i have a few 3rd gens, some have buttery smooth decockers, while a few are rough and stiff. To be fully honest, I have swapped single sided levers into some of the rougher ones ( I prefer the thinner profile). I've seen the video outlining the polishing of the actual safety/decocking lever and sear release piece which i've done but with only limited results. Anyone have some other suggestions to smooth this action ?
stiff/notchy decocker lever
- Thread starter lolaralph
- Start date
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Lets see if I can't help get you squared away here...
First of all, don't do any stoning, filing, or polishing on the decocker or the sear release lever. There is no benefit from doing any polishing or whatnot to the decocker. Further, any polishing etc. done to the top of the sear release lever will, at best, shorten how long your decock timing will remain within factory specs or at worse, take the decock timing out of spec and/or possibly disable the decock function entirely. You'd then need to fit or have fitted and timed a new sear release lever.
That being said, lets take a look at some of the parts...
Here we have a typical Ambi Manual Safety Body. When you actuate this lever moving it to the safe/decock position... as the lever rotates, this sharp edge I'm pointing at here presses rearward on the hammer lifting it out of the slide recess and away from the firing pin by about 3/32". I've heard/read of folks advising to polish or radius this area however this is not the area needing attention to correct a gritty or rough decock function. Also take note of the plunger on the left with the nice domed radius head, I'll get to that in a bit.
Now lets have a look at some hammers.
Here we have four different hammers... On the left is a MIM spurred part and the other three are wrought steel spurless. Note the burnished wear area I'm bracketing with the forceps which is actually pretty smooth.
When you cycle the decocker, that is the area swept by that sharp edge I pointed out above. Now lets have a look at those other hammers.
Here I'm bracketing the same spot on one of the wrought hammers. Here when you cycle the decocker, you wind up with a rather gritty feel as that sharp edge on the decocker rides up that rough surface .
Remember that plunger I said to take note of? Well for the regular decocker (ambi or not doesnt matter) there are three different plungers you can physically stuff in that little recess. However, only one of them will work right.
Here they are...
The one on the left with the spring and the nice even radiused domed top is the correct part. The others two are different variants are used for retaining the right side ambi lever.
Having the wrong plunger in there will negatively impact the smoothness of the decock function. Mind you that it's very easy to mistake that middle one for the correct part. I've even had parts suppliers mix them up.
Also check this out...
Back when I took delivery of the PC4506 I noted it had a terribly gritty decocker. I pulled it apart and found this chewed up worn out plunger in there.
Swapped in a new correct part with the correct domed radius and a fresh spring. Buttery smooth like new
So in the end here's what I recommend.
First, check and make sure you have the correct plungers installed and replace any that are damaged or worn out.
Then if that doesn't completely correct the problem, I'd examine the hammers for roughness in that area I indicated. Depending how bad it is, some careful stoning may correct it. If it's really rough I'd not hesitate to bin the hammer and swap in a MIM replacement.
For what it's worth, and I am no great fan of MIM but... among my 3rd gens, with one exception my guns with the smoothest DA pull and slickest decock-only function I built up using MIM components. In two cases I swapped out flash chromed wrought parts that I really wanted to use when I just could not dial in an acceptable action feel using them so I binned 'em and installed the MIM stuff. I have to admit the MIM stuff has a superior uniform finish and requires little to no intervention on my part to yield buttery smooth function.
Cheers
Bill
First of all, don't do any stoning, filing, or polishing on the decocker or the sear release lever. There is no benefit from doing any polishing or whatnot to the decocker. Further, any polishing etc. done to the top of the sear release lever will, at best, shorten how long your decock timing will remain within factory specs or at worse, take the decock timing out of spec and/or possibly disable the decock function entirely. You'd then need to fit or have fitted and timed a new sear release lever.
That being said, lets take a look at some of the parts...
Here we have a typical Ambi Manual Safety Body. When you actuate this lever moving it to the safe/decock position... as the lever rotates, this sharp edge I'm pointing at here presses rearward on the hammer lifting it out of the slide recess and away from the firing pin by about 3/32". I've heard/read of folks advising to polish or radius this area however this is not the area needing attention to correct a gritty or rough decock function. Also take note of the plunger on the left with the nice domed radius head, I'll get to that in a bit.
Now lets have a look at some hammers.
Here we have four different hammers... On the left is a MIM spurred part and the other three are wrought steel spurless. Note the burnished wear area I'm bracketing with the forceps which is actually pretty smooth.
When you cycle the decocker, that is the area swept by that sharp edge I pointed out above. Now lets have a look at those other hammers.
Here I'm bracketing the same spot on one of the wrought hammers. Here when you cycle the decocker, you wind up with a rather gritty feel as that sharp edge on the decocker rides up that rough surface .
Remember that plunger I said to take note of? Well for the regular decocker (ambi or not doesnt matter) there are three different plungers you can physically stuff in that little recess. However, only one of them will work right.
Here they are...
The one on the left with the spring and the nice even radiused domed top is the correct part. The others two are different variants are used for retaining the right side ambi lever.
Having the wrong plunger in there will negatively impact the smoothness of the decock function. Mind you that it's very easy to mistake that middle one for the correct part. I've even had parts suppliers mix them up.
Also check this out...
Back when I took delivery of the PC4506 I noted it had a terribly gritty decocker. I pulled it apart and found this chewed up worn out plunger in there.
Swapped in a new correct part with the correct domed radius and a fresh spring. Buttery smooth like new
So in the end here's what I recommend.
First, check and make sure you have the correct plungers installed and replace any that are damaged or worn out.
Then if that doesn't completely correct the problem, I'd examine the hammers for roughness in that area I indicated. Depending how bad it is, some careful stoning may correct it. If it's really rough I'd not hesitate to bin the hammer and swap in a MIM replacement.
For what it's worth, and I am no great fan of MIM but... among my 3rd gens, with one exception my guns with the smoothest DA pull and slickest decock-only function I built up using MIM components. In two cases I swapped out flash chromed wrought parts that I really wanted to use when I just could not dial in an acceptable action feel using them so I binned 'em and installed the MIM stuff. I have to admit the MIM stuff has a superior uniform finish and requires little to no intervention on my part to yield buttery smooth function.
Cheers
Bill
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bigwheelzip
Absent Comrade
Bill,
Thanks so much for taking the time to give that explanation. That makes things so much clearer. The plunger I have is the correct piece, so that shouldn't be an issue. The bobbed hammer I installed is indeed a forged piece and resembles the ones you show. I can now see why that would contribute to the roughness I now feel in the gun, especially when I compare it to the original I removed, which strangely is another forged piece but with much nicer finishing. Maybe the older guns were slightly better finished ( it is a 439 ). I can also add that I have a 457 that you have taken your time to discuss with me in the past that has probably the nicest DA and SA trigger of any semi I own, and it's all MIM. The decock function is like butter on that gun as well. Again, Thanks for taking the time to enlighten us, it is truly appreciated.
Thanks so much for taking the time to give that explanation. That makes things so much clearer. The plunger I have is the correct piece, so that shouldn't be an issue. The bobbed hammer I installed is indeed a forged piece and resembles the ones you show. I can now see why that would contribute to the roughness I now feel in the gun, especially when I compare it to the original I removed, which strangely is another forged piece but with much nicer finishing. Maybe the older guns were slightly better finished ( it is a 439 ). I can also add that I have a 457 that you have taken your time to discuss with me in the past that has probably the nicest DA and SA trigger of any semi I own, and it's all MIM. The decock function is like butter on that gun as well. Again, Thanks for taking the time to enlighten us, it is truly appreciated.
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You're quite welcome.
So, what can you do to slick up a scuzzy wrought hammer eh?
Well here's what....
A few strokes on a DMT bench stone (600 mesh)
This is the hammer in the middle of the third pic on my previous post.
After about 5 minute it's much better. I probably took no more than a couple tenth's off the strike face. Still a couple blemishes there but overall the surface is slick and there's nothing to catch on. I could work it some more but there's really no need.
You may have also noticed this area in the previous pics that was stoned slick on a couple of those hammers.
Here's why I did that...
Looking at that radius above the hammer hooks, you see a burnished wear track on each side of the hammer. This is where the sear bears against the hammer during DA. The cheesegrater surface here yields a very gritty DA trigger and can benefit from some judicious stoning. I use the same DMT bench stone then finish up on fine then extra fine ceramic stones. Definitely does the job. A note of caution though... Whatever you, do stay away from the hammer hooks/notches. There's nothing to fix there and any messing about is liable to ruin the hammer.
Cheers
Bill
So, what can you do to slick up a scuzzy wrought hammer eh?
Well here's what....
A few strokes on a DMT bench stone (600 mesh)
This is the hammer in the middle of the third pic on my previous post.
After about 5 minute it's much better. I probably took no more than a couple tenth's off the strike face. Still a couple blemishes there but overall the surface is slick and there's nothing to catch on. I could work it some more but there's really no need.
You may have also noticed this area in the previous pics that was stoned slick on a couple of those hammers.
Here's why I did that...
Looking at that radius above the hammer hooks, you see a burnished wear track on each side of the hammer. This is where the sear bears against the hammer during DA. The cheesegrater surface here yields a very gritty DA trigger and can benefit from some judicious stoning. I use the same DMT bench stone then finish up on fine then extra fine ceramic stones. Definitely does the job. A note of caution though... Whatever you, do stay away from the hammer hooks/notches. There's nothing to fix there and any messing about is liable to ruin the hammer.
Cheers
Bill
Again, thanks for taking the time to post this valuable information. I learn a good bit from these wonderful posts.
Now for the next question, why is the actual act of decocking the gun vary so much from gun to gun. A few of my 3rd gens are almost effortless to decock while others practically hurt your thumb. Is there any adjustment for this area that you're aware of ? Interestingly enough my MIM guns seem the smoothest again.
Now for the next question, why is the actual act of decocking the gun vary so much from gun to gun. A few of my 3rd gens are almost effortless to decock while others practically hurt your thumb. Is there any adjustment for this area that you're aware of ? Interestingly enough my MIM guns seem the smoothest again.
