our own worst enemy

[Well Armed]

I will never understand why people leave their state or country, escape to another state or country, and then support simular bull **** that existed in the place they just escaped from. That's like someone escaping from prison and then supporting and voting for indefinite martial law and curfews.

 

[ISCS Yoda]

This product can’t be shipped to the following states CA, CO, CT, DE, FL, HI, IL, IA, MD, MA, MN, NJ, NY, RI, VA, WA, DC

These folks know what they're doing, what the market is, and the cringe reaction..........

 

[BC38]

This product can’t be shipped to the following states CA, CO, CT, DE, FL, HI, IL, IA, MD, MA, MN, NJ, NY, RI, VA, WA, DC

These folks know what they're doing, what the market is, and the cringe reaction..........

I see it a little differently.

I think it would be more precise to say these folks know and obey the letter of the law (if not the spirit or intent of the law) at the Federal level, and they also know the anti-gun laws that have ALREADY been passed at the state level that bar the sale of their specific product - in over 1/3 of the states of the union.

Regardless of one's opinion (good, bad, or indifferent) about these kinds of devices, that is the bottom line reality.

 

[ladder13]

What can’t be shipped to FL?

 

[Well Armed]

This product can’t be shipped to the following states CA, CO, CT, DE, FL, HI, IL, IA, MD, MA, MN, NJ, NY, RI, VA, WA, DC

These folks know what they're doing, what the market is, and the cringe reaction..........

What can't be shipped to VA and FL? It's mostly Liberal states that are the issue. VA might be there next governorial election, but not at the moment.

 

[Oldsalt66]

I wonder how many of the folks who chant "no compromise" as their mantra on gun issues have actual, real-world, practical experience dealing with legislators and other elected officials? How many here have lobbied legislators or testified at committee hearings on various issues? And if so, when you did, did you explain why a given proposal was a good or bad idea? Or did you march in and demand that the people you were trying to influence bend to your will because you will not "compromise"?

Ideological purity sounds really good...but it rarely works as a tactic. There's an old saying that you can catch more flies with honey than with vinegar, and that's still true today.

The devices that provoked the creation of this thread are not firearms, nor are they necessary in order for firearms to function as intended. My Second Amendment rights do not depend upon my being able to buy or own one of these gadgets. They are novelties at best, and at worst they constitute a cynical attempt to skirt federal firearms laws. In defense of our rights, we hold ourselves up to the non-gun owning public as law abiding citizens, don't we? And if we do, shouldn't we obey both the letter and the spirit of the law?

Gun ownership is always under attack in this country, with our opponents regularly proposing all sorts of new 2A restrictions. We are in a precarious position. Yes, we have made tremendous progress in many respects (especially with regard to the right to carry for self-defense), but we have had significant setbacks in a number of states, as many of us can attest. Giving our adversaries the rope they will happily use to hang us is just not a good idea, in my opinion.

Tell it to the people of The Commonwealth of Virginia where both houses of their state legislature just passed a cleverly worded "assault weapons ban" that's currently sitting on the Governor's desk.

Another example of "compromise" at its finest .

Just kidding, there is no compromise involved, the gun grabbers methodology is to grind our gun rights to dust, and the only effective means of resistance is unapologetic activism of the same sort being employed by the progressive gun grabbers themselves.

My own experience with interacting with legislators and public officials is extensive, and leads me to opposite conclusions than your own.

It's unapologetic "in your face activism" that has proven to lead to positive political results for our gun rights, as it has for the social issues pushed by progressives as well, including their anti gun laws.

 

[Matt_X]

I realize this has drifted a little from the original focus, but I think in a more useful direction. But first to address Mr. Nichols. SHOT as you know is a trade show and really aimed at insiders. Perhaps I'm wrong but even if I had a product for a limited or restricted market, this might be a good place to try to generate interest and make connections. In any event I am not shocked to learn that you saw such items there. Further, while in the States we additionally restrict silencers, one can make a reasonable arguement that these can be very practical devices. They can help protect hearing, and provide less disturbance to nieghbors and nearby animals whether dispatching varmints or shooting bullseyes.


Earlier Fordham wrote: “…….They are already winning over the hearts and minds of our children and grandchildren.”

That is the point, isn’t it……..... Change the minds of the voting public and you change the voting pattern and the political landscape. And to do that, we may need a new and different strategy."
Amen!

One part of that can be to engaging and responding in a positive way, providing a rational but different perspective whenever opportunities present themselves. This was what I have tried to do with Mr. Nichols.

I live in an area dominated by people with judgemental litmus tests. But a fair number I can, now and then, when opportunity presents, get small but important points across in a similar way. For example, there are rational reasons for people to want a firearm made with modern technology.

​

There's no reason we can't change perceptions. Our biggest enemy is ignorance in much of the media and those who are ambivelant. People are afraid of what they don't know. Point out the ignorance by explaining the subject rationally and factually. When possible draw them in with something they know or are already familiar with. Let them know they need to learn about their topic. We win no friends by calling names or lumping everyone with different opinions on other topics into the opposition.

As far as the next generations, we need to engage them the same way we used to. Things like the junior rifle program have shrunk dramatically in recent decades. Shooting sports, and marksmanship programs used to be far more common in scouting, YMCAs, high shcools and colleges.* That's not going to turn around overnight. But anything we can do to introduce folks to the shooting sports will increase appreciation of firearms and always a benefit to our nation whenever need for infantryman arises.

*A few years ago I looked for information about the Jr Marksmanship program and found this brief history. The current version of the progam had 9,000 participants in 2004, versus 374,112 participants in 1961.