Victory data base

[Absalom]

Just picked up a British Service Revolver with NO British stamps on it. 5" barrel, US Property marking, 38 S&W CTG on the barrel. SN V398448.
Any idea about manufacture date and why not given to the British?

Later 1943, maybe September.

It still went almost certainly to the British or another Commonwealth country, although the OSS got some to supply to resistance movements they supported.

But British Victorys received no British service markings; the commonly found stamps are post-war commercial proofs; a lack of those simply means the gun was not retired from service through a surplus dealer in Britain.

 

[walkcubs]

Thanx Absalom. Thanx for clarifying the proof marks. I didn't know when they would be stamped.

 

[Rambler42]

I have one I recently acquired. It is serial V179579 and is .38 SW Special with a 4 inch barrel, marked US Navy on the Top Strap.

 

[KEN L]

I have one I recently acquired. It is serial V179579 and is .38 SW Special with a 4 inch barrel, marked US Navy on the Top Strap.

December 1942

 

[2lmaker]

just received a victory with a 5 digit number: V-70023
The only externally visible markings are a flaming bomb on the butt and a small S added under the crane. Under the right grip I find a larger S and smaller K and an F. The weapon appears all original and is in .38 S&W special. The numbers all match, cylinder base, under barrel, I beleive inside the grip but they are hard to make out.

 

[KEN L]

just received a victory with a 5 digit number: V-70023
The only externally visible markings are a flaming bomb on the butt and a small S added under the crane. Under the right grip I find a larger S and smaller K and an F. The weapon appears all original and is in .38 S&W special. The numbers all match, cylinder base, under barrel, I beleive inside the grip but they are hard to make out.

That's a nice rig! Tell us more how you came by it and any history you may know. It most likely shipped in Aug 1942.

 

[Absalom]

just received a victory with a 5 digit number: V-70023
The only externally visible markings are a flaming bomb on the butt and a small S added under the crane. Under the right grip I find a larger S and smaller K and an F. The weapon appears all original and is in .38 S&W special. The numbers all match, cylinder base, under barrel, I beleive inside the grip but they are hard to make out.

All the markings under the grip and under the yoke are fitter‘s marks from the factory and meaningless to us. With only the ordnance bomb (which are found on all kinds of Victorys, military or not), it most likely shipped to an authorized civilian recipient through the Defense Supplies Corporation or to the US Maritime Commission, although during 1942 stamping in general was inconsistent and we have encountered unmarked guns lettering to the Navy.

Your gun looks to be in good original condition and from your description all-matching; the stock numbers are frequently hard to read.

 

[2lmaker]

That's a nice rig! Tell us more how you came by it and any history you may know. It most likely shipped in Aug 1942.

the gun came from a web retailer, but the holster was part of a pair purchased from a retired secret serviceman. I wanted the issued Buchmeir he carried for twenty years and purchased the GI holster he was issued along with it. It was his since the "early 60's". The Holster started me looking at Victorys so it would have a purpose. Funny how a collection grows.
The most I know about the gun is what I have learned here and from the 4th edition.
Thank you very much for the info

 

[DWalt]

The closest SN I have listed is V729xx which shipped on 8/18/42 and was a DSC gun. Had yours been a Navy gun, it should have the U. S. NAVY topstrap stamp. Without it (and given its high condition) it is most likely a DSC gun, much less likely a U.S. MC gun. Not sure I would spend the money to letter it, but if you decide to, the letter should tell you to where it was shipped, probably to either some LE agency or a defense contractor.

 

[Ruralguy57]

New to the Forum and have a Victory

I "just" became a member. I had read through 9 pages of the Victory section here prior to joining. I am trying to find out information about my Victory, but I have not found anything related to my specific pistol.

My Smith & Wesson Victory has:

*#288185, on the but strap, but a filled in swivel plug that seems original, not ground off. There are no other marks. There is no flaming bomb or other designations.
*The #288185 is on the Cylinder face when swung out.
*The # 288185 is on the back face of the star.
*The flat spot under the barrel where a number should be has no marking, and seemed unfinished-not polished.
*The flat straps on top of the pistol are polished and have no markings on them. They were not ground.
*The barrel is 4" from the face of the cylinder to the end.
*The Barrel is marked:
Left side: Smith and Wesson
Top: the typical Smith and Wesson 2-line Text, ending with; Dec 25 14 or something like that
Right side: 38 S&W Special CTG
*The Barrel lug has not been cut or removed and the knurl on the ejector rod is really detailed. I am saying this because this pistol has been nickeled and the knurl could be worn down but not here it is really strong and detailed. I have seen others with almost smooth knurls that have been nickeled.
*The front sight is the typical 1/2 round type.
*The number on the crane is different but matching, #38792. *The Cylinder is marked with a crown and BNP on each flute. It is also marked with the word "England" along the cylinder edge .
*The crown and BNP is also on the area in front of the trigger guard flat spot.

I am trying to mention everything I have read before here, as things you look for.

**Note: The most unusual thing on the Pistol is the right side is blank. It does not look like the S&W logo has been ground. Just NO S&W logo. There is no shadow of a faint stamp. It is completely blank. There is "Made in USA" near the trigger guard but seems to be a bit faint.

My question to the group is:

How many other Victory Pistols have you seen with no S&W Identifiable logo on the side plate? I have read on other places on the net that this pistol could have been placed with the OSS or a similar Group in the UK, unmarked, to not identify the gun manufacture. However, it is marked Smith and Wesson on the Barrel.

In the 9 pages I had gone through previously here, I did not see many people who had Victory Models with a serial in the 288,xxx range. I would think they show up. From what I read, a lot were 4xx,xxx-8xx,xxx or older serials. I possibly have not read far enough to catch any others similar to mine in a serial range.

Thank you for your help.

Richard

 

[Ruralguy57]

The Victory with non marked side plate

Photos of:

*Blank side plate
*Barrel Info
*Butt strap
*Cylinder face number
*Crane inner number

 

[Ruralguy57]

second group of photos of the Victory

Photos of:

*Top strap
*Butt strap
*Cylinder England crown bnp
*Underside crown bnp
*Non-marked underside of barrel

 

[Igiveup]

I have V142556, .38 spl, US Navy on top strap. The barrel and frame are same number, the cylinder has been replaced with sn 160025. Any idea of date shipped, made, etc.?

 

[Muley Gil]

Ruralguy57,

Welcome to the Forum.

The serial number includes the "V" that is off to the side. The revolver has been nickel plated, but not by the factory. The lanyard loop hole has been plugged.

 

[Ruralguy57]

WAR EAGLE;

Thank you for your response. My bad, I thought I had put the "V" in front of the serial. I read and reread the text and I guess I just glossed over it. Thank you for pointing it out.

 

[Absalom]

Ruralguy57:

Your gun is a bit unusual as at first look it seems to be a .38 Special that was commercial-proofed in Britain.

However, the cylinder looks like the chambers were reamed from a .38 S&W.

In addition, the absence of a barrel serial, as well as no sideplate logo, make it likely that this is a parts gun. No Victorys left the factory without the large sideplate logo.

So unless heavy buffing removed the stampings, they were unstamped factory replacement parts.

In summary, I think this was a British Service model Victory from 1943 that had its chambers reamed to .38 Special and its 5” barrel replaced with a 4” .38 Special barrel, the lanyard hole was plugged, and the gun was refinished. The sideplate was either polished or replaced.

 

[Absalom]

I have V142556, .38 spl, US Navy on top strap. The barrel and frame are same number, the cylinder has been replaced with sn 160025. Any idea of date shipped, made, etc.?

Later 1942, October/November, is the ballpark. I seem to remember cases of cylinder replacements with relatively close serials here before. Might be an indication that it was an in-service repair.

 

[Igiveup]

Absalom, thank you. I went down to Reno this last spring and found it at the big gun show there. Because of the mismatched cylinder, the price was right and I wanted a shooter, which it is. I was also intrigued with the U.S. Navy mark on the top strap.

 

[butchkent]

Victory S&W with Parker Hale mods

Attached is photo of a S&W Victory Model .38 S&W with mods by Parker Hale at some point.

 

[Ruralguy57]

Absalom,

Thank you for the information.

If I understand you, the Victory I have must have been reworked in an England plant/ Arsenal as it has no import marks, and it is stamped England with a crown over BNP. The Victory would have been reworked and shipped to USA before 1968. After 1968 all guns imported into USA would be marked from the plant selling the pistols.

The barrel is a different 4 inch barrel and left blank then refitted because of the stamped 38 S&W Special CTG on the right side. The side plate, would have been ground or buffed or had a blank part replacing it. I looked at the butt strap where the lanyard ring should be and saw there are no ground marks on the outside or inside of the frame. I see the plug in the frame. I looked in the cylinder and saw what you were saying about the rings being ground down. I have put a 38 special into the cylinder and it seems to fit. Now I understand what you are saying about the pistol starting as a 38 S&W which was retrofitted into a 38 S&W Special. The trigger pull in the DA mode is stiff, however the pull in SA mode is about 2-3 or so lbs. I don't know if the trigger pull has been ground as well. There are a lot of rework pistols that are nickeled and stamped with a crown over BNP and sold in USA with various barrel lengths.

I have ordered a replacement set of grips. The seller said the grips I purchased were from an arsenal as they have an "11" stamped in the round or upper part of the wood. I was told the grips on my Victory are wrong, because the frame shows under the grip. I will post a photo of them when I get them.

Again, thank you for telling me about the pistol. I had no real idea and is why I asked this forum.

Richard