please help me understand what happened

[deadin]

I still think there was something wrong with the loads. 4.5 gr Unique under a 158 gr cast bullet is about a mid-range load. If there's enough of it left, you might check the firing pin protrusion.

I surprised you didn't scorch your trigger finger. That had to be blowing hot gasses out the side of the cylinder breech gap.

 

[S&WNUT]

I still think there was something wrong with the loads. 4.5 gr Unique under a 158 gr cast bullet is about a mid-range load. If there's enough of it left, you might check the firing pin protrusion.

I surprised you didn't scorch your trigger finger. That had to be blowing hot gasses out the side of the cylinder breech gap.

There were no indications all loads were very consistent and accurate my 110lb wife shot most of them as I was standing right there as I said shot a lot of them in a 686 and there are no sign of damage at all and never noticed cases be blackened by blowback

 

[H Richard]

Those Alcan primers haven't been made since the 50's to 60's at the latest. Would have to be 55 to 70 years old. I see blowback leak rings all around that brass. How old was the Unique they were loaded with and how was it stored? The components used should have been scrapped, and evidently the brass also.

 

[Edmo]

Just to confirm, did you experience the black rings around the primers on the same reloads fired in your 686?

Another question, has your damaged 442 had the firing pin replaced/upgraded? If so, was it a longer one?

Edmo

 

[Gulfecho]

-Scottie "If I give it anymore she'll blow captain".

 

[S&WNUT]

Those Alcan primers haven't been made since the 50's to 60's at the latest. Would have to be 55 to 70 years old. I see blowback leak rings all around that brass. How old was the Unique they were loaded with and how was it stored? The components used should have been scrapped, and evidently the brass also.

The powder is 2 years old the brass is good it was the primers that caused the problem but only in this gun. what about all the ammo from the wars people still shoot I would never use power that was very old or brass that was bad and if the primers work
the thought was it should be fine. I honestly think the primers were soft and the harder strike of the 442 caused the problem somehow because it damn near pierced them. As I said shot a lot in other guns with lighter springs no problem at all.

 

[poordevil]

Some of those primers look cratered to me. Maybe an indication of some of the loads being too hot?

 

[S&WNUT]

Just to confirm, did you experience the black rings around the primers on the same reloads fired in your 686?

Another question, has your damaged 442 had the firing pin replaced/upgraded? If so, was it a longer one?

Edmo

No black at all on the 686 or the 60 but they have lighter springs (still reliable) but the 442 as a carry gun for my wife
has stock factory springs. No it has original factory firing pin.

 

[murphydog]

I think there is nothing left to do except to call factory customer service and explain your situation to them. They may inspect it (and may even pay to have it returned to the factory) and then decide what to do, or as others noted above since it was not factory ammo that caused the problem they may not offer anything.

 

[robert1804]

Wow! That firing pin bushing is eroded away as well as the frame. I thought those bushings were steel. If I were looking for some antediluvian primers to use, I'd pass on Alcan.

 

[scooter123]

Looking at the packaging for those primers I see evidence of some moisture damage to the cardboard. This would lead me to suspect that the outside of some of the primer cups were corroded and that caused your leakage issue. I also hate to say it but I would be shocked if S&W offered any type of warranty compensation, this mistake was all on you.

 

[DR505]

Why do you have ancient primers laying about? I would pitch them and get rid of the ammo loaded with those primers...pull all the bullets and call it a day.

 

[pumpgun]

little JB weld and primer and call it a day

 

[rwsmith]

I can't see well,

pictures of brass and primers used

I can't see well, but aren't some of those primers pierced? It doesn't surprise me that damage could happen, but how it happened so fast is crazy. I'm sure S&W can replace the bushing and the firing pin.

PS Was the 442 part of the recall that the 686 and a bunch of other models had concerning the bad bushing/firing pin. If it is, it should have been fixed by S&W and stamped with an 'M'. It was mostly 'L' frames so I doubt this, but it would explain how a recoil plate on a revolver could get so messed up with so few rounds.

PS: Sorry, you DID say none were pierced.

 

[rwsmith]

Shelf life indefinite.......

Looking at the packaging for those primers I see evidence of some moisture damage to the cardboard. This would lead me to suspect that the outside of some of the primer cups were corroded and that caused your leakage issue. I also hate to say it but I would be shocked if S&W offered any type of warranty compensation, this mistake was all on you.

Powder and primers can last indefinitely IF they are stored to keep them cool and dry.

 

[MajorD]

I frequently end up with old reloading components and have used powder or primers 50-60 years old with no ill effects that is some ugly erosion !

 

[BigBill]

A hot load would make the primer flush. A light load or not enough powder would suck the primer in? Think of it as a engine running lean. The primer leaked and torch cut the frame. Lean = heat?

 

[S&W1006]

I had the same thing happen with some 10mm loads. 7.2 grains of Unique and Winchester primers. Several of the ones primed with Winchester primers leaked and pitted 3 of my 10mm's in one range session. The same load with CCI or Federal didn't leak. I stopped using Winchester primers and I haven't had a problem since.

You can replace the firing pin bushing and it will look somewhat better but it looks like it damaged the frame some too.

 

[ErnieDeBord]

You state you shot 600 or so rounds? Its to late now, I always keep "range rag" around when I am shooting, no matter what I am shooting 22 RF on up, every so often I take a break and do a quick wipe clean and look things over. Just a habit I guess, but I have always shot that way, keep the gun from getting hot, a little lube if nessicary etc, might have caught it in time? Anyway 600 rounds is a LOT between cleaning/inspecting, regards Ernie

 

[S&WNUT]

You state you shot 600 or so rounds? Its to late now, I always keep "range rag" around when I am shooting, no matter what I am shooting 22 RF on up, every so often I take a break and do a quick wipe clean and look things over. Just a habit I guess, but I have always shot that way, keep the gun from getting hot, a little lube if nessicary etc, might have caught it in time? Anyway 600 rounds is a LOT between cleaning/inspecting, regards Ernie

Ernie a little confusion here the 600 is total for the gun since new. It would get 75 or so each time out and cleaned each time
this time a hundred give or take but only 35 were found to have caused the problem. As I have listened to some of the
people here and thought about it the hard strikes from this
gun on the soft primers deformed them so they leaked with no problems in my tuned guns (range only) with hundreds shot from them. I am not worried about warranty just hope it can be fixed.