The media is spreading fear

BC38 said:
OK, I'll stand corrected.

As to dengue fever, there is a point that was left out of the discussion by the expert in your linked article. From an article specifically about dengue fever, here's what either wasn't mentioned by the expert - or more likely selectively left out by the author of the article (either out of ignorance or more likely in order to put the worst spin possible on the expert's comments).

So basically you can't get the same variety of dengue fever more than once and for at least some period of time recovery from one gives you immunity to all five types - immunity that wanes over time. The one thing I couldn't find was how long the blanket immunity generally lasts. So dengue fever is kind of in the same "bucket" as chickenpox/shingles.
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Not sure of the the whole conversation going on, but I had dengue three times over an approximately 8 year period of time. (just my luck) The first time was the absolute worst! And yes I lived in a tropical location at the time.
 
UncleEd said:
BC38,

I notice you use the word "we" a lot in calling for
action.

Perhaps you should go forth first and prove your
reports before the designated agencies OK such
action.

If all goes well, you shall be hailed as a hero. If
not, "we" won't care. :)
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Yeah, when talking about our whole society "we" is the correct pronoun.

"I" can't put 22 million back to work. "I" can't enact policy for the whole country, so what "I" do has no bearing on the discussion.

However, enough people agreeing with ME can affect the actions of those who do have that authority. We're starting to see some movement in that direction.

But nice try at being snarky. Not that it really contributed anything of value to the dialog.
 
Turq said:
Not sure of the the whole conversation going on, but I had dengue three times over an approximately 8 year period of time. (just my luck) The first time was the absolute worst! And yes I lived in a tropical location at the time.
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Interesting, first hand experience. So you got infected by 3 of the 5 different dengue fever viruses in 8 years? The good news is that's 3 down and only 2 more to go. :D

The other interesting thing is that your experience was the opposite of what they expert said. He said subsequent infections are worse even with the antibodies in your blood.

Sounds like the blanket immunity doesn't last more than a couple of years at a time. Just out of curiosity, what was the shortest period between one of your illnesses and the next?
 
"Sounds like the blanket immunity doesn't last more than a couple of years at a time. Just out of curiosity, what was the shortest period between one of your illnesses and the next? "

This was over 25 years ago, so I don't remember the period of time between. But it wasn't long, maybe a couple years max. My wife never got it, go figure.

The things I do remember was at the time of the second go around I didn't believe I had it, because I was under the mistaken impression that I had immunity. But I had all the symptoms ( very much like a flu on steroids) plus the rash. After the first time ( I believe) I was told there were three strains, this is the first I heard of five strains. So I actually thought I was really done with it.....Gee thanks :D

And yes the first time was the worst. I felt like someone beat the heck out me, blood under my skin on my stomach, rash it was awful.The Doc I saw at the time was a local and experienced with it, but there was nothing he could do.
 
Of course the media is spreading fear. It can be summed up in the following parable:

A scorpion, which cannot swim, asks a frog to carry it across a river on the frog's back. The frog hesitates, afraid of being stung by the scorpion, but the scorpion argues that if it did that, they would both drown. The frog considers this argument sensible and agrees to transport the scorpion. Midway across the river, the scorpion stings the frog anyway, dooming them both. The dying frog asks the scorpion why it stung the frog despite knowing the consequence, to which the scorpion replies: "I couldn't help it. It's in my nature."

That's a good summary of the main stream media today.
 
steelslaver said:
The big question is how soon and how much. To soon or to much could really suck. It wouldn't take many carriers moving around to get the numbers going back up fast.

Blowing the call could easily cost tens of thousands of deaths or more. How any lives are you willing to gamble away. Remember that over 20% of the fatalities and 50% of those that go into an ICU are under 60. Plus, many of those that require ICU attention suffer from kidney damage and will need continued medical care and likely a shortened life span.

We know there are 600,000 infected right now. Probably at the very least 100,000 unknown infected and probably way more. Those unknowns are a big problem. What we have now in this country was started with far less.

We could test everyone. But, those tested would have to remain away from anyone else not known to be clear. As soon as they contact an unknown the validity of them being known to be uninfected is shot. How do you plan to do and control that? The antibody deal is good if the reliability of an antibody test specific for Corona 19 is validated and those with antibodies are proven to be immune to reinfection. Which is nowhere near the case yet. Like I said jumping the gun could cost lots of lives. Maybe yours or one of yours. Let me ask you this. Would you bet your kid's life on it. Not yours, but your kid's life? Sure it mostly kills the old with issues, but it get some young healthy people too? Would you risk your kids being exposed to it with no positive proof. I would not. Already lost one son and don't ever want to go through it again for any reason or amount of money.
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I don't disagree with you on timing being very important. Obviously if they are going to use mass testing for antibodies as a guideline, it ain't gonna be tomorrow. Or next week for that matter. But we need to get started NOW!

In regards to your statement above, I'm not talking about testing looking for those who have never been infected. I'm talking about determining who has been infected and recovered and gained immunity. Once that has been determined there is no need to continue tracking that individual's status. They are free to get back to normal life. They just have to stay away from those who are vulnerable and don't already have immunity. Social distancing and things like masks in public couldn't hurt either.

Those who haven't been exposed and aren't immune would need to stay at home if they are in a high risk group. As long as only the immune are out there living normal life among the other immune members of society (and those young and healthy enough to risk catching it), and as long as those who aren't immune stay away from them, then both groups are safe. It may mean the older folks who haven't developed immunity, and those with compromised immune systems, have to stay shuttered away from everyone who has developed immunity for a while. But that beats the hell out of EVERYONE having to stay shuttered in their homes.

As for the risk to my kid. The latest stats for NY are more than 26 thousand confirmed cases and 7 deaths for kids under the age of 21. So 7/226,000 = .0031% chance of death for CONFIRMED cases. In 2018 there were 37,461 auto fatalities in the US out of 337 million people. 37,461/337,000,000 = .0112%
and we all know that a disproportionate number of auto fatalities are young drivers.

So every day I let him drive his car - even though the chances of him being killed in a car accident are three and a half times as high as him catching and dying of COVID-19 if we lived in IN NEW YORK. The stats for NY are more than 20 TIMES worse than they are for my state (WA has less than 11k cases).

So yeah, I'll accept those odds rather than risk seeing him and everyone else in the whole country go through a depression like what we had in the 1930's. And make no mistake about it, that is where we are headed with this. Doing what we are doing now has us headed in that very direction. The effects of this shutdown are going to be felt for a LONG time. Possibly for decades, and the longer it drags on the worse it is going to get and the deeper the hole we have to try to get out of.

EDIT: Another glance at the NY stats show only 713 deaths for people under the age of 50. That is 713/266,000 confirmed cases so that is only a 0.26% chance of death for people under 50 years old. More significant, but still only about 2-1/2 times the risk of death by other strains of flu (0.1%).
 
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ladder13 said:
I'll go when Birx and Fauci say so, surely not taking any advice on the net.
Repeating stats ad nauseum trying to prove this and that will not sway me.
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Now you have it.
Here's their strategy:

If you are a senior with co-morbidity issues, stay home and good luck. We have no plan, other than to through you under the bus.
Hey, sacrifices have to be made, and us guys have drawn the short straw. Pray modern medicine figures it out.

If you are without symptoms, but have the virus, go fourth, and worry not, as we aren't testing you. Back to work you go, make your money. Everyone else will just have to deal with your unknown and invisible toxicity.

What's the worst that could happen anyway?

If you get it, and recover, great for you. Count your blessings.

But if you never get it, just how comfortable will you be going forward?

As others have said, modern medicine does not have a handle on this virus. Not yet, anyway.

Count how many times the task force says "hopefully"...

By my tracking of the numbers, 6,000 US residents died of this virus in the last 24 hours.

"Hopefully", as a plan, just wasn't enough for them, or the other 28,000 that preceded them.

Be careful what you ask for.
 
Forrest Gump was a fictional character in a made up story. Borderline retardation only triumphs in the Coyote-catches-the-Roadrunner-every-time universe

Elite, when it meant few-as-well-trained, or special, anything was a label to aspire to before it became cheapened as an insult by an un-named ('cause them points, they do add up) politician reserved for folks he didn't like.

I can't wait (if I live long enough) to see how the movies someday portray the politicians vs. the scientists and whether "common sense" out -trumps science.

Here's to hoping there's someone left to watch it with.
 
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doublesharp said:
At least wuflu has shut up the climate change quacks. :D

Let's go to work! :cool:
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It is truly amazing that with the "experts" devising a plan to get America back to work the internet experts still want to hide in their closet.

Not one of them has offered a thing except wait...1...2 ..3 years.
 
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ladder13 said:
It is truly amazing that with the "experts" devising a plan to get America back to work the internet experts still want to hide in their closet.

Not one of them has offered a thing except wait...1...2 ..3 years.
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LOL, and now they get to feel the same level of frustration that those of us on the other side of the question have felt, now that what THEY think should be happening isn't what IS happening.

Of course they are free to choose to continue hunkering down at home, unlike those of us who haven't had a choice about being out of work and stuck at home INDEFINITELY.
 
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