Ok I'm hooked

Thanks called them yesterday. He all but laughed. Not really but he did wish me luck. I don't mind ordering one from somewhere. I just have to find the somewhere. LOL

There is a gun show next week but my guess is the prices, if they have one, will be pretty steep. Also they will probably sell them too.

thanks though
 
Never thought of that one. I'll see what they have to say.
thanks.
 
I can understand if your set on the M&P but honestly you can probably do better price wise at the gun show, buy a stripped lower, parts kit and have an upper built and still be under that price.
 
thndrchiken said:
I can understand if your set on the M&P but honestly you can probably do better price wise at the gun show, buy a stripped lower, parts kit and have an upper built and still be under that price.
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Well your right. I can build one cheaper. I can get a Del-Ton rifle kit for about 449 plus 115 otd for a stripped lower locally and a rear sight for around 60 bucks or so. That would be about 624 plus tax, about 30 bucks. So it would run about 655 or so. Problem being availability of the kit and questionable warranty. Now I can get a complete Palmetto State Armory ar for about 669 plus shipping, a guess would be about 25 bucks and 20 for the ffl. About 710 or there abouts. Don't know much about Palmetto their quality or the warranty reputation.

Now another alternative would be the New Frontier complete lower, 99 bucks shipped and a Del-Ton upper for 399. Total would be about 605 with a guess for shipping of 25 bucks, 60 for rear sight and 20 ffl fee.

Hey I am open to suggestions. I want a good serviceable reliable ar. Any suggestions?

I called a local WalMart. I even gave them the WalMart number and they claim they don't sell Smith and Wesson rifles at all. Don't have them in their catalog.
 
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thndrchiken said:
I can understand if your set on the M&P but honestly you can probably do better price wise at the gun show, buy a stripped lower, parts kit and have an upper built and still be under that price.
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the gun shows I have been to recently have been way overpriced on everything with the upcoming election. You can always build one cheaper than you can buy one. But you cant build a warranty and sometimes a little peace of mind is not a bad thing. No offense meant thnderchicken. And I am sorry but the barrel that S&W put on the sport knocks the ball out of the park. I have side by side compared my Sport to a Colt AR15A3 H-BAR and a Bushmaster Patrolman (I think thats what its called) and the Sports accuracy is a lot better and more consistant with the same ammo!
 
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Things are goin nuts on prices. I was at a site the other night to price out a kit and an upper. I went back in the morning and the kit went up 20 bucks and the upper went up 50 over night!!

There are a couple of gun shows comin up but like you said I would expect the prices to be unreasonable. Finding it on line would be best but you have to find it.

Sure I would like the dust cover and the FA but the big thing is the S&W warranty. I don't know about the other builders. Maybe or maybe not.
 
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thumbs said:
Now another alternative would be the New Frontier complete lower, 99 bucks shipped and a Del-Ton upper for 399. Total would be about 605 with a guess for shipping of 25 bucks, 60 for rear sight and 20 ffl fee.
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I just put together a cheap AR, using the New Frontier Lower. Bought it at Joeboboutfitters.com for 99 shipped. Bought a DPMS flat top upper with M4 lightweight contoured barrel from Midway for 383.00 shipped (They went out of stock on this upper the day after I bought mine...) My FFL fee was 20 bucks (but I get to split that 3 way because this lower arrived today along with 2 Mosin Nagant 91/30 rifles and he only charged me the 20 bucks since it went on the same form).

First thing I did when I got home was half way check out the lower then slipped that upper on and put a 30 round mag loaded with tulammo in it and went and shot all 30 rounds. I had put a TruGlo red dot on it, with empy mag it weigh 6 lbs. I fired without flaw. About every other shot, I would pull the bolt back just enough to see the shell and ease it back forward and use the forward assist to finish loading (hey, it's something these sport owners can't do and I know it secretly drives them nuts!!!:D). Mainly I did it because on the AR15 forum, I saw a thread from a dude that was say his forward assist wouldn't do that, both him and his buddies. Everyone else that replied said theres worked. Apparently he found out that maybe it was the ammo he was using (I'd have to check that thread again). Anyway, it worked with Tulammo.

It is the tighest fighting AR I've seen yet, talking about the mating between the upper and lower. I suspect this will loosen up with use. The pins that retain the upper are plastic as well. Only metal in it is the buffer tube assembly (and its commercial, not mil-spec), the TCG pins and springs. If the plastic upper retaining pins were to become worn, they would be replaced with regular steel pins. Everything in the lower can be replaced with anything from any other AR lower. I was told they used the commercial tube as opposed to the mil-spec to save money to be able to meet the price point they wanted. No big deal really, is looked and operates exactly like my mil-spec AR's.

The trigger feel is awesome! No grit, no creep what so ever. About normal weight in pull, but it just breaks, like snapping spaghetti. There was zero lube in the lower, I'm not sure what to use, but I fired it dry. Mags insert and release freely, no play when installed. Pretty impressive really, for a complete 99.00 lower. My biggest gripe about it is the molded in flat trigger guard. I don't know why they didn't put one more like what the sport has, would have been much better, IMO, and I wouldn't think it would have added anything to the cost.
 
thumbs said:
Things are goin nuts on prices. I was at a site the other night to price out a kit and an upper. I went back in the morning and the kit went up 20 bucks and the upper went up 50 over night!!

There are a couple of gun shows comin up but like you said I would expect the prices to be unreasonable. Finding it on line would be best but you have to find it.

Sure I would like the dust cover and the FA but the big thing is the S&W warranty. I don't know about the other builders. Maybe or maybe not.
Click to expand...

I don't know where you are located, but there are deals to be had at gun shows, at least here in Kansas. I'd say about 90% of the AR stuff is a little high compared to only, but if you look around, and do it early, you'll get some good deals. I say early because they get snatched up fast. I bought the M&P15A at a show for 870.00. The M&P15 300 whisper for 900.00 (actually I had seen this gun at the last two shows, same dealer, decided I needed it at the last show after looking at it several times and then someone else was asking about it (probably some shill, sp)). There were some complete DPMS Oracles for just over 600.00, a Core15 with MOE furniture for 735 OTD. Or, if you really felt spendy, you coulda had one of the two Sports I saw for 799.00, and the other for 899.00, marked down from 999.00:) Not saying the Sports a bad rifle, cause it's not, those were just some of the more insane gun show prices I'd seen (and there were plenty others, especially if it had the name Colt on it!)
 
Rod thanks

Good to hear a "review" from a forum member. I had heard good things about the New Frontier lower. I am to understand it "is not" the Plum Crazy lower but it built a bit beefier. To tell ya the truth it makes me reconsider the build. Gotta find a good upper though.

Thanks
 
crracer_712 said:
I don't know where you are located, but there are deals to be had at gun shows, at least here in Kansas. I'd say about 90% of the AR stuff is a little high compared to only, but if you look around, and do it early, you'll get some good deals. I say early because they get snatched up fast. I bought the M&P15A at a show for 870.00. The M&P15 300 whisper for 900.00 (actually I had seen this gun at the last two shows, same dealer, decided I needed it at the last show after looking at it several times and then someone else was asking about it (probably some shill, sp)). There were some complete DPMS Oracles for just over 600.00, a Core15 with MOE furniture for 735 OTD. Or, if you really felt spendy, you coulda had one of the two Sports I saw for 799.00, and the other for 899.00, marked down from 999.00:) Not saying the Sports a bad rifle, cause it's not, those were just some of the more insane gun show prices I'd seen (and there were plenty others, especially if it had the name Colt on it!)
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Rod, I do not mean to disrespect you but here in Western Kansas I cannot shop at a gun show...yeah you can buy used AR15's and Bushmaster's for under $700 but try to buy anything else and they basically bend you dry over the counter. I believe as a population and with some of the new TV shows they are promoting a hysteria with the public. But the gun shows I have been to recently have been horror stories and because they carry items that you cannot freely purchase here at the edge of the known universe they basically write their own prices. For instance I was looking for a set of .223/5.56x45 reloading dies. I found 4 the cheapest being RCBS for $49 dollars. I ordered some from the web for $26 free shipping. Gun shows aren't necessarily the deals they can be!!
 
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What I am looking for is a good reliable ar. I'm not looking for show or to impress. I am looking for a working rifle that I can rely on at a good price. I keep hearing from my LGS's that there isn't much difference in a build or buying the complete rifle. I know that isn't true. The sport is the least expensive ar I can find and I really can't find one. I would expect the prices around here at the shows to be at least in the 700 dollar mark it not pushing 800.

Ok who makes a good reliable upper at a good price? Is chrome lined that much better? I'm not looking for junk but a good solid upper at a reasonable price. Where would you builders go for your uppers?

thanks guys
 
Rod also...it does not in any way drive me nuts because I cannot pull back a bullet and then drive it forward, I rarely if ever used the FA in combat situations (and that is why the VA still takes care of me) because I have been there. I would never want to disrespect you but show me a semi-auto that has a forward assist other than a *** military rifle, and I will show you another *** that someone has decided that they cannnot fire without having to manually shove the bolt home!!! Still like ya bro!!
 
Well, Grover, I inserteed that line for one reason. And it worked!:D Sorry, but I just could resist doing it:D

Oh, and no disrespect on the gun show. You've seen what you've seen, I've seen what I've seen. In case you were wondering, all the prices I mentioned was on new stuff, and just from the ones I've been too, the used stuff is generally way high, in the new to higher than new area.

Thumbs, I haven't REALLY compared it to the plumb crazy. I saw a dealer with a half dozen lowers of plumb's, but they were priced around 140.00 and I didn't really look them over other than the roll mark. But you are right, at least NFA claims they are using a 'better' (for lack of better word) polymer for their lower. If this is going to be your first AR, or your one an only, I don't think I'd recommend a polymer lower. I'd hate to see all your friends make too much fun of you right off the bat. I don't care, all my friends make fun of me all the time, and some times I do to myself.
 
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This will be my first ar period. I may or may not buy or build another. I guess my first concern is function. Where ever I end up I want it to work. I don't think I have to spend 1500 bucks to get a good, serviceable reliable rifle. Looking for a cost effective build not a cheap build.
 
Hey thumbs, I picked up my S&W AR @ Insite Firearms and Law Enforcement Supply. They are in Jeffersonville ( near Norristown ). They have competetive prices vs some rapist LGS around here and they are good people taboot.

You could always go for an online deal but check them out..

In Site Firearms and Law Enforcement Supply - Montgomery County ...In Site Firearms and Law Enforcement Supply - Montgomery County & Philadelphia
 
thumbs said:
Well your right. I can build one cheaper. I can get a Del-Ton rifle kit for about 449 plus 115 otd for a stripped lower locally and a rear sight for around 60 bucks or so. That would be about 624 plus tax, about 30 bucks. So it would run about 655 or so. Problem being availability of the kit and questionable warranty. Now I can get a complete Palmetto State Armory ar for about 669 plus shipping, a guess would be about 25 bucks and 20 for the ffl. About 710 or there abouts. Don't know much about Palmetto their quality or the warranty reputation.

Now another alternative would be the New Frontier complete lower, 99 bucks shipped and a Del-Ton upper for 399. Total would be about 605 with a guess for shipping of 25 bucks, 60 for rear sight and 20 ffl fee.

Hey I am open to suggestions. I want a good serviceable reliable ar. Any suggestions?

I called a local WalMart. I even gave them the WalMart number and they claim they don't sell Smith and Wesson rifles at all. Don't have them in their catalog.
Click to expand...

Building an AR is a lot of fun! Don't fear Palmetto State Armory for parts or their kit minus the lower receiver or even a complete AR. PSA is top notch for the money, better than Del-Ton.

I wouldn't go with a polymer lower though, after all it's the firearm legally and you want something that will last a lifetime so get a standard 7075 alloy lower receiver to go along with the same in the upper receiver.

I bought a stripped S&W M&P-15 lower three years ago and topped it off with a Daniel Defense upper and other quality components. The AR came in around $850 but it's equal to a Daniel Defense that costs hundreds more. Of course you can come in much cheaper for a basic AR but don't go too cheap. Aim high enough so you're pleased with the finished product.

The S&W stripped lower is high quality, I highly recommend it Very nice flared magwell and excellent finish and it's hard to beat its rollmark. Of course the complete Sport is a bargain. I would rate it higher than Del-Ton and maybe slightly less than a PSA build.
 
Quentin; The PSA stuff gets good reviews but I dont know that I would rate it higher than the Sport, the one thing the Sport has that sets it apart is its barrel. If PSA were to offer a similar barrel that would be a different story. No offense meant and this is all just my opinion, but my Sport is unbelievably accurate to a level that is hard to match. But other than the barrel and the lack of a F/A and dust cover they are all the same basically.
 
Good info guys thanks. Yeah I hear ya about the locals. I called three places that had them today. Well they had them. The prices were more than I was willing to pay. At least right now. Found a CMMG stripped lower locally for 115 out the door. Didn't seem to bad to me.

I found a PSA complete rifle for about 669 plus shipping and ffl. Probably about 700 out the door. Don't know for sure. It is in stock so they say.

The only concern with PSA is the short time in business. Oh well ya gotta start somewhere.

Splittiebus66

I looked on the site but it looks like they don't have the sport or any 5.56 in stock. They may but it's not on their site.

I swing like a pendulum but maybe the PSA rifle is the way to go. Well at this point anyway. lol
 
Yeah thanks. That's exactly what I did. I didn't go down far enough. I just looked down the liset never noticed it was just handguns. I did notice there seemed to be a lot of handguns on that list though. LOL

I'll check them out on Monday.
 
oneyeopn said:
Quentin; The PSA stuff gets good reviews but I dont know that I would rate it higher than the Sport, the one thing the Sport has that sets it apart is its barrel. If PSA were to offer a similar barrel that would be a different story. No offense meant and this is all just my opinion, but my Sport is unbelievably accurate to a level that is hard to match. But other than the barrel and the lack of a F/A and dust cover they are all the same basically.
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No offense taken and hopefully not given from me either, oneyeopn! For their 1:7" twist barrels PSA uses FN milspec barrels, which would be excellent for longer, heavier bullets, say above 69gr. The Sport's 1:8" twist is a good compromise which no doubt aids in accuracy. A person should figure out beforehand which bullet weights will be used and choose the appropriate twist rate, that's the bottom line. I'm really impressed with the value you get from PSA, it's almost like getting a BCM or Colt for hundreds less.
 
hey Thumbs. Check out Gun dealer online in Lancaster. If they have one in stock, I think its $595.00. I got tired of waiting and bought one from 911 Tactical in Honesdale for $610.00. I get around daily from Lancaster...to NEPA...to Bucks/Montgomery County. $610.00 was the best deal I found.
 
Thanks. I went to the site. Yep 599 is the good news. They are out of stock is the bad. Considering the best price I could find at the LGS's was 700 bucks that ain't bad. I just have to find one close that has them or out of state. At the price of fuel I can't run to far before it isn't worth it..I'll check the other place.

Just checked 911. His price went to 650. Looks like a compliant rifle of some kind only 10 round mag and fixed stock. Oh well good try though.

thanks again
 
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Quentin said:
No offense taken and hopefully not given from me either, oneyeopn! For their 1:7" twist barrels PSA uses FN milspec barrels, which would be excellent for longer, heavier bullets, say above 69gr. The Sport's 1:8" twist is a good compromise which no doubt aids in accuracy. A person should figure out beforehand which bullet weights will be used and choose the appropriate twist rate, that's the bottom line. I'm really impressed with the value you get from PSA, it's almost like getting a BCM or Colt for hundreds less.
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No offense taken on my side. I don't know if you know this or not but the Sports barrel is a progressive twist, it starts out at like a 1-11 and ends up a 1-5 anyhow that's how I counted the revolutions when I counted it. But I do know that it is a gain twist and is made to handle all sorts of bullet weights. I personally have set at my shooting bench with a Colt AR15 H-Bar and a Bushmaster Patrolman and neither one is near as accurate as the Sport. When I first got my sport I got it as a fun under 100 yard toy. I had carried a 16a1 in the corps before I traded up for a M60 and qualified expert with all my weapons. Once I got to shooting the sport and it exceeded all my expectations, (no it is not a combat rifle and I wouldn't go to the sandbox with it, I would replace the upper receiver and then I would take it to the sandbox) and I don't know if its the progressive twist or the 5R rifling but it is far more accurate than any I have been around. Remington is going with the 5R in all of their top tier hunting rifles now. Also a lot of match shooters swear by the progressive twist. So this is where I come from. Melonite surpasses chrome lining in every category where it counts, wear resistance, corrosion resistance, lubricity, it wont flake or chip like chrome and it is a treatment not a coating so they make the barrel to the size they want and then treat it instead of over boring it and then plating it and reaming it where you never know how consistent the chrome layer is. I can link you to the engineering reports, not by S&W or associated with S&W to back up these statements. So now I have an 8-32x42 scoped tack driver. This week I took a Pdog at 262 yards measured with a laser rangefinder. I am having fun with it just seeing how accurate I can make it.
 
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paid $775 for M&P15OR at a local gun show which shows there are still some deals to be found at gun shows :D
 
crracer_712 said:
Both of my M&P's (one chrome lined, one melonite) and my DPMS (CMV) barrels have the progressive twist barrels. Most uppers from all the makes that I have looked down are also progressive twist.
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That is possible but they dont advertise it at all. After all Remington is their parent company and they are starting to use 5R barrels in their top tier rifles.
 
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