling I mentioned.

As far as I'm concerned the .22 Long is basically a useless cartridge, other than for shooting in guns that were designed for its exclusive use.

 

[rct269]

The typical SERIOUS shooter and (virtually) ALL competitors use standard velocity ammo simply because it is (usually) more accurate (from a handgun---I know next to nothing about what rifles like).

In my experience, using a machine rest, it is ALWAYS more accurate (smaller groups). That said, my experience with a machine rest goes back more than a few years. There are new brands/different loads (especially high velocity) about which I know absolutely nothing. I have used nothing but Aguila standard velocity for the 16-18 years since it proved to be VASTLY superior to anything else tested. As a matter of fact I still have that ammo from back then---haven't bought anything new/different since.

Yeah, I know---I don't know what I'm missing. I also don't care---I'm sticking with a winner. If/when I run out, I'll find another winner---maybe the same winner---wouldn't surprise me.

Ralph Tremaine

As an aside, while the gun will run with shorts and longs, it is my recollection different rifling rates are use with Long Rifle and Short ammo. It is also my recollection (somewhat dimmer) that Shorts and Longs use the same bullet. Given my recollections so far are accurate, my next recollection is checking the rates in a Model 41 and a Model 41-1 (Runs on Shorts.) The rates were different---and I don't recall what they were.

The one thing I do recall about rifling rates is that used in S&W's very first (real) heavy frame .22 Long Rifle revolver---those which pre-date the K-22 1st Model by 20 years or so. There were 20 of them (built on K frames)---made up to fill a special order by the Army---or perhaps an Army team---same difference. They didn't work worth a ****!! They were returned. They were destroyed---all but one as the story goes. That one found its way into the hands of one Walter Roper. He fiddled around, trying to figure out why they didn't work. The end of the story is they had a 1 in 10 rate. Now Roper, and presumably any and everybody else in the gun business (for real) knew that was wrong----not even close. I'm pretty sure nobody at S&W admitted to knowing why these guns were rifled as they were---nobody that lived to tell about it anyway.

 

[merl67]

Short answer anything that will chamber is safe to shoot in it. As others said you will get different results in the accuracy department. You can shoot shorts in it but I am not sure why you would.

 

[cpt-t]

I don`t see why I would ever want to shoot any 22 Shorts thru any of my K22`s or any of my others 22LR Pistols or Revolvers either. I just always thought that you were never supposed to shoot anything but High Quality Standard Velocity 22LR Ammo thru any 22LR handguns. Could any of You Guys recommend some some different 22LR brands of ammo for me to try on ((( My New S&W K22`s ))). That have worked best for You. I have really enjoyed them so far and feel so very fortunate to just have them. Again ((( GUY`S ))) thanks so very much for shearing with me all Your expertise, knowledge, and advice. I truly appreciate it.
ken

 

[steelslaver]

It used to be that shorts were quite a bit cheaper than long rifles. No very true anymore. I could see shorts in a small indoor range for fun. But, you would need to clean cylinder well when done.

I have fired just about every kind of 22lr in my K22s. Velocity doesn't change impact point much as little recoil to lift the barrel like happens with heavierr calibers.

 

[JSR III]

I have never had any issues with my K22's shooting all manner of 22 ammunition.

My model 41 however, is a different subject. Mine gets a steady diet of Green Tag without issues. With Remmington, Eley and other major brands I get stovepipes, FTF and any other sort of mishap one can encounter.

 

[NovaJoe]

For my K22 - I am looking for a brand of ammo that runs clean. The chambers get sticky and need to be cleaned every few cylinders. Have been advised to ream the chambers. Hoping to find a cleaner brand of ammo.

The K22 doesn't get out much since I got the Ruger Mk4.

 

[rockquarry]

Depending on how much effort you want to put into it, you might consider trying ten or so ammos, high velocity and standard velocity, plain lead, copper coated, solid and hollow point. Usually the standard provides greater accuracy, but not always.

This is a one time testing, but needs to be done the right way, and from a good benchrest at twenty-five yards. Shooting at a shorter distance will only tell you that even sorry ammunition is accurate up close.

I have a K22 I bought new in the mid-'70s. It's been shot a great deal and I usually shoot CCI standard velocity in it. Last summer I was trying some cheap stuff I had never used. Surprisingly, one of the Federal high velocity ammos grouped tighter than the more expensive CCI SV. Federal Auto Match (an ammo that seldom receives positive reviews and that's why I tried it) grouped equally with CCI SV.

Be aware that all ammo varies in accuracy potential from lot-to-lot. The difference may be minimal or significant, but it seems the potential for variance is much greater with the lower cost ammunitions. Just something to consider.

I shoot only long rifle, but .22 shorts, etc. aren't quite the obstacle that some claim. The shorter rounds may leave a carbon ring in the chamber throats, but this is easily removed with a solvent and brush.

 

[DWalt]

"As far as I'm concerned the .22 Long is basically a useless cartridge, other than for shooting in guns that were designed for its exclusive use."

The .22 Long was the predecessor of the .22 Long Rifle, and there were some earlier rifles made for the .22 Long which will not feed any other round, most notably the Winchester Model 1890 pump gun (although it is not too difficult to modify a Model 1890 to handle .22 Short). I don't know if the .22 Long cartridge is even made these days. Nothing wrong with using it if you have it, as it just has a lighter bullet than the .22 LR in the same case. How well the .22 Long might function in a semiautomatic .22 (rifle or pistol) I cannot say. But it's a needless cartridge unless maybe you have a Winchester Model 1890 in .22 Long.

Regarding barrel rifling twist, the lighter bullet used for the .22 Short works fine in the faster twist barrels made for the .22 LR. I have a Hi- Standard Olympic Rapid Fire pistol which was intended for use with the .22 Short only. Not too long ago I had its barrel re-lined (There is a long story associated with that I won't relate), and it was necessary to use a Lothar Walther tube rifled for the .22 LR. The relined barrel groups as well with .22 Shorts as the original barrel did.

I also have a Winchester 52B rifle, and it groups as well at 50' with Shorts as with Long Rifles, even though I don't normally use .22 Shorts. And with that particular rifle, at 50 yards it groups about as well with most .22 LR HV loads as it does with the expensive Eley match loads, even with the Remington bulk pack "golden bullet" loads. I have written about that here previously.

The crud buildup in the chamber ahead of the .22 Short case mouth is pretty much a non-issue as long as you keep the chamber cleaned after firing Shorts. Same goes for firing .38 Special in a .357 Magnum revolver chamber.

 

[Targets Guy]

The nice thing about K-22's is that they eat Thunderbolts with no problems. Just clean up good after.

 

[Speedo2]

My understanding is that 22SV ammo is generally more accurate in rifles than 22HV due to flight instability which occurs as the projectile transitions from supersonic (>1100 fps) to subsonic (<1100 fps, stnd.conds.) velocities. Most 22HV ammo exceeds 1200 fps muzzle velocity, therefore 22SV is the preferred choice for target rifle shooters.

I've chrono'd several 22HV's and some have exceeded 1100 fps from semi-pistols (CCi Mini-Mags and Stingers from a Ruger Mk2, 6-7/8" BBL). Because of the cylinder-to-forcing cone gap in K22's, I doubt that 22HV's would attain supersonic muzzle velocity (...but I may be wrong, will have to experiment one of these days). Therefore, I doubt that there is much accuracy differential between the higher quality HV and SV ammo's in a K22.

My preferred ammo for K22's when target shooting is CCI SV. It's comparatively cheap, readily available, and whereas a Ransom Rest may be able to discern the difference at 25 yds between $0.07 CCI SV and $0.50 cent/round Eley Tenex , my skills as a pistolerro cannot. Target rifles at 50-100 yds is a whole different world. -S2

 

[JP@AK]

there were some earlier rifles made for the .22 Long which will not feed any other round, most notably the Winchester Model 1890 pump gun.

it's a needless cartridge unless maybe you have a Winchester Model 1890 in .22 Long.

I had the Model 1890 specifically in mind when I wrote what I did earlier. There may be other rifles out there chambered for the .22 Long only, but I am personally familiar with the Winchester Model 1890. I once owned one that shot only the .22 WRF as well.

In the S&W world, there is the tiny M frame 1st, 2d and 3d models (sometimes called the Ladysmith, although apparently not by the factory), made from 1902 until c. 1920. It was chambered for the .22 Long, and .22 Long Rifle ammo should never be shot in one. So I guess you can argue that the .22 Long does have a use for some shooters of S&W revolvers. But I can't imagine a reason to shoot them in a K-22 unless you just had a bunch of them lying around.

I don't know if the .22 Long cartridge is even made these days.

I wondered aloud about this once recently and was assured by someone that it is.

The crud buildup in the chamber ahead of the .22 Short case mouth is pretty much a non-issue as long as you keep the chamber cleaned after firing Shorts

Again, yes. That is the point I was making in a previous post. Shooting shorts is fine, but scrub the charge holes out after each range session.

 

[cpt-t]

Thanks again Guys, for all Your helpful info and advice.
ken

 

[stykshooter]

I have several K-22’s, as well as 617’s, Ruger single sixes and Mark III & Mark IV’s. I agree that .22 handguns can be finicky and that is why I spend a long, and enjoyable, day with each one I pick up to see what they like the best. I have a tool box with about 50 different brands and styles of .22’s that I shoot to see what each one prefers. Most of them shoot C.C.I. standard velocity about as good as anything else and that is what I stock up on. Pistol Match is usually good as well and the SGB round also shoots great.

I do have one K-22 that I bought new in 1985 that is one of my most accurate revolvers and it’s load of choice is C.C.I. HV short HP. This Smith and that load constantly surprises me and that combination has become my squirrel hunting favorite. I have shot probably a couple of hundred squirrels with that revolver and load over the last 30 years. I don’t know why they work together, just that they do. I had trouble locating that ammunition several years back and when I did find it I bought several thousand rounds, just for that one revolver. I don't worry about scrubbing the charge holes as shorts is all I shoot out of that revolver.