Victory data base

[helmsp]

Here's one from Vienna/Austria.

- S/N on barrel, frame, cylinder and stocks are identical
- has been rebored for .38spl
- CB marking on the left side which could be the Carl Walther (Import)
- SH on the backstrap could be Schleswig Holstein and POL for Polizei. Not sure what the I and 294 stand for
- Has the GHD on the topstrap

Hope this helps and looking forward to a DOB or any further information to this fine piece.

Sorry for those dirty snapshots, not my style but kids arent giving me much time today.

 

[Absalom]

Here's one from Vienna/Austria.

- S/N on barrel, frame, cylinder and stocks are identical
- has been rebored for .38spl
- CB marking on the left side which could be the Carl Walther (Import)
- SH on the backstrap could be Schleswig Holstein and POL for Polizei. Not sure what the I and 294 stand for
- Has the GHD on the topstrap
....

Good one! The V 750701 makes it a very late BSR, Dec./Jan. ‘44/‘45. That would explain its overall good condition. The left grip panel is pretty funky; never seen that swirl on a standard walnut stock.

Your Schleswig-Holstein guess is likely correct. The I might be a city code, possibly Itzehoe, HQ of one of the police directorates (Polizeidirektion), which would explain the relatively high inventory number. After starting out with ex-Wehrmacht P08’s, S-H police was issued S&W revolvers in 1947 and used them through the 1950s, along with other types, until standardizing on the Walther PP by the beginning of the 1960s.

Interestingly, the gun also has the large P at the end of the backstrap, which has appeared on the side frame of various Victorys and to my knowledge not been convincingly decoded yet.

 

[helmsp]

Good one! The V 750701 makes it a very late BSR, Dec./Jan. ‘44/‘45. That would explain its overall good condition. The left grip panel is pretty funky; never seen that swirl on a standard walnut stock.

Your Schleswig-Holstein guess is likely correct. The I might be a city code, possibly Itzehoe, HQ of one of the police directorates (Polizeidirektion), which would explain the relatively high inventory number. After starting out with ex-Wehrmacht P08’s, S-H police was issued S&W revolvers in 1947 and used them through the 1950s, along with other types, until standardizing on the Walther PP by the beginning of the 1960s.

Interestingly, the gun also has the large P at the end of the backstrap, which has appeared on the side frame of various Victorys and to my knowledge not been convincingly decoded yet.

Thank you so much for the great information on this piece. Really appreciate it.

 

[helmsp]

Sorry, but I couldn't resist taking a better pictures of this beauty.


S&W .38 Military & Police Victory Model by swaficionado, on Flickr


Edit:
I can't really decipher the letters before "property G.H.D.". In theory it should be U.S., shouldn't it?

IMG_8580 by swaficionado, on Flickr

 

[tenntex32]

Sorry, but I couldn't resist taking a better pictures of this beauty.


S&W .38 Military & Police Victory Model by swaficionado, on Flickr


Edit:
I can't really decipher the letters before "property G.H.D.". In theory it should be U.S., shouldn't it?

IMG_8580 by swaficionado, on Flickr

Yes, it should read "U.S. PROPERTY G.H.D."

Also, you show .38special cartridges with the revolver. Has it been converted to accept .38Special as I would think it would only accept .38S&W cartridges if all original.

Dale

P.S. I see now where you stated it has been bored to accept .38Special. How is it's accuracy using .38special ammo?

 

[Squidly]

Wall hangers

I just bought two victory frames from a yard sale. Rusty as heck and stripped completely. Kind of a hobby project. The first is V1901xx which from what I have read puts it late 1942-early1943. The next has me scratching my head. S/N V914. That's it, a letter and 3 numbers. Anyone have any thoughts?

 

[Absalom]

.....The next has me scratching my head. S/N V914. That's it, a letter and 3 numbers. Anyone have any thoughts?

Are the V plus three digits centered next to the lanyard hole in such a way that it seems not likely that any further digits were somehow removed by grinding?

If so, it's simply an early Victory from summer 1942. They started at V 1, so there has to have been a V 914

 

[Squidly]

Are the V plus three digits centered next to the lanyard hole in such a way that it seems not likely that any further digits were somehow removed by grinding?

If so, it's simply an early Victory from summer 1942. They started at V 1, so there has to have been a V 914

It seems like it is original.

 

[pzjgr]

Bitten By The Victory Bug...

New to the forum guy here...

So I was set up at a local show this weekend, and when I was walking through last month, I found a guy who had two Victories for sale. I've kind of wanted one for a while, and figured I'd pop over his table Saturday before the show opened and see if he had them still...

Of course Saturday, got over there, and he had sold the one in somewhat nicer condition last show...oh well.

So I looked at the remaining one...it was in ok shape, all original finish, not stamped on the top strap, which I have read here means more than likely it was sent to the DSC...I also see I can request a letter to find out where it was shipped possibly, I'll have to look into doing that.

It is complete, with lanyard ring, which seems to be often missing. S/N is V 349572. All numbered parts that should be numbered match nicely. Bottom of grip strap has the "V" prefix s/n, and ordnance bomb marking, plus an "M" or "W", which I don't know if it means anything or not...there is a proof "P" on the frame, and one on barrel.

Original and correct grips...rough idea by serial number is earlier to mid 1943 delivery?

The guy had it marked at $495 which I think is high, but when I talked to him about it Saturday morning, he said, cash money, he'd take $400...so I decided to grab it.

Working on cleaning it up very carefully, slowly, and judiciously...but here are some initial pic...

Like the gun very much, comfortable in hand, points nicely, lockup is tight...can't wait to put some rounds through it!

I will now be looking to pick up some other variants, I really dig it!

 

[Absalom]

New to the forum guy here...

....S/N is V 349572. All numbered parts that should be numbered match nicely. Bottom of grip strap has the "V" prefix s/n, and ordnance bomb marking, plus an "M" or "W", which I don't know if it means anything or not...there is a proof "P" on the frame, and one on barrel.

Original and correct grips...rough idea by serial number is earlier to mid 1943 delivery?
....

Welcome to the forum.

You’ve got it identified and dated about right. And 400 seems a good price for complete, all-matching and original.

The W stamp has been subject to speculation and research, but as far as I know there is no satisfactory explanation yet. At one time it was linked to Westinghouse, but that has been discounted.

 

[ordnanceguy]

..... Bottom of grip strap has the "V" prefix s/n, and ordnance bomb marking, plus an "M" or "W", which I don't know if it means anything or not...there is a proof "P" on the frame, and one on barrel.
Original and correct grips...rough idea by serial number is earlier to mid 1943 delivery?

That's a nice looking Victory. The letter on the butt would be a W, not an M. And your guess on the shipping date is pretty good. Based on the Victory Model Database, I would estimate that your revolver likely shipped in the July, 1943 time frame.

Welcome to the Forum.

 

[nbedford]

Fairly early Victory I bought about 25 years ago. S# V824XX on the butt with a very small ordnance bomb opposite the lanyard from the serial number. No other markings on it at all. I assume it was shipped fairly early in 1942. Also, it looks as though it was not parkerized, but issued in the white. If parkerized it was a very light finish.

 

[Rescue190]

Victory Lend Lease Model

I just acquired and wanted to share with the database. I am guessing on 3rd quarter of 1944 but any better ideas are appreciated.
John

 

[ordnanceguy]

Rescue190:

Thanks for posting your very nice Victory. Since your pic reveals the complete serial (I can't work with incomplete serials), I can estimate for you that your revolver likely shipped from the factory in the August-September, 1944 time frame.

Am I correct in assuming that your example also has left top strap markings of Ố U.S. PROPERTY G.H.D. ?

 

[Rescue190]

Yes charlie it does have the property mark and GHD on the top left strap. I forgot to take the pic. It is my understanding this change occurred in May of 1943 but past that I am not sure. The pic does reveal the entire serial number, the V is covered up by the loop, but I did not think that was an issue. My apologies, I am not trying to hide anything as that is not helping the forum. V656906
John

 

[s&wchad]

Another for the database...

Picked up my first Victory Model over the weekend.

Serial # V452486 (all matching numbers, no re-work marks)
Flaming bomb on butt
4" .38 Special
No top strap markings

I believe this is a DSC contract gun from late 1943. The finish looks original to me and it shows little signs of use, just some holster wear and spotting from poor storage. It's out of an estate and came in a strange unmarked IWB holster.

Does a letter generally identify the end user, or do they just show DSC?

 

[CincyRoy]

New member to the forums here, glad and sad that I found this thread. After reading through some of these posts, I'm pretty sure I have a Frankenstein Victory. I received this Victory a few years ago when my grandfather died. He seems to have gotten it from a friend/co worker back in the 60s for a nightstand gun. Markings on top of the frame is a Ord. flaming piss pot, U.S. PROPERTY G.H.D, the SN# on the butt is V 621450, on the frame and crane it is 73832, under the barrel it reads C300447 (not very clear in the pic) . No marks on the backstrap. Did someone mash this thing together from parts laying around the shop to make a snub?
Not pictured the forcing cone looks pretty good. So am I right, this thing is cobbled together from multiple guns? Should I even think of firing regular .38, let alone .38 special through it? I have no worries as to the $ value of the gun as it is pretty beat up. Just something to keep in the safe and say it belonged to grandpa.

under the barrel

the barrel

 

[dwforsci]

Victory Database

I didn't know about the database on my last inquiry. If those who maintain in can give me any info on mine, I'd appreciate it.
V 393573. Yolk numbers 47321 with an S below. Grip looks period but is oversized and hides the SN. Barrel has been replaced with a 6" slabside under a full length Bo-Mar sight rail.
Deep blue color.38 special. Very light single action trigger pull.
I've been told the modifications are most likely a PPC conversion but I know little about the guns early history.

 

[s&wchad]

New member to the forums here, glad and sad that I found this thread. After reading through some of these posts, I'm pretty sure I have a Frankenstein Victory. I received this Victory a few years ago when my grandfather died. He seems to have gotten it from a friend/co worker back in the 60s for a nightstand gun. Markings on top of the frame is a Ord. flaming piss pot, U.S. PROPERTY G.H.D, the SN# on the butt is V 621450, on the frame and crane it is 73832, under the barrel it reads C300447 (not very clear in the pic) . No marks on the backstrap. Did someone mash this thing together from parts laying around the shop to make a snub?

under the barrel

the barrel

Yes, someone replaced the original barrel with a commercial M&P barrel from the mid 1950’s. The change required a shorter ejector rod, so they also replace that. Looks like they used vice grips to tighten the rod.

I’m not up on these enough to tell if your gun was originally chambered in .38 Special or the British .38-200 (.38 S&W), but they’re not interchangeable. The .38-200 is shorter and fatter and the cylinder needs to be bored out to accept the .38 Special cartridge. Thousands were modified after the war, but the modification cal lead to bulged or ruptured cases when shooting .38 Specials. If a .38 S&W cartridge fits in the chambers, it was originally a British Lend Lease gun. If it doesn’t, your probably safe shooting standard velocity .38 Special cartridges.

 

[Absalom]

....
Serial # V452486 (all matching numbers, no re-work marks)
Flaming bomb on butt
4" .38 Special
No top strap markings

I believe this is a DSC contract gun from late 1943.
....
Does a letter generally identify the end user, or do they just show DSC?
....

Your identification is right on.

And yes, at that time DSC guns letter as shipped to the final recipient.

Only for a few months in early 1942 did the DSC physically receive the guns and then handle the actual distribution; so only pre-Victorys from the first few months of 1942 will letter to the DSC warehouse in Washington. After that, they switched to just handling the paperwork and having S&W ship directly to the end user.

There is a small chance an unmarked gun like yours will letter as shipped to the US Maritime Commission.