Magnifier and Red Dot Question

[rojodiablo]

That's what I thought. Explain to me why in post #3 you said a 3moa would become a 21" dot at 100 yards under 7x mag. The dot get bigger but so does the target, so the dot does not become 21", right?

No; with a laser, the point does not increase in size when it's focused on the correct plane; how do I say it properly?? Eotech's are designed specifically to not increase the dot at distance. But also, this is dependent on getting the layout correct. Put the magnifier in front of the red dot optic, and everything you see will be magnified.(It happens; people leave the red dot to the rear, and add the magnifier in front. Is supposed to be installed behind the red dot as it were, closest to the shooters' eye.
The difference between an Eotech and most other sights is the design of the laser layout; it will stay crystal clear while most other units will blur a bit as the image expands. Most units are not directly broadcast to the screen, they are reflectives, and just it works out different. A lot goes into the better optic red dots and holo units. You can tell by sharpness of image, and how the light is there, yet does not shine or glow as it is viewed.

As to the increase in the size of the dot vs. the target, the target size is not increased to the point where it is a '1 to1' image; with a 12x scope at 50 yds, the target looks bigger than the given size; you are looking at what PART of the bullseye you are aiming for. Yet the same 12x out at 250yds, you are looking to cover the bullseye with the crosshairs, and unless you have a fine crosshair, you are not really going to be splitting the dot, but rather completely covering it.

Did THAT explanation make sense? Trying hard to grasp for the right explanation here. Okay, yes; this is making sense.! If you put a magnifier BEFORE a scope, the crosshairs would expand, albeit slightly, because the focus of the magnifier part makes for less magnification up close, before the magnifier has achieved its' focus. (When we tried this stuff out, putting a 4x behind a 9x scope; the crosshairs all but disappeared, though the target WAS able to be double magnified after we adjusted the eye relief and focus on the scope. No benefit, just a wild try at something.)
A very fine laser is like a reticle; it's fixed so to say. And at distance, stand alone by itself it will cover a larger portion of the target. But a lesser red dot the light is not nearly as well designed, so it glows and grows as you magnify.

Sorry about the long winded jibberish.

 

[rojodiablo]

Also, proper focus is a little different than say a 1 to 1 magnification. Ala, clarity of the optic.

 

[ESW]

I think what you are saying is the holograph produces a sharper recital which does not blur as much when magnified. I don't think you are saying the dot actually gets exponentially bigger with other sights but that they gets blurrier which make them appear bigger and making it harder to select an aim point. I can understand cross hairs on a scope begin lost with double magnification, that's probably because you are focusing on a target so far away you cannot focus on both the target and the cross hair at the same time. They are so far apart.

I want to buy a magnifier for my XPS. I'm guessing XPS's 1 MOA will remain 1 MOA after it's magnified.

 

[SoCoRuss]

Maybe its just me but I just looked at a MSR at Bass Pro yesterday, it already had a EO Tech and magnifier on it and when you flipped the maginifier down and looked thru it both the reticle dot and circle both increased in size more than I expected. so the target and the reticle got larger looking thru it.

 

[ESW]

I think that what is supposed to happen, they both get larger but the dot still only covers 1" circle on the target