Lower POI .45 Colt question.

[AJ]

AJ you have a franken gun monster.

Is this just a illusion but looking closely at the picture you posted it appears the muzzle has a slight outward bell shape?

I wonder if this is even the original barrel?

What does the bore look like?

Have you tried slugging the bore?

Have you measured the throats on the cylinder?

As commented the front sight sucks. There is not enough material to file it lower and still be able to see it.

If this is a gun I really like I would probably track down a original 4” barrel that the bore is in very good condition and install it. Of course this means refinishing the gun. It would be a fun rabbit hole project. (I know about rabbits. My current rabbit hole project is a Glock 43X). You could end up with a neat big bore self-defense home and belt gun.

The nice thing about that type of revolver is any barrel blank can be used. Cut the correct threads and spin it in place. Not front lock up to worry over.

Kevin

In very same gun “ unmolested “ I focused point of aim with bullet and powder charge at 25’. Mine had 5” barrel and was in mint shape, didn’t want to file on sight.
My experience has run into many more revolvers that shot high. Even those with adj. sights couldn’t go far enough. You can custom load most fixed sight guns to point of aim at a fixed distance. What is PIA is if the gun is shooting off horizontal.

I bought it as I like it the way it is. To replace the barrel would mean it would have to be refinished to get it matching.......this equals more money. This is not and was not bought as a target piece. It is a pure defensive weapon, and will be used as a nightstand or truck gun. I was trained to never let your opponent get within 3 yards of you, at that range you don't use sights. Just like a computer--Point and click. In the event that I do shoot it at the range again would like it to shoot closer to POA. That is all.

 

[venomballistics]

I thought that a heavier slower bullet would raise the POI.

That would be correct.
Greater weight = lower velocity and greater reaction to action = greater dwell time under greater force.
I don't believe it is particularly relevant in this case as the range is short and the POI vs POA is rather extreme.
We may need to size a 45-70's 405G down to make this square up, which is absolutely ridiculous.
I think Alwslate's suspicion of an altered gun is well worth entertaining.
A combined rational approach would be to "Keith it" with a variety of loads until you determining how to best feed it prior to any trimming of any front blades.

::EDIT:: as I look at the OP's picture versus stock photo's, Ill go completely with Alwslate on this. That gun is modified.
No example of this revolver has a base as this one does.
I'd even go so far as to add that the barrel was likely trimmed as well, making the bubba special site necessary.

 

[Nevada Ed]

POA and "Barrel time" is a great idea but

I have seen revolvers and pistols with loads being fired
and in both cases, the bu;lets are out of the barrel, using factory ammo.

Super slow target loads will be in the longer barrels for just a mili second
and rise just a little bit.

They did not shot any snub nose barrels in these test, which might prove out this idea ?

 

[venomballistics]

POA and "Barrel time" is a great idea but

I have seen revolvers and pistols with loads being fired
and in both cases, the bu;lets are out of the barrel, using factory ammo.

Super slow target loads will be in the longer barrels for just a mili second
and rise just a little bit.

They did not shot any snub nose barrels in these test, which might prove out this idea ?

This may all be non applicable in this case. That gun has been with Bubba

 

[Drm50]

I can't offer an explanation, but sometimes with a good bit of load development, you can change the horizontal even if you didn't intend to do that. I've seen it often with rifle cartridge load development, but it occasionally happens with handgun loads as well.

For horizontal adjustments I’ve always found it faster and easier to shave down your boot heels. Shave on side you want point of aim to go.

 

[AJ]

For horizontal adjustments I’ve always found it faster and easier to shave down your boot heels. Shave on side you want point of aim to go.

How about I wear a flip-flop on one foot and a boot on the other?

 

[AJ]

This may all be non applicable in this case. That gun has been with Bubba

Of course it has been bubba'd. I have never seen a factory 2 inch New Service in .45 Colt. That is what intrigues me.

I had thoughts of doing a full "Fitz Special" on this gun. However, bobbing the hammer makes it difficult to shoot single action. Have a bobbed hammer revolver and at times would like to shoot it single action, but it is a PIA to do so, I do not have a problem getting my finger into the trigger guard, so no real reason to cut the forward portion away,

Colt New Service - Wikipedia

 

[venomballistics]

Of course it has been bubba'd. I have never seen a factory 2 inch New Service in .45 Colt. That is what intrigues me.

I had thoughts of doing a full "Fitz Special" on this gun. However, bobbing the hammer makes it difficult to shoot single action. Have a bobbed hammer revolver and at times would like to shoot it single action, but it is a PIA to do so, I do not have a problem getting my finger into the trigger guard, so no real reason to cut the forward portion away,

Colt New Service - Wikipedia

I'd agree with leaving the hammer be.
I've never had any issue drawing a full hammered revolver as I've trained myself to cover it with my thumb until clear.
I tend to run SA more than DA anyhow. So i'd keep it too.
That really just leaves making sense out of that front sight.
It seems to be some flavor of soldered / welded on ramp, sculpted to provide some of the function of a patridge sight.
I'm not sure how much blade will be left once you have it regulated, but I'll bet it'll be lower than a GI 1911 unless the base gets milled a bit as well.
Nothing wrong with a shooter grade as long as we're all in the know.

 

[BSA1]

AJ I strongly recommend you measure the throats on the cylinder. Colt is notorious for sloppy chamber throats. I once had a new Colt SAA with .457 - .458” throats. I sent the gun back to the factory and they returned it untouched with a note saying it was within factory specs and I should enjoy my “collectable” gun.

A quick easy bubba way to check the throats is to drop a lead bullet sized to .454” into each chamber. It it hangs up the you are g-t-g. If it falls easily through the chamber and onto the ground then they are oversize and accuracy will be a problem. Of course on your old gun you don’t have a lot of options.

I understand you wanting to keep it as is but it would make a fun rabbit hole project. (I am about ready to chase another rabbit).

 

[alwslate]

You can probably get point of impact close enough to point of aim for SD shooting by reducing the height of the front sight. One reason is that the shorter the barrel the less you have to raise the sight for a significant POI change by ratio and proportion.

 

[StrawHat]

I bought it as I like it the way it is. …it is a pure defensive weapon, and will be used as a nightstand or truck gun…

AJ,

Perfect revolver for that application! If you like it , I like it!

Well, almost like it. It is that off brand.

My bubba’d Model 25-2,

Kevin

 

[steelslaver]

Bullet is out the end of the barrel before you get much muzzle rise.

You haven't got much front sight to mess with so I would try going with a modified sight picture. Center of target with top of front sight with rear sight centered on where front sight meets the base.

But if you use it as a night stand gun aim below where neck meets shoulders

 

[venomballistics]

Bullet is out the end of the barrel before you get much muzzle rise.

You haven't got much front sight to mess with so I would try going with a modified sight picture. Center of target with top of front sight with rear sight centered on where front sight meets the base.

But if you use it as a night stand gun aim below where neck meets shoulders

give it another look ... I believe he can mill some sight base away and end up with a fairly attractive result that meets objectives.

 

[StrawHat]

give it another look ... I believe he can mill some sight base away and end up with a fairly attractive result that meets objectives.

If you read what AJ has written, he does not want to mill anything, not a lot, not a little. He intends to use this as a belly gun or maybe all the way out to 10 feet? I bet he will find a load he likes and call it good.

Kevin

 

[AJ]

AJ,

Perfect revolver for that application! If you like it , I like it!

Well, almost like it. It is that off brand.

My bubba’d Model 25-2,

Kevin

Was that the one you got a while back? Hawaii?

 

[AJ]

Bullet is out the end of the barrel before you get much muzzle rise.

You haven't got much front sight to mess with so I would try going with a modified sight picture. Center of target with top of front sight with rear sight centered on where front sight meets the base.

But if you use it as a night stand gun aim below where neck meets shoulders

If you read what AJ has written, he does not want to mill anything, not a lot, not a little. He intends to use this as a belly gun or maybe all the way out to 10 feet? I bet he will find a load he likes and call it good.

Kevin

Probably should practice the old "Instinct point".

 

[glenwolde]

I know! Mount a red dot on it!

 

[ArchAngelCD]

I thought that a heavier slower bullet would raise the POI.

You're probably right. Don't get old !!

 

[AJ]

I know! Mount a red dot on it!

Only folks with afflictions use those!

 

[RobertJ.]

That's a cool revolver! I love the finish.

Well, you've gotten a lot of suggestions, so I'll skip any I might give. Instead, I'll show you what I did when I had mine shortened.

I had a standard dovetail cut into the top of the barrel, and then stuck in a gold bead front sight from some vintage .22 rifle. When the bead is nestled in the groove, it shoots just a tad low (I'm shooting 8.5 gr. Unique/255 gr. SWC), but for close shooting (7 yards or less), I just put the bead just above the top of the rear groove for a dead-on zero. I could fix that if I wanted, but I don't think I need to. This is also easily adjusted for windage.

He dates to 1916, and that's his grandson he's posing with.