I would like to know if it would be safe to shoot an occasional +p round in this revolver. Also birth date if possible S/N CAD30xx, In the yoke there is a 215 and in the shroud a letter "S". Thanks for any help.
Model 60-4 Question
- Thread starter Jonzim
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Yes you can shoot +P's on a limited basis. The -4 was prior to the specific heat treating process for +P's (that was done on the -7) but a box a year won't hurt it any.
As far as the date goes, my copy (first ed.) of SCSW only goes up to 1994 so I can not be precise, but if I had to guess I'd say around 1996 - 1997.
As far as the date goes, my copy (first ed.) of SCSW only goes up to 1994 so I can not be precise, but if I had to guess I'd say around 1996 - 1997.
Hey, Jonzim. I have the more recent, 3rd edition of SCSW. CAD in serials is tough to be precise on. CAM is 1/96, CAF is 10/03, CAN is also 1/96.
The engineering and production changes shows a 60-4 target variant as 1990. Boy, I really haven't helped, have I! Thought this was going to be easy. No good deed goes unpunished. Hope some of the knowledgeable folks will chime in here.
Kaaskop49
The engineering and production changes shows a 60-4 target variant as 1990. Boy, I really haven't helped, have I! Thought this was going to be easy. No good deed goes unpunished. Hope some of the knowledgeable folks will chime in here.
Kaaskop49
Kernel Crittenden
US Veteran, Absent Comrade
Likely Jan/Feb 1995.
Any S&W that has a "model #" imprinted on the frame is capable of handling +P, but the lighter the gun the fewer should be used. A few boxes a year won't hurt anything. Check out the FBI "The Load" as published in the Speer #8 loading manual. This was back in the 60's and those revolvers, many J Frames, digested it.
bronco45
Member
The "LOAD" in Speer#8, is stiff and intended for N frame Model 20 Outdoorsmen. I have a 60-4 and a K38 and I wouldn't shoot that Speer load in either one, once. You'll shake that gun to pieces in short order.
+Ps from the Ammo Cos. are usually 16-22 Kpsi. The#8 load is 26K +. My 60-4 is a solid, accurate revolver and I have no fear running modern factory +Ps in it. My practice load is a 158SWC at 800fps.
+Ps from the Ammo Cos. are usually 16-22 Kpsi. The#8 load is 26K +. My 60-4 is a solid, accurate revolver and I have no fear running modern factory +Ps in it. My practice load is a 158SWC at 800fps.
The 60-4 w/ the full lug was specifically designed to be able to handle +P loads-- that was part of the marketing mantra at the time.
I was looking at the 631 4" 32mag early '90s and had some questions. Called S&W, and was transferred to their repair dept. Got one of their smiths, who proceeded to steer the conversation to the then-new 60-4, which I had dismissed cuz of the shorter 3" bbl. He was really excited about it, said it was his favorite Smith in current production, and that one of the reasons was that it could shoot the +P rounds. He talked me into it.
Course wouldn't you know the 4" 631 is worth a lot more these days, but oh well-- I'm very happy w/ the 60-4, very accurate.
I was looking at the 631 4" 32mag early '90s and had some questions. Called S&W, and was transferred to their repair dept. Got one of their smiths, who proceeded to steer the conversation to the then-new 60-4, which I had dismissed cuz of the shorter 3" bbl. He was really excited about it, said it was his favorite Smith in current production, and that one of the reasons was that it could shoot the +P rounds. He talked me into it.
Course wouldn't you know the 4" 631 is worth a lot more these days, but oh well-- I'm very happy w/ the 60-4, very accurate.
Thanks for all of the reply's. I use +p rounds in my Marlin 1894c and have a lot around. Wanted to make sure there woulds not be an issue is I mistakenly loaded a +p into the 60-4. It is a sweet shooter. Usually carry two CCI shot shells and three Magtec 158gr HP when working around the yard. Just lucked upon it at a Pawn Shop last year and, happy ever after. Thanks again.
If you can't find a 60-4, try and find a 36-6, which is the matte blued carbon steel version of the 60-4. Unfortunately, they made a very very limited run of these, I understand around 615. so it will be easier to find the 60-4.
Dale53
Member
A bit of history, here...
Gun Digest (I believe it was in the Handloader Digest) a year of so before Smith came out with the 36-6, ran a nice article by a gentleman who had built a similar revolver for field use. I was counting up my nickels to see if it was practical to have one gunsmithed for my self. Money was rather tight, back in the day, but the concept really caught my fancy.
I just happened to be a the Indy 500 gunshow, a low and behold, they had a couple of the 36-6's (limited edition). I didn't have a lot of cast with me, and, not realizing that this was a VERY limited edition, I passed. Well, I stewed and stewed and could hardly wait until the next Indy 500 show. I got there and discovered that there were NO MORE. Oh, woe is me (he who hesitates is lost, etc.).
However, they had the NEW 60-4. I was disappointed that it didn't have a 4" barrel. I'm a shooter and didn't have much faith in the shorter barrel. 4" would have been perfect for my tastes. Oh well, didn't want to pass it up, again, so I took one home.
I got to the range and was nearly blown away by how much better the double underlug barrel held. That extra bit of weight out front more than made up for the short barrel (compared to my 631, as a for instance).
I won't repeat the scores that I was getting at 25 yards for fear of being called a liar, but it was eye opening for both me and the shooters around me.
It made a perfect companion piece to my bird gun (Beretta Silver Snipe over/under) for those sitting rabbits, etc. I took a number of cottontails, snowshoe rabbits, and wounded and sitting grouse with that piece and it will be one that I will own until I can no longer shoot.
Just goes to show that sometimes, just sometimes, you CAN teach an old dog a new trick...
Back on topic. Yes, it is safe to shoot occasional Plus P loads in the 60-4. A most effective load is Ed Harris' "full charge wadcutter" - it is a standard pressure load that is VERY effrective and will not beat up the gun.
http://www.grantcunningham.com/blog_files/75f11fe4e235da7c69cabf94daa7dbd9-932.html
Dale53
Gun Digest (I believe it was in the Handloader Digest) a year of so before Smith came out with the 36-6, ran a nice article by a gentleman who had built a similar revolver for field use. I was counting up my nickels to see if it was practical to have one gunsmithed for my self. Money was rather tight, back in the day, but the concept really caught my fancy.
I just happened to be a the Indy 500 gunshow, a low and behold, they had a couple of the 36-6's (limited edition). I didn't have a lot of cast with me, and, not realizing that this was a VERY limited edition, I passed. Well, I stewed and stewed and could hardly wait until the next Indy 500 show. I got there and discovered that there were NO MORE. Oh, woe is me (he who hesitates is lost, etc.).
However, they had the NEW 60-4. I was disappointed that it didn't have a 4" barrel. I'm a shooter and didn't have much faith in the shorter barrel. 4" would have been perfect for my tastes. Oh well, didn't want to pass it up, again, so I took one home.
I got to the range and was nearly blown away by how much better the double underlug barrel held. That extra bit of weight out front more than made up for the short barrel (compared to my 631, as a for instance).
I won't repeat the scores that I was getting at 25 yards for fear of being called a liar, but it was eye opening for both me and the shooters around me.
It made a perfect companion piece to my bird gun (Beretta Silver Snipe over/under) for those sitting rabbits, etc. I took a number of cottontails, snowshoe rabbits, and wounded and sitting grouse with that piece and it will be one that I will own until I can no longer shoot.
Just goes to show that sometimes, just sometimes, you CAN teach an old dog a new trick...
Back on topic. Yes, it is safe to shoot occasional Plus P loads in the 60-4. A most effective load is Ed Harris' "full charge wadcutter" - it is a standard pressure load that is VERY effrective and will not beat up the gun.
http://www.grantcunningham.com/blog_files/75f11fe4e235da7c69cabf94daa7dbd9-932.html
Dale53
greenmachine
Member
I bought a 36-6 when they first came out simply because of the full underlug barrel. I loved the additional forward weight. Then they came out with the same thing in stainless and I was sick. Couldn't afford another 'toy' gun at the time so I had to pass. But when a 60-4 recently became available (love the target hammer and target trigger) I jumped all over it. I'm sure the seller was elated to get his price, and that's fine with me. I now have (IMHO) the sweetest two J-Frames ever. Did I mention they both have adjustable sights?
Kernel Crittenden
US Veteran, Absent Comrade
Never understood why S&W was so stingy with the 3" J-frames with adjustable sights. They cranked out the stubbies like hot cakes. But there never seemed to be enough 3-inchers made to satisfy demand. Now the old ones are so expensive it's ridiculous.
I handled one of those 3" bbl. adj. sight 60s in the late 80s, if I remember correctly. An absolutely super gun! The 3" offers much more velocity than the shorter bbls. A great kit gun.
