Okay, what am I doing wrong?

[AveragEd]

As mentioned on here before, I received a new Model 41 last spring and had problems with it not ejecting fired cases. I called Smith & Wesson and it was suggested that I use CCI SV ammo (I was using pistol match fodder) and if that doesn't correct the condition, replace the recoil spring with a 7# Wolff spring. I bought the spring kit (6#, 6.5# and 7# plus three replacement increased tension firing pin springs) but thought if the gun passed final inspection with the factory 7.5# spring, it should function properly for me but it still failed to eject about 75% of the time with CCI SV. So I called again and received a shipping label.

A month later (good turnaround time, I thought) it was returned and yesterday I finally had time to shoot it. The first magazine with CCI SV was uneventful for the first nine rounds then the tenth empty was sticking out of the ejection port. From that point forth, it was FTE city for myself and another person with it being shot firmly held in a rest so I installed the 7# spring last evening.

Now, here's the current problem. The trigger guard won't swing back up with or without the barrel in place. I had the gun apart once before to clean and lubricate it and it went together fine but not this time! I also see the slide, which is against the slide stop, is rearward just beyond engaging the frame's rails. I didn't look at that the first time as it went back together so easily so I don't know if that's right or not. I'm suspecting not.

The manual instructs you to lift up on the slide stop and allow the slide to move forward slightly but it's already against the stop and the stop's lever is down as far as it will go so I can't free the slide to move forward.

What did I do wrong? Thanks in advance for any help.

Ed

 

[hobby-gunsmith]

Ed: Sorry you are having a problem with your new S&W but I would, again, follow the manual with a disassembly and inspect the parts and assemble the gun as illustrated in the manual. If you are still having a problem, I would call S&W and reiterate the problem to the gunsmith and you may have to resend the firearm back to them since it is under warranty.
Nick

 

[jag22]

Go to YouTube and watch some of the videos, much better than reading. My first 41, I was amazed at how it came apart. Never seen anything like that before. There are wonderful assembly/disassembly videos. I still go back and refresh my memory with them.

 

[tlawler]

Go to YouTube and watch some of the videos, much better than reading. My first 41, I was amazed at how it came apart. Never seen anything like that before. There are wonderful assembly/disassembly videos. I still go back and refresh my memory with them.

Yep, that’s where I went first also when I initially took my 41 apart.

 

[AveragEd]

A correction to my initial post. Looking at the gun in better light than I had last evening, I can see that the slide is NOT against the slide stop - something is preventing it from moving forward far enough for it to engage the frame's rails. A closer examination of the slide rails exposed that "something" - a burr on one of the rail's "ramps" so I'm taking the dissembled gun to my gunsmith. Hopefully he will be able to correct the frozen trigger guard after he gets the slide to move freely.

Maybe that burr has been the problem with case ejection all along. I've always thought the slide was hard to withdraw, something I had to do frequently to clear the fired cases, and that resistance could have been slowing slide movement after firing, thus hindering case extraction and ejection.

If that is the case, why didn't the Smith & Wesson gunsmith see that burr? And how did he get the slide back on without forcing it? I found that if I pushed on the slide hard enough, the rails on the slide and frame would begin to engage.

Ed

 

[AveragEd]

Update - and the final one, thank goodness. I stopped by my gunsmith's this afternoon, told him my story of woe and handed him the pieces of my Model 41. When I told him about the burr I removed and that the slide still was really tight, he laid a small straightedge along the slide's rails and pointed out a high spot on the one side about in the middle of the length of the slide's rail.

He said he could stone it off but ventured the guess that working the slide back and forth might do that while making sure that no more metal was removed than absolutely necessary so as to retain the great fit for which Model 41s are known. He pushed the slide all the way on using a little more force than I had been comfortable applying and then ran it back and forth until it ran smoothly for its full travel.

The frozen trigger guard was given the same fix - a "tough love" closing effort and all was well with the world again. Then came the acid test - a magazine-full of rounds fired without one FTE! And I guess thanks to the 7# recoil spring, they were the same pistol match loads that S&W told me the gun wouldn't cycle.

I called S&W to tell them what was found and when I told the representative about what had transpired he chastised me for having an independent gunsmith work on it and vehemently declared that a lighter recoil spring would have no effect on FTEs. When I told him that the spring was a suggestion by one of his coworkers he insisted I tell him who the person was. It had been since April so I really didn't recall but wouldn't have told him if I did know the name because that person had provided an accurate, even if non-approved, corrective action to a customer.

As much as I have supported Smith & Wesson's customer service over the past several decades, I have to wonder why that high spot wasn't caught during final inspection or when the gun was returned for repair. But we're all human...

Thanks to everyone who chipped in with suggestions and helpful advice.

Ed

 

[Rick H.]

Glad you got things sorted out with your pistol. Your call to the Mothership was ill-advised. All that did was wake up a dolt who decided to banter you with his artificial intelligence. Some things are best left unsaid/unknown. I trust you didn't tell your parents everything you did in life. I certainly didn't. And why they didn't notice this problem when you returned the pistol to them is anyone's guess, but if it wasn't listed on the repair order it was a non-problem for the repair person. I hesitate to use the term gunsmith in this regard as there are so few real gunsmiths these days.

Rick H.

 

[chief38]

Update - and the final one, thank goodness. I stopped by my gunsmith's this afternoon, told him my story of woe and handed him the pieces of my Model 41. When I told him about the burr I removed and that the slide still was really tight, he laid a small straightedge along the slide's rails and pointed out a high spot on the one side about in the middle of the length of the slide's rail.

He said he could stone it off but ventured the guess that working the slide back and forth might do that while making sure that no more metal was removed than absolutely necessary so as to retain the great fit for which Model 41s are known. He pushed the slide all the way on using a little more force than I had been comfortable applying and then ran it back and forth until it ran smoothly for its full travel.

The frozen trigger guard was given the same fix - a "tough love" closing effort and all was well with the world again. Then came the acid test - a magazine-full of rounds fired without one FTE! And I guess thanks to the 7# recoil spring, they were the same pistol match loads that S&W told me the gun wouldn't cycle.

I called S&W to tell them what was found and when I told the representative about what had transpired he chastised me for having an independent gunsmith work on it and vehemently declared that a lighter recoil spring would have no effect on FTEs. When I told him that the spring was a suggestion by one of his coworkers he insisted I tell him who the person was. It had been since April so I really didn't recall but wouldn't have told him if I did know the name because that person had provided an accurate, even if non-approved, corrective action to a customer.

As much as I have supported Smith & Wesson's customer service over the past several decades, I have to wonder why that high spot wasn't caught during final inspection or when the gun was returned for repair. But we're all human...

Thanks to everyone who chipped in with suggestions and helpful advice.

Ed

After you break the gun in (say about 750 - 1,000 rounds) I'd try and shoot the gun again with the Factory spring. Once it's worn in it might work as designed with the 7.5 lb. Factory spring. If it does - leave it in and if it doesn't you can always go back to the lighter one. I like to normally use the Factory spring unless it won't function properly. This way the gun doesn't get slammed any harder than necessary. You can keep trying the Factory spring from time to time. This is what I did to mine when it was new (1979) and the Factory Spring has been in there since about 1983 after using a 7 lb. version when I was having issues. After breaking in, all works perfectly now. Of course it will also work with the lighter one but why beat the gun up any more than necessary?

Final inspection and QC inspection is basically a thing of the past now. The customer is really the final inspector - judging from all the issues with new guns these days. You would think by now the Factory would have corrected this (especially on their premium target guns) - but NOPE!

 

[AveragEd]

Thanks, Chief. That's pretty much my plan and for the very reason you pointed out. The hottest ammo I plan to shoot in it is the "pistol match" brand and loading that it shoots best - I have a half-dozen or so on hand. I also have numerous kinds of rifle match ammo so I'll also give them a go but no "high-velocity" stuff.

Ed

 

[AveragEd]

Thanks, Chief. That's pretty much my plan and for the very reason you pointed out. The hottest ammo I plan to shoot in it is the "pistol match" brand and loading that it shoots best - I have a half-dozen or so on hand. I also have numerous kinds of rifle match ammo so I'll also give them a go but no "high-velocity" stuff.

Ed