Scandium frame strength

[skipnsb]

Considering trail carry REVOLVERS only up to .44 mag.; 329PD, 329 Night Guard (.44 mags) and 296, 396 Mountain Lite, 396 Night Guard and old Charter Arms Bulldog (.44 special). There is a 12 ounce swing in weights before adding grips, CA in the middle. Enough to notice in a belt pocket.

All but CA (all steel) are aluminum alloy frames, 329 and both Night Guards have part scandium. (The NGs have steel cylinders, the rest titanium. The magnums have cylinder notches on the chambers, the 5 shot specials' notch straddles the chambers. I understand cylinder strength is usually the limiting factor for hot loads, that question is for another day.)

I understand SW position is never reload and their guns will handle SAAMI pressures. If I want max SAAMI magnum pressure, the list is short,329PD or 329NG. But if I want to go lighter, the 18oz 296 or 396 ML are attractive. My thought is a hot loaded .44 special shot little, practice with SAAMI loads.

So my question is whether the .44 special scandium frame offers any advantage over the other specials as far as the frame strength for hotter loads? Maybe the scandium is just good for frame longevity? The 1" longer barrel of the ML helps of course. Please no CA bashing please unless you have first hand experience. Thanks for any rational thoughts.

 

[steelslaver]

Young missed the 325 models in 45 acp. Light is nice to carrying, not to shoot. I have a 396 with titanium cylinder and a 325. A 329 would be ok with specials but cruel with magnums. If I can't fix it with 44 special or 45 acp it most likely wouldn't have been fixed with a magnums. Yes even a bear. Rather get 2 quick accurate rounds than 1 dealing with recoil. Once again. Power is fine, accuracy is finally.

 

[Hondo44]

I've never worried about the Scandium alloy frames; the cyls are the weakest link.

Any of the 329 scandium frames are brutal to shoot with 44 Mags. I found the Smith 500 Hogue Tamer grips (with back strap padding) are a must.

Then the 329s are very satisfactory to shoot 44 Mags with Tamer grips.

I swapped my Scandium 296 Ti cylinder with a stainless 696 'drop in' cyl for a little extra strength endurance with my 44 Spl (no foolin') reloads:

 

[Paul105]

As I understand it, the 396 frame is aluminum, don't know that it really makes a difference in the .44 special.

The 396 frame/cylinder is capable of shooting fairly heavy .44 special loads (Brian Pearce wrote a couple of articles on this). However, the barrel shank is very thin and is the weak link (subject to failure) on both the 396 and 696 when it comes to heavier loaded .44 specials.

Buffalo Bore loads a 255gr Keith to 984 fps in the 3 1/4" 396. That load or equivalent handload will be all you want (and most likely more) recoil wise in the 396.

I don't recommend it, but I've shot the "Keith" load in my 396. It chronoed 1,086 fps at 72 Deg F and five long paces from the muzzle. One shot is more than enough for most -- makes the 329 with full on .44 mags feel like a *****cat

FWIW,

Paul

 

[skipnsb]

Do you think the steel cylinder makes a difference? compared to the 396 ML, 4 more ounces gets me the 396NG with steel cylinder and scandium frame, and another 4.5 ounces gets me to the 329 NG mag. But suddenly I am 50% heavier than the ML. All not including grips.

I guess it boils down to how much can I hang onto.

 

[BLUEDOT37]

So my question is whether the .44 special scandium frame offers any advantage over the other specials as far as the frame strength for hotter loads? Maybe the scandium is just good for frame longevity?
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My thought is a hot loaded .44 special shot little, practice with SAAMI loads.

This statement can be found in a S&W patent "Scandium containing aluminum alloy firearm US 6711819 B2"

"Proof testing was conducted on completed revolvers having frames made of scandium containing aluminum alloys as contemplated by the present invention with titanium cylinders.

The resulting revolvers were discharged with an overload of ammunition. Twenty proof rounds were conducted with no yield. The revolvers were also tested for fatigue by discharging 2500 to 5000 rounds and passed the test.

One revolver had half the material cut away to produce a weaker revolver and tested. The weaker revolver withstood proof rounds as well and did not fail."
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This, and another scandium patent were referenced in this post:
http://smith-wessonforum.com/138527311-post12.html

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I use .44 Special loads in the 22-23K PSI range, judiciously, in my 396NG. I have used higher. Brian Pearce said he's shot loads to 27K PSI in the 396/696, without issue, but now recommends loads to just 18K PSI. The thin barrel breach extension is it's weakness.

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396NG

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396NG bbl. extension

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[chief38]

After shooting a friends Chief's Special in Scandium, I sort if doubt weather he'll ever shoot it enough to harm it! The recoil on the ultra light weight gun was IMHO NOT fun to shoot! I believe it weighed in at just over 11 ounces and shooting +P's were harder than Magnums out of my M19.

Personally I like Steel, but YMMV