Victory data base

[GRI]

The somewhat greyish-shiny finish does mesh with other Indian-refinished BSR's I've seen. But all those had an RFI stamp for Rifle Factory Ishapore somewhere on the barrel. My experience with those is limited, though.

"First or second day of production" is really meaningless on these since the BSR's had been produced in the identical Victory configuration (utility finish, smooth stocks, lanyard swivel) since at least the low 900-thousands and simply continued with V-prefix numbers when they hit 999,999. All that changed was the numbering.

I checked again, no RFI, but it does have an inspector's mark on the butt, "WB." Also on the butt is an ordinance bomb stamp and a small "P."

 

[Absalom]

I checked again, no RFI, but it does have an inspector's mark on the butt, "WB." Also on the butt is an ordinance bomb stamp and a small "P."

Those are all from the original factory production before it shipped initially. There were contract inspectors at the factory who inspected the guns for the Ordnance District. WB are the initials of the inspector-in-charge at the time, Waldemar Broberg; the P is a standard military proof, and the flaming bomb an acceptance mark.

 

[Absalom]

I checked again, no RFI, but it does have an inspector's mark on the butt, "WB." Also on the butt is an ordinance bomb stamp and a small "P."

GRI:
I don't know how you acquired V773, but it somehow rung a bell, so I did some checking of old threads and discovered that this gun came up for discussion on the Colt forum a few years ago. I can't find the original Colt forum thread, but I asked one of our experts and keepers of the Victory database here, Charlie Flick, for input, and he was certain that this gun, just based on the asterisk stamps, is an Ishapore-reworked gun. Back then, the owner mentioned a Century Arms import mark. Does it still have that?

 

[GRI]

GRI:
I don't know how you acquired V773, but it somehow rung a bell, so I did some checking of old threads and discovered that this gun came up for discussion on the Colt forum a few years ago. I can't find the original Colt forum thread, but I asked one of our Erexperts and keepers of the Victory database here, Charlie Flick, for input, and he was certain that this gun, just based on the asterisk stamps, is an Ishapore-reworked gun. Back then, the owner mentioned a Century Arms import mark. Does it still have that?

You're right, that was me. It has the Century Arms import mark. I wanted to make sure it was in this thread and I still had some questions. I had thought the gun may have been used for tests because guns in that range show up as such in the Springfield Research Service book. In my Colt post I got beat up pretty bad and just stuck the gun away. I never mentioned the Springfield Research service in the original post. Of significant interest, while all the rest is matching, the crane was renumbered to the correct assembly number. I don't think the Indians with an arsenal re-work would have bothered renumbering the crane. This may have been done during the original production. I thought this could be another indication of a test gun. I just want to add that I never found a reference to the asterisk in any of my books and have not seen another gun with those marks. I would have to assume this was a standard way Ishapore marked their re-works, but of course, I could have missed seeing the asterisk proof marks on another gun or in a reference.

 

[GRI]

The somewhat greyish-shiny finish does mesh with other Indian-refinished BSR's I've seen. But all those had an RFI stamp for Rifle Factory Ishapore somewhere on the barrel. My experience with those is limited, though.

"First or second day of production" is really meaningless on these since th.e BSR's had been produced in the identical Victory configuration (utility finish, smooth stocks, lanyard swivel) since at least the low 900-thousands and simply continued with V-prefix numbers when they hit 999,999. All that changed was the numbering.

While I understand that the V model was physically the same as its predecessor, there is a significance to the introduction of the V model. This is witnessed by the fact that V1-V5 were made into presentation pieces, with President Harry Truman ending up with serial V1. The presentation pieces were first day guns.

 

[Absalom]

While I understand that the V model was physically the same as its predecessor, there is a significance to the introduction of the V model. This is witnessed by the fact that V1-V5 were made into presentation pieces, with President Harry Truman ending up with serial V1. The presentation pieces were first day guns.

You're right, but those were all US Victory models in .38 Special. It would be interesting to know what the lowest known BSR V-prefix serial is.

 

[DWalt]

As posted here previously, V 16 is a BSR. Not to say there are no earlier ones. Allegedly, a very high percentage of the early V-series revolvers were BSRs, but certainly not all.

 

[GRI]

You're right, but those were all US Victory models in .38 Special. It would be interesting to know what the lowest known BSR V-prefix serial is.

I was thinking the same thing...what was the first British V model serial number and what is the lowest number observed?

 

[GRI]

As posted here previously, V 16 is a BSR. Not to say there are no earlier ones. Allegedly, a very high percentage of the early V-series revolvers were BSRs, but certainly not all.

As far as serial numbers go, I guess the real question is how did they decide which was a US gun and which was a British gun? I can't imagine it was random since they were different configurations. My experience with Colts is that guns were done in batches. In addition, there must have been assigned serial numbers.

 

[Absalom]

As far as serial numbers go, I guess the real question is how did they decide which was a US gun and which was a British gun? I can't imagine it was random since they were different configurations. My experience with Colts is that guns were done in batches. In addition, there must have been assigned serial numbers.

It likely just involved setting quantified goals by the manager in charge. Keep in mind that almost until the final assembly, they were building only one type of gun. The barrel was the only different part; even the cylinder was identical until the chambers were bored. So large parts of the production chugged along without having to make any choices or changes between the two versions (or three if you consider the .38 Spl. 2" variant).

 

[chriscokid]

I received a model Victory with the sn. V 311661 all matching numbers (i haven't pulled the grips yet but I'm 99% sure they match also.. What I think I knows is its 1943 with a 4inch barrel. No other "special" markings. Any infomation you can give me about the gun would be great.
Although my grandfather served in wwIl, this gun belonged to my great grandfather. In the late 50s early 60s he killed himself with it and its been sitting in closests since and just recently it was given to me. I mailed off for a letter to S&W when should I expect a return letter?.... I'm not sure how to upload a picture on hear.

 

[Absalom]

I received a model Victory with the sn. V 311661 all matching numbers (i haven't pulled the grips yet but I'm 99% sure they match also.. What I think I knows is its 1943 with a 4inch barrel. No other "special" markings. Any infomation you can give me about the gun would be great.
Although my grandfather served in wwIl, this gun belonged to my great grandfather. In the late 50s early 60s he killed himself with it and its been sitting in closests since and just recently it was given to me. I mailed off for a letter to S&W when should I expect a return letter?.... I'm not sure how to upload a picture on hear.

Sorry about the unfortunate circumstances attached to the gun.

1943 is correct for that serial, and if is a 4" .38 Special with no other markings, it would most likely be a gun shipped to a stateside police agency or defense contractor through the Defense Supplies Corporation. Your letter should take two to three weeks from the date of mailing the form.

For pictures, it's easiest to "Go advanced" below the quick reply box, go to "Manage attachments", and follow the prompts to upload photos from your computer or smartphone.

 

[Wiregrassguy]

Welcome to the forums from the Wiregrass!

 

[chriscokid]

Thanks.. I uploaded some pictures.. what is the gun worth?

 

[Absalom]

Thanks.. I uploaded some pictures.. what is the gun worth?

It does have the topstrap property mark, so disregard what I said; it will likely letter as a standard military-shipped Victory, statistically most likely to have gone to a Navy location.

As for value, artificial light makes condition a bit hard to judge, however it shows use wear, but appears all original, so if all serial numbers match, including the stocks, you are probably looking at a 400-500 dollar gun, maybe a bit more if it looks better in natural light.

 

[clauded56]

Here's one...
5'' 38 SW CTG, left topstrap, US PROPERTY GHD. there is a stamp before the 'U' that that looks like a possible 6 or 8, the upper portion of the stamp is blurry.
'C' stamp on lower left grip frame. Numbers match everywhere.
Smooth walnut stocks. S/N V4262XX

 

[Absalom]

......
5'' 38 SW CTG, left topstrap, US PROPERTY GHD. there is a stamp before the 'U' that that looks like a possible 6 or 8, the upper portion of the stamp is blurry.
'C' stamp on lower left grip frame. Numbers match everywhere.
Smooth walnut stocks. S/N V4262XX

That would be a British Service model, Lend-lease, from the late months of 1943.

If by "lower left grip frame" you mean the shoulder of the grip and there is an arrow inside the C, it would be a Canadian military property stamp. (See attached, somewhat mis-stamped example)

The stamp before the U.S. on the topstrap is a "flaming bomb" ordnance mark, standard in that location. See the third photo attached to post #1744 sbove.

 

[chriscokid]

It does have the topstrap property mark, so disregard what I said; it will likely letter as a standard military-shipped Victory, statistically most likely to have gone to a Navy location.

As for value, artificial light makes condition a bit hard to judge, however it shows use wear, but appears all original, so if all serial numbers match, including the stocks, you are probably looking at a 400-500 dollar gun, maybe a bit more if it looks better in natural light.

Wow thanks... Now I can't wait to get the letter. My hope is that the gun left S&W and went straight to Louisiana. If that he the case the gun has never left this state.

 

[clauded56]

That would be a British Service model, Lend-lease, from the late months of 1943.

If by "lower left grip frame" you mean the shoulder of the grip and there is an arrow inside the C, it would be a Canadian military property stamp. (See attached, somewhat mis-stamped example)

The stamp before the U.S. on the topstrap is a "flaming bomb" ordnance mark, standard in that location. See the third photo attached to post #1744 sbove.

Thanks much. The 'C' is on the side of the frame under the left grip. No arrow. thanks again.
really enjoy this thread. Worth publishing!!

 

[Tarfu43]

V10455, no property marks, .38 Special.