To Re-Load or Not???
- Thread starter stavman11
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I have owned an RCBS Rockchucker single stage press since the mid 80's and I have reloaded all my rifle and pistol ammo except for 22LR ammo which you can't reload. It's not rocket science and you just need to set up a routine that has the proper checks in it to insure that you don't not put powder in a case or double load a case because those are what cause real problems.
The best deal is to buy a kit from a major manufacturer like RCBS that has the press, powder dropper, powder scale, and then you buy the dies for the ammo that you want to reload. You should also but a dial caliper to measure the overall length of the loaded round. Then also buy a book on the proper techniques for reloading and follow it and you will be fine.
If your needs grow to where you need to load thousands of rounds then you will need to get a multi stage press that produces 1 round with every pull of the lever. I shoot regularly and still haven't got to that point but many have.
The best deal is to buy a kit from a major manufacturer like RCBS that has the press, powder dropper, powder scale, and then you buy the dies for the ammo that you want to reload. You should also but a dial caliper to measure the overall length of the loaded round. Then also buy a book on the proper techniques for reloading and follow it and you will be fine.
If your needs grow to where you need to load thousands of rounds then you will need to get a multi stage press that produces 1 round with every pull of the lever. I shoot regularly and still haven't got to that point but many have.
OP
stavman11
Member
thats my Normal Spot ish... about 2.234
Trying 10 Longer... almost Full cannelure exposed... trying 4 different COL... 2.20 2.234 2.245 2.256
See if they make a difference
More Fun for Tuesday
Good Shooting day Yesterday.. man we are having a weather change again, cold to warm, and the wind was unpredictable all day....
Set up my targets, Lobbed a few lead... then tested my Multiple COL loads....Results as Follows
1st 3 where my ones i forgot to adjust the Seating Die and made me try a few Options Out... they where at 2.20
Target at 50yds and pretty good Right to left Wind..
then started next 3 and so on and so on.... and a Pattern presented itself... Not Much difference in Accuracy based soley on COL... even tried the 50gr Nosslers, and all landed in same general Area..
May Try this again, have some more Rounds ready, once the wind dies down.... maybe Tomorrow
This is My Little desert Shooting Ground... Couple buddies wanna go play Tomorrow so am scrambling ta get some Rounds ready to Go Shoot.... love the Desert...Thats about 700-900yds to the mountain/hill in background....
I can't afford yet
I can't afford to get a tumbler right now and I'm debating a chronograph, but I have an overall very cheap operation that keeps me shooting plenty. In my early days I got by for REALLY cheap. I'm working on obtaining all that I need over time.
I can't afford to get a tumbler right now and I'm debating a chronograph, but I have an overall very cheap operation that keeps me shooting plenty. In my early days I got by for REALLY cheap. I'm working on obtaining all that I need over time.
I have a cheap operation myself, I end up doing double redundancy checks to keep me from messing up. Although I use a Lee Perfect Powder Measure I use my little cheap digital scale to measure every charge, I am constantly checking COL. After I resize and clean then I prime them all at one time with a hand primer. Doing this I turn out way better ammunition than I can buy. I still have almost 600 new factory loads but I dont like to shoot them because of the accuracy difference. I bought them for the brass but if I dont shoot them I wont get the brass into my rotation. LOL
Stav,
That's a beautiful shooting spot you have there.
I've been playing around with the COL idea some more after getting the Mossberg. I made up a long dummy round with a loose fitting Hornady 55g FMJ-BT bullet. I colored the bullet with a sharpie and inserted it into the chamber and slowly closed the bolt.
When I extracted the round and inspected the bullet I could see scratch marks where the bullet engaged the rifling. But the COL of the chambered round was 2.366". I've read on the Krieger barrel web site that they recommend setting the bullet back .010–.015" from engaging the rifling, which still leaves a COL of 2.351–2.3565...way too long to fit in a mag. And with this particular bullet it means that only about 1/8" of it is seated.
Anyway, I tried the same thing this morning with my Sport. Same loose fitting bullet set long and marked. Unfortunately, without a bolt handle for leverage I could not ease the bolt forward to seat the bullet (maybe the one case for me where a FA would have been helpful, ) . So instead I pulled the bolt back half way and let it go. The extracted round measured 2.382" !!! I repeated the test with a new bullet and the result was the same 2.382" COL.
Grover has graciously offered to send me a sampling of longer bullets to test in the Mossberg, chambering them by hand as necessary. I don't know if I'll get back to fiddling with COL for the Sport though.
That's a beautiful shooting spot you have there.
I've been playing around with the COL idea some more after getting the Mossberg. I made up a long dummy round with a loose fitting Hornady 55g FMJ-BT bullet. I colored the bullet with a sharpie and inserted it into the chamber and slowly closed the bolt.
When I extracted the round and inspected the bullet I could see scratch marks where the bullet engaged the rifling. But the COL of the chambered round was 2.366". I've read on the Krieger barrel web site that they recommend setting the bullet back .010–.015" from engaging the rifling, which still leaves a COL of 2.351–2.3565...way too long to fit in a mag. And with this particular bullet it means that only about 1/8" of it is seated.
Anyway, I tried the same thing this morning with my Sport. Same loose fitting bullet set long and marked. Unfortunately, without a bolt handle for leverage I could not ease the bolt forward to seat the bullet (maybe the one case for me where a FA would have been helpful,
) . So instead I pulled the bolt back half way and let it go. The extracted round measured 2.382" !!! I repeated the test with a new bullet and the result was the same 2.382" COL.Grover has graciously offered to send me a sampling of longer bullets to test in the Mossberg, chambering them by hand as necessary. I don't know if I'll get back to fiddling with COL for the Sport though.
I have some 75gr Amax and some 68gr Match BTHP's that I just have been unable to get decent accuracy out of. Maybe Bill can make them work in the bolt action. I have started thinking maybe a bolt gun with a 24" barrel would be a better varmint gun but so far the Sport works well. Plus a 30 round mag covers a hunting trip!!
zip777
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I guess it depends if you want to kill or vaporize the lil guy. LOL
zip777
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I know. I still have the image of a 75 gr hollow point hitting that poor lil vaporized pdog. Lol
OP
stavman11
Member
Great Day of Shooting and testing Today... mostly Shooting
was fun to take a couple friends out and show them my Nice Shooting Area... was a Beautiful 72deg day... no wind... Awesome
The new Independence 5.56 Rounds shot pretty well.. as good as any factory loads Really, maybe a bit less consistent. Did only shoot but 20 of my Loads... But shot alot of the 5.56...
So that gives me another 200 brass ta play with
because of today i have ordered some new toys
Bushnell 6-24 Scope
2 AFG
Knockoff Eotech 556 (for my 15-22)
More Splatter Targets
Fun Times... time ta reload a BUNCH of rounds for Tuesday
........
was fun to take a couple friends out and show them my Nice Shooting Area... was a Beautiful 72deg day... no wind... Awesome
The new Independence 5.56 Rounds shot pretty well.. as good as any factory loads Really, maybe a bit less consistent. Did only shoot but 20 of my Loads... But shot alot of the 5.56...
So that gives me another 200 brass ta play with
because of today i have ordered some new toys
Bushnell 6-24 Scope
2 AFG
Knockoff Eotech 556 (for my 15-22)
More Splatter Targets
Fun Times... time ta reload a BUNCH of rounds for Tuesday
........
Tomorrow will me first trip to the range in over 4 months so I'm pretty psyched. I'm only taking 380 rounds with me and most of my shooting time will be in load testing the new Mossberg. But since I swapped the Bushnell scope off of the Sport and replaced it with the Nikon M-223 I do need to spend some time re-zeroing the Sport as well. 
OP
stavman11
Member
Have a BLAST Bill
Thats tooooo long ta not get to Play
Thats tooooo long ta not get to Play
Well, today's shooting session was nothing to write home about. I got the Nikon zeroed of the Sport with no fanfare. The fun started when I took out the MVP.
My best 5-shot group measured just under 1". My only consolation from today was that none of my groups broke 2".
The MVP seems to like the hotter loads as 27.5gr of WC844 got me my best two groups. With the Hornady 55gr FMJ-BT I was getting 3577 fps. No signs of over pressure as the primers weren't flat and the cases extracted easily.
I'll make up another batch of that and do a few at 27.7gr and some at 28 gr to see if I can find a sweet spot.
My best 5-shot group measured just under 1". My only consolation from today was that none of my groups broke 2".
The MVP seems to like the hotter loads as 27.5gr of WC844 got me my best two groups. With the Hornady 55gr FMJ-BT I was getting 3577 fps. No signs of over pressure as the primers weren't flat and the cases extracted easily.
I'll make up another batch of that and do a few at 27.7gr and some at 28 gr to see if I can find a sweet spot.
I am starting to hand load the .300 black, I was able to pick up 262 rounds from the local range yesterday plus the 34 cases that I cant use for 5.56 anymore. Some of the guys at the range thought that the blackout needed a whole new upper and couldn't believe its the same with just a barrel change. I just finished cleaning and resizing the brass today. I still have to anneal them but that will be tomorrow. it will be my first attempt at annealing so wish me luck.
Hows the leg Grover?
Hows the leg Grover?
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I got the bullets that Grover sent me in today's mail. I was discouraged to see that there was no data for the 75gr AMAX and H335 in any of the manuals Grover or I have access to.
But as I looked at the velocity data I've collected on my 55gr FMJ-BT reloads I noticed that they don't track well at all with H335 reloading data, even though WC844 is supposed to use H335 load data. What I did notice is that it tracked very closely with BL-C(2) reload data.
I did some more research and found that WC844 (H335) and WC846 (BL-C(2)) are closely related...in fact they are opposite ends of the tolerance scale of the same powder. WC844 is predominantly used for 5.56 while WC846 is used for 7.62.
So I'm starting to think that maybe the WC844 that I (and Stav) bought from Wideners last year may have been pulled due to the tolerance of the powder falling in the WC846 range. But as it was pulled from 5.56 rounds it was sold as milsurp WC844.
Anyway, back to Grover's bullets...he also sent me some 68 gr Hornady BTHPs that I have H335 data for. So I've reloaded a ladder between min and max of H335, but also added some loads that ramp up to just under the max for BL-C(2). This way if I find that the velocity data for the reloads is tracking with the BL-C(2) reloads I'll have the rounds to test it fully.
Boy it's fun to get back to shooting.
But as I looked at the velocity data I've collected on my 55gr FMJ-BT reloads I noticed that they don't track well at all with H335 reloading data, even though WC844 is supposed to use H335 load data. What I did notice is that it tracked very closely with BL-C(2) reload data.
I did some more research and found that WC844 (H335) and WC846 (BL-C(2)) are closely related...in fact they are opposite ends of the tolerance scale of the same powder. WC844 is predominantly used for 5.56 while WC846 is used for 7.62.
So I'm starting to think that maybe the WC844 that I (and Stav) bought from Wideners last year may have been pulled due to the tolerance of the powder falling in the WC846 range. But as it was pulled from 5.56 rounds it was sold as milsurp WC844.
Anyway, back to Grover's bullets...he also sent me some 68 gr Hornady BTHPs that I have H335 data for. So I've reloaded a ladder between min and max of H335, but also added some loads that ramp up to just under the max for BL-C(2). This way if I find that the velocity data for the reloads is tracking with the BL-C(2) reloads I'll have the rounds to test it fully.
Boy it's fun to get back to shooting.
I am starting to hand load the .300 black, I was able to pick up 262 rounds from the local range yesterday plus the 34 cases that I cant use for 5.56 anymore. Some of the guys at the range thought that the blackout needed a whole new upper and couldn't believe its the same with just a barrel change. I just finished cleaning and resizing the brass today. I still have to anneal them but that will be tomorrow. it will be my first attempt at annealing so wish me luck.
Hows the leg Grover?
Good luck with the annealing. I've read so many conflicting reports on what's effective and what isn't that I think I'll stick to looking for more once-fired brass.
But if you find a method that works be sure to post a step-by-step tutorial.
GMCman..the leg isnt really any better, my leg keeps swelling up like a pig foot and I have been restricted to bed..I got my laptop up here now although I have never used its keyboard. So I have tons of powder (for me) lots of primers, enough bullets for a while and about 16 pieces of brass. A guy locally is selling once fired for $150 for 500. That is so far out of my price range. I am thinking about selling 500 rounds of xm193 to pay for a large bunch of brass.
Oh and Bill was so nice..I was looking at spotting scopes and he asked me what I was looking to buy...and I mean right then..and he told me to hold on. He sent me a Bushnell spotting scope. A really nice scope...it will be handy, for the last couple of years my spotter out at the farm has had to use one of my other rifles. This is the same power as my scopes so it will be just right. So if anyone has any brass just gathering dust I will pay shipping and whatever LOL
Oh and Bill was so nice..I was looking at spotting scopes and he asked me what I was looking to buy...and I mean right then..and he told me to hold on. He sent me a Bushnell spotting scope. A really nice scope...it will be handy, for the last couple of years my spotter out at the farm has had to use one of my other rifles. This is the same power as my scopes so it will be just right. So if anyone has any brass just gathering dust I will pay shipping and whatever LOL
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zip777
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GMCman..the leg isnt really any better, my leg keeps swelling up like a pig foot and I have been restricted to bed..I got my laptop up here now although I have never used its keyboard. So I have tons of powder (for me) lots of primers, enough bullets for a while and about 16 pieces of brass. A guy locally is selling once fired for $150 for 500. That is so far out of my price range. I am thinking about selling 500 rounds of xm193 to pay for a large bunch of brass.
Heck you can get 1000 cleaned and reprimed for $214!!
will do , I have to anneal as I cut about a1/2 inch off the 5.56 cases and I doubt the cases will take more then a few reloads without annealing so I will be doing more research tonight and trying it tomorrow .
sorry to hear about the leg, I do hope it turns around for you quick, I paid $0.10 a round at the range but I had to sort thru the cases lol. I couldn't find anyone that had any in stock , prices are going thru the roof and not being available as well. Its crazy out there.
BTW Grover perhaps you may want to offer to trade the XM193's for once fired LC considering the price 193's are going for you should be able to get alot of brass that way.
, I have to anneal as I cut about a1/2 inch off the 5.56 cases and I doubt the cases will take more then a few reloads without annealing so I will be doing more research tonight and trying it tomorrow .sorry to hear about the leg, I do hope it turns around for you quick, I paid $0.10 a round at the range but I had to sort thru the cases lol. I couldn't find anyone that had any in stock , prices are going thru the roof and not being available as well. Its crazy out there.
BTW Grover perhaps you may want to offer to trade the XM193's for once fired LC considering the price 193's are going for you should be able to get alot of brass that way
.
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