The gun that won the West....

[Hellraiser]

Apparently, Lewis and Clark kept the larder full with a great big air rifle.

NRA.ORG | Lewis & Clark Girandoni Air Rifle

What? A freakin' pellet gun? Dang...

Ya know... Sherlock Holmes was skeert of Professor Moriarty shootin' him with an air rifle. 'Course, that was fiction. But maybe them elk had gotten a holt of some of Doyle's novels from the local tradin' posts... and died of fright.

EDIT: Sorry for doubtin' ya, Greg... but you are 100% correct... I have learned a lot today. Them L & C boys pre-date the cowboys... and so... I have not studied up on 'em. Although Meriwether Lewis died about 30 miles from my house here in TN... down at Grinder's Stand... I just never got into that time-period.

Thanks, Greg.... very informative. And your post on air rifles is right on... just hard to believe.

 

[BigBill]

Nice looking revolver! One day, I'd like to get a Win Lever Action in .30-.30.
Prior to the Winchester 73, it would have gone to the Sharps Carbine, as seen in 'Quigley Down Under'. Used by the Military and many Buffalo Hunters.

Quigley Down Under caused a pretty good renewal in interest and sparked a bunch of replicas being manufactured.

There was a fuss made between the shooters of the Quigley rifles that those long shots couldn't be done. So a bunch of shooters went out on a challenge and actually made those long range accurate shots. True story.

 

[Bill Bates]

We've all heard, "this is my rifle, this is my gun. This is for shooting, this is for fun." Well reality is the latter along with agriculture is what won the West by a rapid increase in population.

Early trappers and explorers would have been mostly carrying old flintlock rifles and muskets. Those would have been used to provide food and now and then used for self protection from 4 and two legged critters. I'm sure the average farmer owned a shotgun and maybe a rifle which was likely an old military style musket/rifle. Most living in towns likely didn't even own a firearm. A good portion of the West was fairly settle before the Indian Wars 1850-70s.

Sure a rifle or shotgun may have helped with keep the a few settlers and explorers fed and protected but really it was mass migration, changes in ease of transportation like railroads, agriculture and population expansion that tamed the this part of the world. I think we tend to romanticize the overall role firearms played in our western expansion.

I really think it was that frequent use of that other gun for fun that tamed the West.

 

[GatorFarmer]

Generic small solid frame and topic break revolvers far out numbered the big Colts and Smith & Wessons. They were made in vast numbers, both domestically and in Europe. It would not surprise me if they outnumbered even shotguns, or at least gave them a run for their money. These were popular until the GCA '68 forced the market towards better and more powerful guns.

Forget about any "ending dates" to the West. Plenty of places were rough in 1915 for example. Plenty are still rough today. To this day much of Wyoming is desolate and largely empty, a condition also seen in the Dakotas, Montana, and Alaska if we count it.

Also remember that the Alaska gold rush ran right into the 20th Century and that even Los Angeles was a place of cowboy hats and ranches not so very long ago.

 

[Hellraiser]

Well, folks... this thread is 'bout the gun that won the west. Not plows... certain settlers... railroads... or even critters. On most any thread on this matter... nobody boasts of... "the pecker that won the west".

Now I think that the firearm that was mostly used qualifies as "THE" GUN. And I say that gun was the shotgun.

That's my story... and I'm stickin' to it.

 

[jtcarm]

Apparently, Lewis and Clark kept the larder full with a great big air rifle.

NRA.ORG | Lewis & Clark Girandoni Air Rifle

True that Lewis packed along an air rifle, but IIRC, the larder was kept full by the 1792 Contract rifles Lewis acquired from Harpers Ferry. The air rifle may well have been used on small game.

It may have been in St. Louis, but somewhere early in the expedition, a bunch of people turned out to greet them with food and it turned into something of a fair, during which a woman was accidentally shot in the head with the air rifle. IIRC, she was OK but knocked unconscious.

The soldiers reputedly ate up to ten pounds of meat a day I winter camp. During the last winter camp before returning, they killed out all the elk within a large radius around the fort.

Lewis also got shot through both buttocks while elk hunting on the trip home or just before. His hunting partner was a soldier noted for his poor eyesight who denied firing the shot, but almost surely did.

The game lived on the plains back then and the Shoshone and Nez Perce (sp?) had been driven into the mountains by the Blackfeet, who had been armed by the French or British. The mountain Indians were starving and the Expeditin very nearly starved there, too.

 

[jtcarm]

What? A freakin' pellet gun? Dang...



Ya know... Sherlock Holmes was skeert of Professor Moriarty shootin' him with an air rifle. 'Course, that was fiction. But maybe them elk had gotten a holt of some of Doyle's novels from the local tradin' posts... and died of fright.



EDIT: Sorry for doubtin' ya, Greg... but you are 100% correct... I have learned a lot today. Them L & C boys pre-date the cowboys... and so... I have not studied up on 'em. Although Meriwether Lewis died about 30 miles from my house here in TN... down at Grinder's Stand... I just never got into that time-period.



Thanks, Greg.... very informative. And your post on air rifles is right on... just hard to believe.

I just read the short article about the air rifle by the NRA and that is a horrible piece of mis-information. The air rifle was little more than a curiosity it's "illusion of superior firepower" had zero to do with the survival or success of the expedition.

The only actual fight involved Lewis, guide George Druillard, and two soldiers who were brothers vs a small group of Blackfoot Indians when the Indians tried to steal their rifles. Lewis shot one or two Indians with his rifle (probably a 1792 Contract Rifle somewhere around .50 caliber.). The two brothers stabbed another to death.

My source is "Undaunted Courage" by noted historian, the late Stephen Ambrose. This is an extremely detailed account of the expedition. Ambrose only mention of it is an incident at the beginning of the expedition when someone was accidentally shot with the air rifle (and survived.). After that, it is never mentioned being as used for anything other than an interesting conversation piece.

Sorry for the lecture, but it's asinine of the NRA to make such a dramatic and completely false assertion.

 

[quneur]

I suspect there were a lot more shotguns. You hear those stories of the ol' West; mountain men, cowboys and indians, outlaws and sheriffs and their prowess on handling their six shooters or accuracy on their long rifles. But its not very romantic for these fanciful, bigger than life figures shooting a rabbit while its eating grass or that squirrel or raccoon sitting on a limb. Not much skill needed and small game was more plentiful.

There is evidence of early man's diet consisted mostly of rabbits. It isn't as glamorous as mammoth or sabertooths but rabbits were a lot less dangerous game, plentiful and both sexes could gather them. I suspect the same with those pioneers of the west.

 

[BC38]

I was always under the impression that it wasn't a gun at all that "won the west."

I always thought it was the steel plow, barbed wire, and the railroad. I guess you can throw the telegraph wire in there too.

But I really think it was the women. Men came and went where they wanted. They stayed as long as they wanted then moved on if they wanted. But when women came, they wanted a house and a home. Not a soddy or a shack, but a real house. When houses came, towns weren't going to be far behind. When towns arrived, they wanted churches, stores, schools, libraries, hospitals, and theaters. And they wanted law and order. They wanted a safe place to raise their children.

So I think really it was women who "won the west."

It's a little bit of a thread drift but I just have to add that women are THE driving force behind ALL of civilization throughout history. If it weren't for women, men would still be liviing in caves and eating raw meat...

 

[Marshwheeling]

It's a little bit of a thread drift but I just have to add that women are THE driving force behind ALL of civilization throughout history. If it weren't for women, men would still be liviing in caves and eating raw meat...

...not that there's anything wrong with that.

 

[Rangerpat]

...not that there's anything wrong with that.

Since my divorce, I'm living in a Man Cave, eat meat every day, and keep telling myself there's nothing wrong with that!

My .02 cents on the gun that won the West is the Winchester Model 1873 (along with the Colt Single Action Army Revolver).

 

[shouldazagged]

He ought to know, he was probably there at the time.

Hell, I was his Cub Scoutmaster.

As for women winning the west, they certainly tamed and civilized it. Apparently some were also capable with shotguns and other firearms.

If there was a "gun that won the west", it seems to me it was a long gun, not a revolver, movies to the contrary notwithstanding. If you believe the western movies I watched as a boy in the 1940's, THE gun was the twenty-nine round SAA.

My pick for the primary long gun would be a tossup between the shotgun and the 1866 or 1873 Winchester, but I'm not nearly the student of the era that Iggy and others of you are.

I would suggest that we not overlook Civil War-era rifled muskets, in the early post-war days.

 

[A10]

Hawken Rifle, most likey the larger bore. Everything else is just a follower.......