Skip Sackett
US Veteran
OK, you win.
Target loads for .38 special
- Thread starter retrogun
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OK, you win.
Skip Sackett
US Veteran
DEWC
Two different animals.
Dale53
Member
Reloaders, in general, need to get out of the mindset, that if two bullets weigh the same, then you can load them the same. Not necessarily so. The most obvious example is the difference in pressure and velocity between a 160 gr SWC and a 160 wadcutter loaded flush with the case mouth. Most everyone recognizes that one.
However, the diffence between a Hollow base wadcutter SWAGED bullet and a solid base CAST wadcutter are also significant. It's not always recognized but it IS there and the difference is REAL as "Smith Crazy" suggests.
In much earlier days, I was loading Saeco 190 gr SWC in a .45 ACP. Then I got a very nice H&G four cavity mould that cast a 190 gr #130 SWC. Since they weighed the same, I used the same powder charge. I was fat, dumb, and happy until I cracked the slide on my .45. I chronographed that load and it was over 1100 fps!! (the Saeco ran 950-1000 fps. The lower load was safe and the faster load was NOT. It turned out my recoil spring had "sagged" from 16.0 lbs to 12.0 lbs. That combination of a "too hot" load and a "too light" spring was more than my 1911 could take. The #130 bullet took up more powder space than the #68 bullet did. It is as simple as that.
The chronograph is NOT a pressure gun but it can sure indicate areas to stay away from. It certainly educated me. I use a lot of the H&G #130's these days but I am careful to adjust my powder charge to give me what I should have instead of MORE (that I shouldn't have
.
Solid base wadcutters need a bit more powder because they are cast and are harder and the solid base does not expand quite like a soft, swaged hollow base wadcutter does.
On the other hand, the solid base can be driven faster, with safety, than a hollow base wadcutter (driven too fast, hollow base bullets have separated their skirts and left the skirt in the barrel to cause a bulged barrel on the next shot).
They are both FINE designs but MUST be used within their design limits for safety AND satisfaction.
Dale53
However, the diffence between a Hollow base wadcutter SWAGED bullet and a solid base CAST wadcutter are also significant. It's not always recognized but it IS there and the difference is REAL as "Smith Crazy" suggests.
In much earlier days, I was loading Saeco 190 gr SWC in a .45 ACP. Then I got a very nice H&G four cavity mould that cast a 190 gr #130 SWC. Since they weighed the same, I used the same powder charge. I was fat, dumb, and happy until I cracked the slide on my .45. I chronographed that load and it was over 1100 fps!! (the Saeco ran 950-1000 fps. The lower load was safe and the faster load was NOT. It turned out my recoil spring had "sagged" from 16.0 lbs to 12.0 lbs. That combination of a "too hot" load and a "too light" spring was more than my 1911 could take. The #130 bullet took up more powder space than the #68 bullet did. It is as simple as that.
The chronograph is NOT a pressure gun but it can sure indicate areas to stay away from. It certainly educated me. I use a lot of the H&G #130's these days but I am careful to adjust my powder charge to give me what I should have instead of MORE (that I shouldn't have
Solid base wadcutters need a bit more powder because they are cast and are harder and the solid base does not expand quite like a soft, swaged hollow base wadcutter does.
On the other hand, the solid base can be driven faster, with safety, than a hollow base wadcutter (driven too fast, hollow base bullets have separated their skirts and left the skirt in the barrel to cause a bulged barrel on the next shot).
They are both FINE designs but MUST be used within their design limits for safety AND satisfaction.
Dale53
Bullseye Smith
Member
I use 3grs. of TiteGroup with a 148 gr HBWC and it is great. Plus I use Federal Primers with this. When we shot PPC we used 2.2 grs. of Bullseye and you could see the HBWC fly to the target when the sun was right, and that is a lite load.
harry carey
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if you are to load wadcutters you should read "a study of 38 target loads " W G Mitchell 1988 issue 117 "rifle" magazine.
Gutpile Charlie
US Veteran
I have not loaded any in years, but the loads I used were 148 gr. HBWC or double ended wad cutters over the "appropriate" amount of WW231 or Bullseye.
That all you need to know....it will work like a charm.
That all you need to know....it will work like a charm.
photoman
Member
The classic Elmer Keith 3.0 of Bullseye with a 148 works for me.
harry carey
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william dresser addressed this issue years ago. .55 grain of bullseye 1 27/32" barrel, m36, all bullets exited barrel, 148 dewc. 1.25 grain of BE in 6" barrel cleared all bullets from a 6" barrel. HOWEVER ... i have been an eyewitness to oversized plated bullet(WC) in a very dirty rental gun not clearing a 1 27/32" barrel.the sound of the gas coming out the rear of the gun was strange. even the first time shooter knew not to fire again. to remove that bullet we had to drill a hole with a drill press thru the bullet four times before we could drive it out.a cast bullet would have been easier to remove than that soft core plated bullet that kept collapsing when we tried to hammer it out.there are some strange looking rounds coming from the commercial reloaders occasionally .if everyone took a basic pistol course they might look at ammo prior to putting it in a gun.
