Model 360PD Scandium/Titanium 357 Snub Nose Question

[Rhetorician]

Hello all:

I had always wanted a Smith snub nose. So when I ran across a Model 360PD Scandium/Titanium 357 I had to get it. Got a great buy on it.

Had to put a Hi Viz front sight on it, it did not have the one that came with the stock ones from the factory. The one SW suggested was installed by my local smith who did a very professional job. Problem is, it is a bit higher than the one that would come on the weapon from the factory.

Problem, I cannot hit a thing with it, even when cocking the hammer. I am all over the place. I came to the carry/shooting game late at 62. But have been told by several with whom I shoot that I am more than just a decent shooter. I probably should not be prideful about the thing but am a little nonetheless.

Here is where I need some help from my fellows here on the board. Since I purchased the piece at my local pawn emporium without papers and box, I need to know where I can go to get a sight picture so as to adjust my shooting?

I might also mention that I have installed a set of those belt clip stocks on the little snubby. The LGS guy said it could also be throwing off my placement on the trigger, which in turn could also mess up my trigger pull as he demonstrated for me.

So the first thing I will do is to replace those clip stocks for the factory ones. I will, however, still need to know where to go to get that sight picture?

Any help appreciated.

Thanks,

rd

 

[Josh M.]

If you're new to shooting snubbies, you picked a hekofa model to learn on.

The lighter and smaller guns are typically much less forgiving.

Just what kind of groups are you getting, at what distance?
And what ammos have ypu tried?

 

[Rhetorician]

Question Response

If you're new to shooting snubbies, you picked a hekofa model to learn on.

The lighter and smaller guns are typically much less forgiving.

Just what kind of groups are you getting, at what distance?
And what ammos have ypu tried?

Josh,

Thanks for the comeback. I am most chagrined for today I was using Tulu (sp) steel cased ammo. When I shot I could not even get them out of the cylinder. I have been shooting the orange box Tennessee reloads different weights and mostly 38 specials no +p or 357. You always get what you pay for it seems?!

One major problem I have had is the trigger on this thing. It is ridiculously hard to pull in double action. So I was thinking that if I cocked it I could do better but to no avail. I really did think I could learn to hit with it in an acceptable manner with it cocked--but to no avail thus far.

Another issue is that I started out with a Ruger LCR 357 and a buttery smooth trigger. I hit pie plates at 21' with 2 to 3 inch groups.

This Smith is about to kill me. I refuse to have such an expensive weapon and have to do a trigger job or some such to have the same capability as the Ruger. Maybe this is just an investment piece and not a carry piece.

But any way, if I focus on it and think about it, I can become more and more frustrated. Almost enough to make me take Smith and Wesson's name in vain.

But I know that some of it is me. That is why I wanted the sight picture and I wanted to put the gun back like it was when it came to me. I had the feelings that at least then I could hit something with it. It may end up a safe queen or being traded. I know what the Rugers will do and I know what I can do with them (or at least this one I own). But I want to give this the full benefit of the doubt.

But I don't think I want a gun that I cannot hit with.

Thoughts?

 

[Outlaw2013]

The trigger is heavy because its a no holster pocket gun. Well, at least that's how I roll with my 340PD (no hammer). Don't want to Plaxico Burres yourself and all that.

To me, these ultra light Magnum pocket rockets are "gut guns". Not really meant for 10+ yard engagements. It's a last resort pull it out and shove it to the attacker and let loose type plan B defensive weapon.

I know all this probably doesn't help you, but I thought I'd throw some thoughts out there. Good luck with it.

 

[shottist]

A higher than stock front sight is not conducive to hitting where you are aiming. Enough with the magnums. Go back and start with .38 wadcutters and work your way up. A scandium .357 snub is a hand full for just about all of us. Shoot at contact ranges, suggest 7 yards. That is what this piece is intended for although quality snubbies can be amazingly accurate. Good Luck.

 

[cmj8591]

Get a big paper silhouette target and draw a 4 inch circle in the middle of it to use for an aiming point. Find a bench, sit down and rest the gun on some sand bags. This removes most of the shooter induced variables. I would do this from about 25 feet. Use a mid range or target 38 load and shoot single action. Unless the gun is tweeked beyond all comprehension you should get some type of decent group that should give you an idea about where your gun is shooting.

 

[rmcnelly]

I have a 342PD (Titanium) that came with a Big Dot front sight installed and I couldn't shoot consistent groups, as the sight was big and sat higher than stock. Fortunately the original sight came with the gun, and I was able to shoot reasonable groups when I installed it in place of the Big Dot.

The stock DA trigger was very stiff, and improved with some polishing and lighter springs. It stiffens after only shooting a couple of cylinders of ammo and it's still not as smooth as the trigger job I've done on a 638.

 

[rmcnelly]

I'd suggest getting the stock sight installed. If the one you have doesn't fit within the rear sight frame, you'll never get a clean sight picture.

I'm 55 and need readers to focus on anything close. I had some laser grips on the 342PD for awhile, which removes any problem with sight picture.

 

[Goblin]

Your 360 should shoot groups as well as your LCR if you do your part. As you mentioned, every aspect of shooting a J frame is more difficult than larger guns, or even the LCR. Take the advice of cmj8591 and see where the gun is hitting in relation to your point of aim. Most likely it's shooting low since you have a taller sight. If you can't get 3" groups at 7 yards, you should try sight black to help you shoot more precisely. Sometimes white dot, night sights or fiber optics are hard to shoot with precision. After you can tell us how high or low it's shooting, we can't help you very much. Outlaw's statement about this being a belly gun isn't much of an exaggeration. If you can learn to shoot quickly into an 8" circle at 7 yards, that's about as good most people will ever be with a J snub.

 

[Irn-Bru]

I'm a pretty poor shot with revolvers and especially J Frames. I fitted my 432PD with Crimson Trace grips and never looked back. I still try to practice without, but these are zeroed in and hit exactly where I want. Just an option.

 

[regalsc]

I have one J with an exposed hammer (337ti) & 1 with an enclosed hammer (340pd no lock) . 10.8 oz & 11.4 oz & I don't find either one to have a heavy trigger pull but maybe I have built up some strength from dry fire & range practice. At first I couldn't group but learning trigger control with the proper grip I have gotten much better. I'm over 60 also so don't give up.

 

[Rhetorician]

Response Question

I'm a pretty poor shot with revolvers and especially J Frames. I fitted my 432PD with Crimson Trace grips and never looked back. I still try to practice without, but these are zeroed in and hit exactly where I want. Just an option.

Hello Irn Bru,

Tell me more about the Crimson Trace grips? Prices? How they work? Differences between the iron sights and the Crimson Trace? and any other information you wan to relate? The DS 124 model seems to be the least expensive, is there any difference in which one to buy? or no?

Please advise as to any and all information concerning the Crimson Trace sights.

Thanks ahead of time.

rd

 

[claudel]

I found these charts on the 'net somewhere.

All glory to the original poster(s)

 

[kaaskop49]

It's a little brute of a gun. It can punish you even with .38s. Don't be reluctant to install comfy rubber grips, the kind that cover the backstrap. I'm thinking of Pachmayr Compacs. Boot grips leave the backstrap uncovered. Put some cushioning between you and the grip frame.

Also use a shooting glove: a bit more cushion. I have the same gun in its early Sc version and I used these items to help me shoot the gun. If not careful, you can incur nerve damage in the web of your hand. Restrict the number of rounds you shoot, if not doing so already. 20-25 seems good.

A good target is a blank piece of 8.5x11" typing paper, say at 3 yards if the range allows it. The approximate size of a human torso. You can open the range when you develop skill. This is not the gun to drive yourself crazy shooting bullseyes.

Lastly, are you using proper shooting technique? Are you following through on the trigger after each shot? Not doing so may cause change of impact on target. My retired FBI instructor still points out flaws from time to time, and I'm happy for the help. Good luck.

Kaaskop49
Shield #5103

 

[Rhetorician]

Rhetorician Response

It's a little brute of a gun. It can punish you even with .38s. Don't be reluctant to install comfy rubber grips, the kind that cover the backstrap. I'm thinking of Pachmayr Compacs. Boot grips leave the backstrap uncovered. Put some cushioning between you and the grip frame.

Also use a shooting glove: a bit more cushion. I have the same gun in its early Sc version and I used these items to help me shoot the gun. If not careful, you can incur nerve damage in the web of your hand. Restrict the number of rounds you shoot, if not doing so already. 20-25 seems good.

A good target is a blank piece of 8.5x11" typing paper, say at 3 yards if the range allows it. The approximate size of a human torso. You can open the range when you develop skill. This is not the gun to drive yourself crazy shooting bullseyes.

Lastly, are you using proper shooting technique? Are you following through on the trigger after each shot? Not doing so may cause change of impact on target. My retired FBI instructor still points out flaws from time to time, and I'm happy for the help. Good luck.

Kaaskop49
Shield #5103

Kaashop49,

Thanks for the comeback and the observations. I like your, "This is not the gun to drive yourself crazy shooting bullseyes" comment.

I had about decided to either: sell the thing; or trade it off for something I know I will like and can shoot; or clean it up oil it and make a "safe queen" of it. I am still not sure that I will not do one or the other. But the darn thing cost me so little and the prices on them are going out of sight, it is worth keeping just as an investment. You have made me think twice about doing anything rash or hasty!!

And then again, everyone ought to have at least one J Frame, true?

Thoughts.

rd

 

[murphydog]

From what I have seen, the temptation with the Hi-Viz front sight is to not use the square top to keep flush with the top of the rear notch. There can be all sorts of ways your eyes may try to line up the round colored spot in the rear sight, and this may be part of your problem.

You also mentioned you have less problems shooting different guns, presumably with the same ammo? This may be anticipating the recoil or flinching off target, not unusual with these super-lightweight revolvers. A dry-firing regimen followed by the lightest loads possible at the range may lessen or cure this, or you may need to use a gun that you have 100% confidence in using. Please let us know what happens.

 

[Mike_Fontenot]

I have a 360sc, which was the predecessor of the 360PD. (I liked it so much that I bought another one just like it). I rarely shoot it DA, but it has always had a very nice SA trigger (probably about 2-1/2 lb), without any trigger job. It also is surprisingly accurate for a snubby. I carried it for years as my only gun, and for the last three years or so it's been my BUG in a front pocket ... an 11oz .357mag is an engineering triumph! Maybe there's something wrong with your particular gun ... maybe S&W will take a look at it for free(?).

 

[kaaskop49]

I had about decided to either: sell the thing; or trade it off for something I know I will like and can shoot; or clean it up oil it and make a "safe queen" of it. I am still not sure that I will not do one or the other. But the darn thing cost me so little and the prices on them are going out of sight, it is worth keeping just as an investment. You have made me think twice about doing anything rash or hasty!!

And then again, everyone ought to have at least one J Frame, true?

Thoughts.

rd

Cannot really advise you, except that I don't consider guns as "investment vehicles"/safe queens. There are gold watches and Faberge eggs to fill that role. Even tripling your $ at some future date, the dollar will be worth less so what have you gained?

Many 340/360 owners on this Forum use their guns as .38s. Nothing wrong with that. I've never really liked my 360Sc, still don't, but I finally shot it with the CCI Blazer .357 load I always recommend. Controllable, and no crimp jump. So I keep the gun. Sell the long-barrel stuff, if you must, but keep the snubs.

Have you considered some competent instruction? Tell the instructor what you're looking to do, and see if they can help you. As I said in my earlier post, the 360 is a beast with Mags and can be a handful with .38s. Good luck and good shooting.

Kaaskop49
Shield #5103