U.S. Mail legal question?

Grayfox

Grayfox

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A friend of mine has an unusual problem. Former boarder was a real PITA and was kicked out for valid cause.
However, this idiot is now expecting a check for him to arrive in her mailbox. He keeps coming by everyday to check her mailbox. She has repeatedly told him to stay out of it and has called the Police on him several times.
My questions: Isn't it illegal to go into someone else's mailbox for any reason? Even if you're looking for a letter addressed to you? Also, isn't any mail crime an automatic felony? The Police don't seem to be sure and about all they really do is run the guy off.
 
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Theft of mail, tampering with mail, obstructing or impeding delivery of the mail, lots of other criminal acts covered by US Code. The appropriate agency for investigation and enforcement is the US Postal Inspection Service. Any local post office should be able to provide contact information for the postal inspector(s) assigned to each area.

Local and state agencies (police, sheriff, state police, etc) have no specific duty or authority to act, but may liaise with postal inspectors and assist in such cases. I'm not suggesting that local officers would ignore any reported theft, but when US mail is involved the proper authority is the postal inspection service.

Years ago I received a little crash course of instruction when a mail carrier crashed a postal vehicle into a parked car while driving under the influence. A veritable storm of paperwork and grief involved in securing and accounting for the mail, although no one seemed to care very much about the carrier or the vehicle.
 
Grayfox said:
A friend of mine has an unusual problem. Former boarder was a real PITA and was kicked out for valid cause.
However, this idiot is now expecting a check for him to arrive in her mailbox. He keeps coming by everyday to check her mailbox. She has repeatedly told him to stay out of it and has called the Police on him several times.
My questions: Isn't it illegal to go into someone else's mailbox for any reason? Even if you're looking for a letter addressed to you? Also, isn't any mail crime an automatic felony? The Police don't seem to be sure and about all they really do is run the guy off.
Click to expand...
Is the former 'boarder' been using that address to get their mail?
Is that address on the 'boarders' license? If that 'boarder' can prove residence there or say yes to those questions your friend could be in deep you know what.
 
No the guy only lived there for a short time. He had the check sent there because the only other place it could have gone he is not welcome to the point of threats of violence. BTW: she just recently learned this.
To make a long story short, my friend has a heart as big as all outdoors. She was trying to be a good Samaritan and tried to help a guy down on his luck. It came back to bite her on the butt.
No good deed goes unpunished.
 
If the former boarder is gone he should of submitted a COA form. If he did not, then your friend should notify the mail carrier of the former boarders departure and request that he be listed as MLNA.
 
Grayfox said:
A friend of mine has an unusual problem. Former boarder was a real PITA and was kicked out for valid cause.
However, this idiot is now expecting a check for him to arrive in her mailbox. He keeps coming by everyday to check her mailbox. She has repeatedly told him to stay out of it and has called the Police on him several times.
My questions: Isn't it illegal to go into someone else's mailbox for any reason? Even if you're looking for a letter addressed to you? Also, isn't any mail crime an automatic felony? The Police don't seem to be sure and about all they really do is run the guy off.
Click to expand...

Yes, mail tampering is a crime. And also yes, a change-of-address form can be completed in writing or online for free.

I would go to the Post Office and get a change-of-address card, stick it in an envelope and address it to the guy. Then either stick it in the mailbox or use a clothespin or piece of tape to fasten it to the the front of the box where he can see it. When he comes by to get his mail, be sure to leave a little note inside the envelope with the form saying something like: "Fill this out and get your mail, or go through my box again and get arrested."
 
To keep a former tenant from trespassing to check for mail, I REMOVED the mail box since the house was going to be vacant for a few weeks.


I had evicted this tenant who had a "sense of entitlement".
e.g She had a load of crushed rock delivered to front yard for an extra parking pad. It was directly over the sewer lines.

Later I heard that this caused multiple problems, with bills and such, since she had not filed a Change of Address form.

Bekeart
 
"No longer at this address - return to sender" on outside of the envelope and put back in the mailbox with flag up to be picked back up. I'm still getting mail for the little lady that I bought the house from over 8 years ago.
 
The reality beyond the legality is that peeking into someone else's mailbox is no more than a trivial nuisance at best, and is never going to go anywhere in the criminal justice system. Cops know this, which explains why the refrain in these stories usually is that "they didn't do anything."

What makes this even less of a thing from the viewpoint of any legal authority is that everybody seems to agree that the perpetrator has no intention of stealing anything.

So yes, it's technically illegal, but mainly it's an irritation. And in a justice system where real criminals frequently walk, who in his right mind would waste their time on this?
 
This guy is a worthless punk. About 30 and feels entitled. We know he's done jail time. Don't know what for, but I'm sure it was minor. His life is a mess and he did it all to himself. The kid is a punk. But a desperate punk. Flat broke and needs the money bad. That worries me a lot. Desperate people tend to get real stupid.
I was there when he came by today. I tried to talk to him and explain that USPS is having problems. He didn't care. All he's concerned about is getting his money. I told him it wasn't there and that going into the box was illegal. He became quite agitated. Said the Police told him he could look in the box. At this point I saw that talking was useless, so I just turned around and went back into the house.
On advice from the local Postmaster, she's having her mail held for a month. She will have to go to the PO and get it herself. She's disabled and doesn't get around very well. So she will probably only go once a week. I have mixed feelings about this.
Tomorrow morning she's going to call the Postal Inspectors and see what they have to say.
She's also going to have another talk with the Police. His actions are now becoming harassment.
The guy seems to think that she's hiding his check out of pure spite. That is NOT the case. She wants nothing more than to get this idiot his check and get him out of her life. It just hasn't come.
As this drags on, I'm becoming more and more concerned.
 
Grayfox said:
This guy is a worthless punk. About 30 and feels entitled. We know he's done jail time. Don't know what for, but I'm sure it was minor. His life is a mess and he did it all to himself. The kid is a punk. But a desperate punk. Flat broke and needs the money bad. That worries me a lot. Desperate people tend to get real stupid.
I was there when he came by today. I tried to talk to him and explain that USPS is having problems. He didn't care. All he's concerned about is getting his money. I told him it wasn't there and that going into the box was illegal. He became quite agitated. Said the Police told him he could look in the box. At this point I saw that talking was useless, so I just turned around and went back into the house.
On advice from the local Postmaster, she's having her mail held for a month. She will have to go to the PO and get it herself. She's disabled and doesn't get around very well. So she will probably only go once a week. I have mixed feelings about this.
Tomorrow morning she's going to call the Postal Inspectors and see what they have to say.
She's also going to have another talk with the Police. His actions are now becoming harassment.
The guy seems to think that she's hiding his check out of pure spite. That is NOT the case. She wants nothing more than to get this idiot his check and get him out of her life. It just hasn't come.
As this drags on, I'm becoming more and more concerned.
Click to expand...

I was reading replies and was going to suggest she put a "stop" on her mail. My wife gets the email alert that shows a scanned picture of the mail we can expect that day. It doesn't record larger envelopes but does describe it and packages as well. It is a handy little feature she might try. That way she would know when something she is expecting, comes in and she can make arrangements to get it picked up. She also is open to the guy going through her mail and she would have no way of knowing if he already took something thinking it was his or something that looked like money. How would she know?

From the sounds of things, she needs to get rid of the nice person persona and consider obtaining a restraining order on the guy. If you and she have any amount of mistrust or apprehension, that is what I would do. You are right about desperate people and then throw in money and you have a potential mess.

I would most definitely get the local police involved. That way she has a paper trail if something should go south in all of this. Tell them the situation, what she has done, what she is fearful of and so forth. She needs to do that and let the authorities know and take some action.

I had a young lady renter who allowed a man to live with her for a while which is against her lease contract. He was not nice to her and eventually got arrested for drugs although she claimed to not know anything about his drug sales/use. My attorney said to contact him in jail which I did, they give you a nice address to send things to there. In the letter he was specially told to not attempt to contact her at that rental property or go there for any reason. His belongings were in a car and he could contact me to get them picked up. It ended up working out OK as he got out of jail, came to see me to tell me how innocent he was and he was just being framed for a list of things as long as your arm. Later I saw he was rearrested for failure to appear. Never had further problems but I didn't just sit on it. People are nuts, just in case you didn't know.
 
mdf9183 said:
Having worked many cases with the postal inspectors office back in the day. I was told that once it is delivered it is no longer mail. The only time they get involved is when it is taken from a post office or postal vehicle.
Click to expand...

This is my understanding, too. My Postal Inspector buddies all said the same thing: Once its in the box it ain't mail.
 
" Quote:
Originally Posted by mdf9183 View Post
Having worked many cases with the postal inspectors office back in the day. I was told that once it is delivered it is no longer mail. The only time they get involved is when it is taken from a post office or postal vehicle.

This is my understanding, too. My Postal Inspector buddies all said the same thing: Once its in the box it ain't mail."

Anybody who believes this myth should choose at random a mail carrier and follow him or her and remove mail from receptacles after it is delivered.
 
Trying to think "upstream" here.


Who is the punk's check coming from?

Can he contact them to verify/arrange a receipt/delivery that would be more reassuring to him?

Can he get cash via Western Union, or similar?

Could he have it direct deposited? (I understand that street-people usually don't have accounts.)

What is the position of the mailbox? If it's roadside, I would remove it and post a sign on the post that all delivery had been forwarded to the post office.

I'd probably remove the box and do the rest, wherever it was anyway.

Presenting herself as an ally will probably be easier in the long run.

I completely understand the desire to be otherwise, and to make war. Believe me, I do.

But for one's own peace of mind and comfort, there might be another way.
 
Absalom said:
The reality beyond the legality is that peeking into someone else's mailbox is no more than a trivial nuisance at best, and is never going to go anywhere in the criminal justice system. Cops know this, which explains why the refrain in these stories usually is that "they didn't do anything."

What makes this even less of a thing from the viewpoint of any legal authority is that everybody seems to agree that the perpetrator has no intention of stealing anything.

So yes, it's technically illegal, but mainly it's an irritation. And in a justice system where real criminals frequently walk, who in his right mind would waste their time on this?
Click to expand...

Agreed. De Minimis Non Curat Lex
 
He/she will have to go to the post office, ask that the mail be held for pickup at the post office. If/when a check arrives, have them return it as undeliverable (as he does not reside there, do the same with ALL of his mail). Once this fellow realizes that there is no mail arriving, he will soon stop looking. If he is that big of a nuisance, get a criminal trespass warning issued and let the LE doe their thing.

IANAL, but I did drive by a hotel this morning ;)
 
Just to clarify:

A lot of posters here are suggesting actions which presume that the guy is receiving regular check mailings at this address.

My understanding of Grayfox's story is that there is ONE check, presumed to be enroute, which the guy is waiting for, which he could find in that mailbox any day, and the issue would be moot.

In that case it is worth considering whether turning this lady's postal life upside down and making this a full-time high-stress crusade to not have this guy look in the mailbox once a day is really worth it.

Hardly anything important comes snail mail anymore. I check my mailbox every few days unless I forget, but the rest of the time a family of racoons could be running a roadkill take-out out of mine and I'd never notice.
 
Absalom is correct. It is just one check and from what we gather, its a fairly large amount. I've heard the figure $6000 mentioned. No idea who or where its coming from.
I just spoke to my friend. She's going to the PO today and while she's there she's going to talk to the local Postmaster to see if anything can be done.
She also has the direct phone number for the Desk Sergeant at her local precinct and they have discussed the possibility of a Restraining Order. The PD in the area is well aware of the situation.
Anyway, this should all disappear as soon as that damned check shows up. The question is when will that be?
 
When neighbor kids 2 houses up from Me started to remove mail from My mailbox, tear it up, and throw it on the ground, the police would do nothing. Several of Us called the police. Kids were under 10 years and the Police couldn't touch them. Called the post office and the inspectors came out. Said They had to catch them in the act. Took videos of the kids doing it and gave it to the inspectors. The inspectors went Their house and took the parents into custody. Told them is was a 25K fine and 20 years as They were responsible for Their kids. Told Them the kids would go to foster homes. If They didn't stop the kids from doing that. This was in 87 or 88. The family ended up moving as Their house caught on fire. Don't know if the Inspectors were correct, but They scared the bejesus out of the parents and the kids stopped doing that. They just broke into houses instead and tore things up. Until they met a big 10 year old.
 
mckenney99 said:
"I'm still getting mail for the little lady that I bought the house from over 8 years ago.
Click to expand...

On occasion we still get mail addressed to the people that lived in our house more than 25 years ago. Junk mail, but mail no less. I just chunk it.

Have a blessed day,

Leon
 
germansheperd said:
Is the former 'boarder' been using that address to get their mail?
Is that address on the 'boarders' license? If that 'boarder' can prove residence there or say yes to those questions your friend could be in deep you know what.
Click to expand...

That's an important point. I don't know what the law is in the op's state, TN, I believe. But, that is the law in FL, and there have been many cases involving people getting mail at another's house, and able to squat. A PITA legal proceeding is required to get them out. I recognize we're just talking about one piece of mail in this thread, but this person was a "boarder" and might just have it on his license (don't mean to expand the thread). Heads up to the OP, to check local law, and be aware.
 
Just to add. If You let someone move in with You in CO it's not a problem. If You let Them have mail delivered to Them at Your address then They have squatters rights. Tell Them to get a PO box, do not allow Them mail delivery. Lady behind Me did this and ended up having to sell Her house to get rid of Her 'guest' This is real nasty and can cost many, many $'s.
 
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