Shield 40 Mishap

[Rick-O]

Unsupported chambers

It should be also noted that .40 S&W is not the only round that has this issue. I have also found quite a few references to 9mm, 357 sig and even .45 ACP. When you have high pressures and an unsupported chamber you can have this issue. It seems to be seen most often in early Glocks, perhaps due to the numbers sold and the unsupported chambers of the earlier guns. A quick google of "unsupported chamber 9mm" will give quite a few links and images.

As an FYI, I have no issues with shooting either 9mm or .40, but after my G23 experience, I do want to know the details of the chamber support and load before pulling the trigger.

My Shield .40 has much better support than my G23. I also have a LWD 9mm conversion for the G23 that has good support.

 

[2001gmc]

Still nothing. Just a update. I'm sure some of you are wondering.

 

[Booboo357]

Still nothing. Just a update. I'm sure some of you are wondering.

Thanks for the update. Hope you get it soon.

 

[Rastoff]

Well, I didn't expect anything speedy. Thanks for the update.

 

[turbo38gn]

I'm still looking in my local dealers to see if any 9's are in the showcases... nope... nothing, lots of 40's... no 9's... bet you could get a 40 pretty quick..

 

[Maximumbob54]

That article is just NEVER going to die. It doesn't matter what bullet weight you use, they just adjust the powder volume to still be at the same working pressure. Bullet setback is bullet setback is bullet setback. You get bullet setback with any bullet weight and bad things are going to happen. Also, notice the date on that article? Yep, 180's are still common. There is just too much bashing without knowing what is even happening.

 

[2001gmc]

There is a 9 and a 40 in almost ever gun store here every time I go I look.
I'm in no big hurry but geeez they told me one should be shipped out by the end of Feb and here it is almost middle of April.

 

[2001gmc]

Well I called them yesterday and left a message maybe they will call me back today. Its frustrating to know that one of the kabooms that happened after mine they already got the 9mm shield in there hand. They had the 40 and did the cheaper buy like I did and chose the 9mm also instead of the 40 and they got there before me. I'm about fed up.

 

[turbo38gn]

Well I called them yesterday and left a message maybe they will call me back today. Its frustrating to know that one of the kabooms that happened after mine they already got the 9mm shield in there hand. They had the 40 and did the cheaper buy like I did and chose the 9mm also instead of the 40 and they got there before me. I'm about fed up.

Hang in there Boss!! We got plenty of guns to shoot while we wait...

Ginzo... call me, can't find your number..

 

[RobsTV]

Rick-O,thanks
CALIBERS -- Why the 180gr Bullet is a Bad Choice for .40 S&W


Good read, interesting, thanks!

Might be good fiction, but that's about it.
Bullet makers do not seat a bullet deeper, (to the point where pressures increases dangerously), without changing to a powder that easily allows deeper seating bullet, without any additional pressure increases. In fact, the safest methods are to "choose a powder" that gives as little free space as possible, which prevents bullet from seating properly if you accidently fill with too much powder. Nearly mistake proof. Less free space does not equal dangerous pressures if the proper powder is selected based on this free space.

Here is what real data looks like:

175gr bullet in 40 S&W brass.
w231 powder, 973fps, 32294psi, 76% case volume filled (including projectile).
WSF powder, 975fps, 29204psi, 80% case volume filled (including projectile).

This shows that the same bullet in the same brass casing can have vastly different pressure simply by changing the powder. The WSF example shows that a simple powder change allows you to have the same velocity, more case volume used (preventing accidental overfilling case) and "LESS" case pressure!

As a side note to the powders shown, the WSF has less felt recoil and is more pleasant shooting, with more knockdown power due to increased FPS. You can actually load faster than the example, which is only shown to compare equal PSI and volume.

Now with all that said, I do not use 175/180gr, but instead a hollow point version of the 175gr bullets, which weighs 155gr, and load them up to around 1044fps (roughly 29,000 psi). Even that can be a handful shooting in the Shield. If I did not have the HP's, I would use the 175/180gr bullets.

 

[ginzo]

Good Luck.
I was going to rag your as* just a few days ago about me getting the 638 before you got your replacement. Good thing I shut up or I would be eating CROW......... Still working on it, and man what a story this gun is going to have when I finally get it. If it wasn't so funny, I'd be crying!!!

Well I called them yesterday and left a message maybe they will call me back today. Its frustrating to know that one of the kabooms that happened after mine they already got the 9mm shield in there hand. They had the 40 and did the cheaper buy like I did and chose the 9mm also instead of the 40 and they got there before me. I'm about fed up.

 

[uko7]

The fact you said reloads ends it for me. Double charge without question. I've seen it happen way too many times.

As far as the OP goes if you were firing factory ammo it sure looks like the case failed. Not the gun. It has a clear bulge on the rim of the casing.

I agree. I have been reloading for my shield for a it now and very good results with both 180gr JHP and lead RN flat points.
Now if they only made an extended safety release like on my 1911.
It is a great carry concealed carry gun.

 

[MDLEOW]

If you voluntarily send your property to someone can you then turn around and claim it was stolen? Isn't that fraud? Wouldn't that hurt your case more than help it?

Heck, he doesn't even know that S&W isn't going to send the pistol back yet.

2001gmc,
Did S&W hint in any way that you would never get the gun back? Did they say that the investigation would require destructive testing resulting in the gun being destroyed?

Would that not be Theft after Trust?

 

[MDLEOW]

Follow up to your replacement Shield

Jack do you know if Smith took the money off your card yet? Just curious. No one ever answered me about the 147gr FMJ rounds for the 9mm Shield. Anyone shoot any of it out of there Shield?

Have you gotten your Shield? I just picked up one (9mm) and haven't gotten to the range yet. This thread really caught my interest and am curious if you are happy.

 

[2001gmc]

Have you gotten your Shield? I just picked up one (9mm) and haven't gotten to the range yet. This thread really caught my interest and am curious if you are happy.

No I haven't got mine yet. I called and left a message the other day to call me back still no return call. I'm not holding my breath. I hope you enjoy your new 9mm shield.

 

[2001gmc]

Still nothing for anyone wondering. I cant even get them to call me back.

 

[turbo38gn]

I'm gonna puke... I check my bank account almost everyday...

 

[2001gmc]

I don't understand what the deal is. My dealer called me back in Feb and said Smith called them and got there number and all and talked like they were sending it right out. I leave them messages to call me back never get a return call. I call the Velenze guy direct and leave him a message still no return.

 

[2001gmc]

7 Months tomorrow I been without my Shield.

 

[turbo38gn]

Ok... as sick to my stomach as I am... I just called... actually got through to David!! Gave him info again... asked for the status.. his exact words were, nothing is leaving there for at least a week..... they are in the middle of their quarterly inventory!! OK, I expressed my concern with the length of this situation and he said, they are doing their best, but they had 10's of thousands of these on back order!! He went on to say he would forward some paperwork next week after inventory and see if there was anything they could do to get one out.... he asked for my number and name, said he would try to let me know ...

That's the best I could come up with... I look everyday in the local classified and my LGS for a deal.... found one currently, lightly used for $350.... plus... if I can come up with something close, would that work... I even told David, I have been considering sending you my 9 Shield.. if you would be happy... I know it works!!!

 

[2001gmc]

Ok... as sick to my stomach as I am... I just called... actually got through to David!! Gave him info again... asked for the status.. his exact words were, nothing is leaving there for at least a week..... they are in the middle of their quarterly inventory!! OK, I expressed my concern with the length of this situation and he said, they are doing their best, but they had 10's of thousands of these on back order!! He went on to say he would forward some paperwork next week after inventory and see if there was anything they could do to get one out.... he asked for my number and name, said he would try to let me know ...

That's the best I could come up with... I look everyday in the local classified and my LGS for a deal.... found one currently, lightly used for $350.... plus... if I can come up with something close, would that work... I even told David, I have been considering sending you my 9 Shield.. if you would be happy... I know it works!!!

No Jack I think you have already done more than enough with this issue. Thanks for calling at least you got a hold of someone.
I'm really in no big hurry as I have plenty of guns to shoot. Was just giving a update on the status and how long its been. It does sicken me though on how long it is taking them to get this gun out. There is one at my dealer ever time I got in there. $399 Plus the tax. Thats whats stumping me on how long its taking them to get it out. Thanks for all you have done its greatly appreciated.

 

[turbo38gn]

screw that!! ask him if he'll take $400 out the door and I'll send him a check, no CC fees...

 

[Rastoff]

OK, I expressed my concern with the length of this situation and he said, they are doing their best, but they had 10's of thousands of these on back order!!

Why are you upset? I seem to remember you saying that a customer should just patiently wait until whatever is being done is done. Calling to check up on something is just annoying the business.

Remember this?

I have a little bit of understanding and empathy for S&W and what they are doing. Like my business, I just know, 100% that S&W does not want to "hold" any ones gun any longer than they have to... but I will say.. every so often I may slow a process down... just because... someone got under my skin...

Do you think that's what's happening here?

 

[turbo38gn]

Why are you upset? I seem to remember you saying that a customer should just patiently wait until whatever is being done is done. Calling to check up on something is just annoying the business.

Remember this?Do you think that's what's happening here?

first off, did I say I was upset... no I didn't.... am I happy, no... I called got through in less than 2 minutes and had a nice conversation... period.. no need to attempt to blow up what I did and said here into more BS... we've been patient, calling once in 2 months isn't annoying anyone.

but on another note, I didn't realize how much my past comments annoyed you.. if you have something positive to add to this situation, please share.

 

[Rastoff]

Not annoyed, just wondering if you thought they are intentionally delaying this?

 

[spirit4earth]

I just read this thread from start to finish. What a saga!! It shows the kindness of people, and also the coldness of corporations. There are plenty of Shields here in WNC. This ordeal has probably left a sour taste for a lot of people regarding S&W's customer service.

 

[ncase]

another kaboomed member

My replacement pistol finally arrived at my ffl . Still have to get my pistol permit up dated ,another week or two . It been one year plus for the replacement to arrive . Many unreturned phone calls finally went snail mail and got results.
With kabooms S&W wants to destroy the pistol and will give you the letter saying you are a valued costumer and a new gun at about 75% cost , ask for the pistol back they will improve the deal.My advice is to put everything in writing and forget the phone.
I would like to know what other companys with kabooms do?

 

[Mcheng1021]

Today me and dad were enjoying the nice weather and decided to shoot our guns. We shot the AR's and his Walther PPK 380 and his Sig 1922 pistols. I got out my Shield 40 out to shoot and was planning on putting 100 rounds down the pipe as the gun has only 150 rounds through it so far with about 10 Fail to ejects. I shot 50 UMC 180gr flawless with no issues except I couldn't hit the broad side of a barn. So I got this box of Federal 180gr High Shock JHP. I load up 7 rounds bam bam boom on the 3rd round all I seen was a flash and got 3 small burns and where something hit under my eye and blood was running down my face. My hands were numb and just couldn't believe what had happened. Well it appears that my shield I guess you could say blew up in my hands. The mag flew out on the ground and I couldn't find the remaining ammo that was in the mag. There are 4 more rounds somewhere up in the hay field. What do you guys think about this and should I email Smith&Wesson and send them the pics or just call them first?

My 9 shield cracked the exact same place 2 days ago. My first time shooting it and halfway through my second mag. Luckily the dealer that sold me the gun swapped it out for me and I got a new one.. Sorry man.. That's a real crappy deal. Good luck getting it fixed

 

[2001gmc]

My replacement pistol finally arrived at my ffl . Still have to get my pistol permit up dated ,another week or two . It been one year plus for the replacement to arrive . Many unreturned phone calls finally went snail mail and got results.
With kabooms S&W wants to destroy the pistol and will give you the letter saying you are a valued costumer and a new gun at about 75% cost , ask for the pistol back they will improve the deal.My advice is to put everything in writing and forget the phone.
I would like to know what other companys with kabooms do?

I've herd people say that Glock honors and replaces all Kabooms regardless of fault of ammo or gun.

 

[Baby Huey]

Hi guys. I just bought a 9mm Shield last week. I got a notice the next day from Botach for $349 shipped. Might be an option for you. Good Luck. Glad it didn't turn out worse.

Smith & Wesson M&P Shield Pistols - Botach