Model 14 with 4-inch barrel

[David LaPell]

A friend of mine picked up a Model 14 with a 4-inch heavy barrel. I know there were some 4-inch barreled guns and I heard some were marked for the Air Force, but where on these guns are the markings, and if it is a true 4-inch gun from either the Air Force or Dayton, OH PD how much is it worth? He has to get me the serial numbers later so I can see if it is one of the true 4-inch guns.

 

[linde]

A friend of mine picked up a Model 14 with a 4-inch heavy barrel. I know there were some 4-inch barreled guns and I heard some were marked for the Air Force, but where on these guns are the markings, and if it is a true 4-inch gun from either the Air Force or Dayton, OH PD how much is it worth? He has to get me the serial numbers later so I can see if it is one of the true 4-inch guns.

There were several versions of the 4" Model 14 and the serial number will be very helpful.

The first I'm aware of were pre-model 4-screws special ordered by the KCPD in 1957. These are generally in the K292XXX s/n range.

The second were special-made for the Air Force and examples have been found that are pre-14, 14 and 14-1 models so their s/n's are spread out. Some of these will letter as 6" and were send back to the factory to have the barrel cut to 4". If I remember correctly many were marked AFPG (Air Force Premium Grade) . . . do a thread search for AFPG and you'll find some very knowledgeable folks.

The third iteration I'm aware of were the 14-2 Dayton guns . . . not made for the Dayton PD but for Dayton Gun Headquarters. These were spread out from 1965 to roughly 1967. Again, a search of "Dayton" will provide a wealth of information. The 4" heavy barrel on the Dayton guns is very distinctive. Most are spread out in the K624XXX to K660XXX s/n range.

The fourth version I'm aware of were 14-3's shipped in July 1971 in the 1K3XXXX to 1K7XXXX s/n range. They were shipped to several S&W dealers (three that I'm aware of) and may have been a market test for the 4" heavy barrel Model 14.

Market value varies . . . a lot!

Russ

 

[18DAI]

There were also the 125 or so 4" full lug 14-6's made by the Performance Center for police PPC competition. Regards 18DAI

 

[LEO918]

I have a Model 14-3 with a 4" heavy barrel SN: 1K28324. Have not lettered it yet. Speculators think it may have shipped to in L.A.

 

[YeshuaIsa53]

I'll step out on a limb and say to a Model 14 collector, if a true Dayton HB, the value would be 30% or more higher than normal. To a shooter, I would not know. I am certain there would be great differences everywhere from moment to moment.

Seems there were some Kansas guns, too. It is most likely a Dayton if a 14-2 HB and a great gun. The AF markings would most likel;y be obvious.

 

[David LaPell]

I got off the phone with the owner, it is indeed a 14-1 and the serial number is K4537XX. The front sight is a standard ramp on a heavy barrel.

 

[linde]

I got off the phone with the owner, it is indeed a 14-1 and the serial number is K4537XX. The front sight is a standard ramp on a heavy barrel.

That could very well be a factory 4". I am aware of another 4" Model 14-1 with s/n K4538XX that letters as having shipped to an LA Wholesaler in 1961 . . . it could have been part of that shipment or part of that small "batch".

Good luck . . . let us hear back when you get to see it firsthand.

Russ

 

[michael thornton]

my afpg 14-1 is marked on the left side on the frame under the cyl, you would see it if it was so marked

 

[Bat Guano]

Ran into a Border Patrolman circa 1981 or so that had one issued to him. I didn't look it over closely but he was very specific that it was a M14, and the barrel was definitely a K-38 profile--just in 4". He was quite fond of it...

 

[rgmc2009]

To throw a curve into this thread, I have a Pre Mod 14, 4", SN K232XXX that letter as having shipped to the the U.S. Dept of Justice in 1955 in a Shipment of 10! Anyone have any idea of where these would have ended up....

 

[linde]

To throw a curve into this thread, I have a Pre Mod 14, 4", SN K232XXX that letter as having shipped to the the U.S. Dept of Justice in 1955 in a Shipment of 10! Anyone have any idea of where these would have ended up....

Welcome to the forum . . . and thanks for posting what may be the earliest example of a special-order 4" (heavy) Combat Masterpiece. Very interesting . . . hopefully others will be able to respond with more information about where they might have ended up.

In addition to the 10 in the 1955 shipment, was there any indication in the factory letter that there were other shipments in the DOJ order?

Based on the serial number and ship date I expect yours is a 5-screw example (four side plate plus one at the front of the trigger guard). We would all enjoy seeing pictures if you're able to post them.

Russ

 

[rgmc2009]

It is a 5 screw. I'll try to get some pictures posted. No mention of add'l shipments in the letter.

 

[rgmc2009]

Pre Mod 14, 4" shipped 1955 to U.S. Dept of Justice

 

[Bat Guano]

It could have been a Border Patrol gun as mentioned in my previous post above. INS was in DOJ, and the BP was a branch of INS.

I have a copy of a Service-wide firearms inventory from about 1974, though, and while it mentions numerous K frames (and a LOT of other things) to include Model 15s and 6" K-38s, there is no mention of any 4" K-38s. But inventories were riddled with errors then and now; plus it wouldn't take much for these guns to be lumped in with Model 15s for inventory purposes.

Anyway, that was the only one I ever saw.

 

[rgmc2009]

I thought of that when I read your post. Thanks for the feedback!

 

[tomjak2000]

Model 14-1 4 " Nickel

I found a model 14-1 4" heavy barrel w/nickel finish s/n#K455xxx for sale.
It has excellent finish, seems too nice to be a 1961 gun. The front site is ramped and pinned. What are the chances on this gun being original? The grips are two pieced wooden finger grooved. The asking price is $400.

 

[murphydog]

The gun itself may be an original 4", but very unlikely to have been a factory nickel gun. The stocks do not sound period factory, either. Can you post a photo?

 

[tomjak2000]

It's at the gunshop, don't know if they let me take photos. I may just buy it if the price isn't too much. The sn# apperars to be struck after the finish. I have not seen a pinned front ramp sight. The trigger and hammer are jeweled, the gap is quite narrow, and when locked up, the rear play is very minimal, and the rotation seems acceptable. I'm no expert. Maybe I should pass on this one.

 

[fat tom]

Maybe I should pass on this one.

At $400,that's what I would do. JMO.
f.t.

 

[tomjak2000]

Thanks f.t., Definitly giving it more thought. I prefer original guns. The grips narrow towards the bottom, I think Fuzzy, sure is purdy and looks fun to shoot. All numbers match.