Serious question about China

[JJEH]

I didn't grew up here and most of you are a few days older than me, so I'm hoping you can answer my question

I'm not sure when exactly we started outsourcing manufacturing to China, but since a few days now I've been wondering; was there ever a qualitative good product made in China? Or has it always been quick, cheap and mediocre?

Just wondering...

I've had and still have several Made in Mexico products and so far I can't complain. I rather shop there to be honest!

 

[Bullet Bob]

Quality is almost always a management decision. In the 50's and 60's, Japanese items were considered junk by many, but the government there instituted quality control for exported items, and look at them now.

Many of the Chinese items sold here are inexpensive not only because of the cost of their labor, but because we won't pay for the cost of quality items from there; we get what we pay for.

Does Apple still make iPhones in China? I have a Norinco copy of a Walther TT Olympia .22 pistol that is very well made.

 

[JJEH]

Quality is almost always a management decision. In the 50's and 60's, Japanese items were considered junk by many, but the government there instituted quality control for exported items, and look at them now.

That's right, just remember how many firearms were and still are made there. And glass like binocs, scopes, etc.

Japan is hard to beat though...

 

[peter-paul]

I worked in the Intelligence Community. I can tell you that in some technologies they have reached parity with us. Especially missile strike precision, hypersonic weaponry, lasers, and encryption.

We moved production to China when trade barriers were lifted with their induction into the G8, and business leaders realized that more profit could be made by using Chinese labor.

The net effect is a pooling of profit at the higher echelons of American business, and the loss of manufacturing in the middle class, thereby reducing its size and purchasing power.

The Chinese make quality products every bit as good as others when it is in their national interest or in the interest of their bottom line.

There is nothing inherent about the Chinese that prevents them from making products that meet or exceed non-Chinese products.

It is very possible that they will be dictating trade terms to the USA in 20 years, quite a role reversal when compared to the 1980s.

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[Scott in NCal]

I think it is the consumer that ultimately decides quality of the products they spend their money on. For communists, the Chinese have the supply and demand thing all figured out.The Chinese build to the quality we are willing to pay for. They cheat bigtime though, slave labor, intellectual property rights, trade mark infringements, unfair trade practices ect. Of course the Chinese have built quality products, Ming china for example. Perhaps anyway, I dont know anything about pottery. I am more a stainless steel kinda guy.
While discussing his army, the late Chairman said "quantity has a quality of its own". I would tend to agree, a billion hungry , ideological pure peasants armed with pitchforks and throwing rocks presents a formidable military force.
The Chinese manufactures own the market in cordless tools. I have a Ryobi 1/4 inch impact driver that has no problem spinning lug nuts off the semi.
Yes, the Chinese can build quality products.

 

[Injunbro]

It's my experience "Chinese junk" no longer refers to a type of ship. They are plenty smart enough they could build good products but don't for above reasons. Mexican quality doesn't impress me either but is still superior in quality. I miss good American made quality.

 

[ContinentalOp]

Not a historian, nor an economist, and not entirely sure it's relevant to the thread topic, but I suspect that China adopting a quasi-capitalistic approach in the 70s and 80s might've had a role in other countries, including the US, outsourcing their labor and manufacturing to them.

 

[gregintenn]

We as a country want cheap more than quality. China supplies us with what we want to buy.


There have been quality products produced in China through the years from silk to swords to Norinco firearms.

 

[Doug M.]

Along with people all through our government and business structures not perceiving the movement to off-shore manufacturing, production of medications, etc. is a major national security issue. All of us who are older and on a collection of meds are going to be in deep do-do if there is anything that causes trade to slow or end.

 

[Simson-Suhl]

Dr. W Edwards Deming an American statistician and educator whose advocacy of quality control methods in industrial production aided Japan's economic recovery after WW2. Years ago an engineer friend of mine explained to me Dr. Deming taught the Japanese they had to produce the very best products to become a world leader.

 

[olcop]

Their machine tools are excellent quality, especially the high end stuff.
The thing that concerns me is that they bought up the big machine tools from the US and other countries, and many of them were one of a kind--so, we don't have the capability any longer to build some items.

 

[Ivan the Butcher]

Chine has always been the world's leading producer of Chinamen! ( or more PC, Chinese Persons). Joe Stalin had a philosophy of "Quantity, has a quality all its own!" And the Chinese have so many people, no-one can compete with them in Labor, or military ground action!

However, in skilled labor they have just started closing on the rest of the world. In Military ground action, one Marine Regiment showed them what they needed to know in 1950, but did they learn?

In the past China's government (Emperor or Polit Bureau) would not spend cash and threw people at their problems. They have learned that lesson well, and still have the people to attack any problem but with more skill and infrastructure!

Go to any food court and you will find a Chinese restaurant of some sort! Look at the pride and skill of these people! They, as a culture, may yet conquer the world economically!

Ivan

 

[oldbrownhat]

As someone else noted, "Made in Japan" used to mean "cheap and poorly made" and some of it was because that is what we wanted. Same is true of China now. But they can made good gear. My buddy has a well-used Hilti heavy-duty hammer drill that I thought was old enough to be "pre-China" but I was wrong. Built like a tank. My gf got a high-end Zeiss fluorescing microscope fror her lab a few years ago (~$35k) and although she chose Zeiss (German-made) optics for some of the special filters, she opted for their second line- made in China - for others and she's found them perfectly good.

I prefer to buy US-made when I can, though, and often scour second-hand stores for old hand tools, such as wrenches or clamps. My local building supply store carries Bosch drill bits, which are made in China, but I won't buy them when I can get US-made ones from Triumph or Norseman elsewhere for the same price!

 

[Dave_n]

I must echo the comments on the TT Olympia target pistol but change the firearm to the Norinco 1911, The quality of the steel in this pistol (when you could get them) was such that quite a number of 1911 competitive shooters used the frame and slide as the basis for excellent "one-offs". I have had an unmodified 1911 for the last 20 plus years and it is still an excellent pistol, even though it has not been modified. The other area that China has excelled in but is not usually realized, is in the area of DNA and RNA analyses and syntheses. For example, within two weeks of the Cov-2 virus, a Chinese group sequenced the complete genome and published it for people to work on world wide. This information became the basis of almost all of the current batch of vaccines under development. There are many other scientific areas that they have excelled in (not stealing info from the West but by working it themselves). Dave_n

 

[THE PILGRIM]

Yes , China is making cheap because US consumers want cheap.
I hope there’s not too much cheap in the $1,000 iPhone in my shirt pocket.
But I wouldn’t bet on it!

 

[LVSteve]

I read an article recently from one of the "great and the good" economists who admitted that the globalization we have now is a mistake. Paraphrasing:

"We wanted globalization, but what we got was hyper-globalization, and that hasn't worked for American industry".

Ya think?

 

[peter-paul]

Krugman. He has been wrong about a lot of things. Smug as hell, too.

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[dockmurgw]

China excels at 2 things. Intellectual theft, and turning their country into a giant Superfund site. Make that 3 things, crapping up the air the rest of the world breathes.

 

[TTSH]

Krugman. He has been wrong about a lot of things. Smug as hell, too.

LOL!!! Has he ever been right about anything? I don't think so.

++++++++++

I'm old enough to remember when everything coming out of South Korea was Junk.

And yes, I'm even old enough to remember when everything coming out of Japan was Junk.

And Lord knows that I know about Chinese junk. We have a Harbor Freight not too far away just like everyone else.

But time has taught me that China will improve its quality in time just like the other countries I mentioned did. It has already happened in many areas... with many more to come. Just give it time.

 

[delcrossv]

Companies go to China to get the absolute lowest manufacturing costs. So junky items are what they buy.

I've seen made to spec stuff that's as good as anywhere else.

Ever wonder where Louis Vuitton gets their bags from?

Hint: It's not France.