What does this image tell you about this .32 HE?
- Thread starter two-bit cowboy
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Wear marks from the jiggling and impact of the cartridge heads against the recoil shield like that means the gun has been shot - A LOT. From what I have seen those marks are more common on magnums due to the more violent recoil of magnum rounds. I'm thinking that for a non magnum to have such prominent marks makes me think that the gun has probably seen thousands of rounds.
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Note also that the hole around the cylinder release pin is getting oval. It's a high mileage gun.
I have an ex WSP transitional 44 like that. Shoots fine, but it's loose as a (insert off color simile here).
I have an ex WSP transitional 44 like that. Shoots fine, but it's loose as a (insert off color simile here).
Note also that the hole around the cylinder release pin is getting oval. It's a high mileage gun.
I have an ex WSP transitional 44 like that. Shoots fine, but it's loose as a (insert off color simile here).
Loose as a goose?
You're way too nice .Loose as a goose?
Loose as a goose?
That was my first thought, and the only people that call me "nice" are Mom's friends.
Here is my reasoning on these marks on the recoil shield.
The brass markings behind the top cylinder of course are from the brass case being forced backward. Powder explodes and forces the bullet forward and forces the case backward into the recoil shield. Easy to understand.
But what about the other five? No exploding powder force here. When the gun fires the whole revolver kicks back. Due to their inertia the five non-firing cartridges, which are loose in their chambers, would be forced forward until their rims were tight against the cylinder face, not backward against the recoil shield.
I think these other five marks are from the cartridges jiggling around as the user walks while carrying the revolver. And maybe all six, including the top one, are from jiggling.
Think about this and if I'm wrong, explain it to me.
The brass markings behind the top cylinder of course are from the brass case being forced backward. Powder explodes and forces the bullet forward and forces the case backward into the recoil shield. Easy to understand.
But what about the other five? No exploding powder force here. When the gun fires the whole revolver kicks back. Due to their inertia the five non-firing cartridges, which are loose in their chambers, would be forced forward until their rims were tight against the cylinder face, not backward against the recoil shield.
I think these other five marks are from the cartridges jiggling around as the user walks while carrying the revolver. And maybe all six, including the top one, are from jiggling.
Think about this and if I'm wrong, explain it to me.
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You're wrong. Those marks are from recoil, but it's a two step process. First, the cartridges are forced forward by the gun moving back; second, the cartridges spring backwards from their forward position, sort of like a compressed spring.
They're not from just carrying a gun around.
They're not from just carrying a gun around.
I don't see the brass cases compressing like springs and then popping back.
If someone possesses two revolvers known to have these backgrounds it would be interesting.
Revolver A: Carried by an officer walking a beat for 30 years and only shooting a few rounds each year to qualify.
Revolver B: Used by a target shooting competitor shooting thousands of rounds each year, but the revolver was never carried as a duty pistol.
According to my reasoning A would have the marks behind all six chambers, B would have no marks except perhaps behind the firing chamber.
If anyone has such revolvers with known histories that would contribute.
I must go with "Occam's Razor". The simplest explanation (cartridges jiggle while walking) is usually the correct explanation.
How about duty pistol shot thousands of times?
That's where I see those marks. I've never seen them on low shot count guns.
To your Ocean's razor point, in a normal duty holster, the cartridges shouldn't be in contact with the recoil shield, they'd be in contact with the cylinder only. In a recoil situation, when the rearward motion of the gun is stopped by the shooter, the cartridges will continue to move until they're stopped by the recoil shield. Newton's 1st law.
That's where I see those marks. I've never seen them on low shot count guns.
To your Ocean's razor point, in a normal duty holster, the cartridges shouldn't be in contact with the recoil shield, they'd be in contact with the cylinder only. In a recoil situation, when the rearward motion of the gun is stopped by the shooter, the cartridges will continue to move until they're stopped by the recoil shield. Newton's 1st law.
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"the cartridges shouldn't be in contact with the recoil shield, they'd be in contact with the cylinder only." If the revolver is carried muzzle down and the officer walks smoothly you are correct. The cartridges would rest on their rims and not contact the recoil shield. If the officer's gate were at all bumpy the cartridges might bounce upward and hit the recoil shield. I don't know.
"when the rearward motion of the gun is stopped by the shooter, the cartridges will continue to move until they're stopped by the recoil shield." This sounds reasonable, if the cartridges are loose in the chambers like the five. The fired case in chamber one may be not free to move like the others.
The only piece of empirical evidence I have is a Colt Detective Special (2" barrel) that the seller told me was carried for many years by a New York City police officer. The blue is worn off where the strap from its holster went. It was obviously carried for a long time. It has the "jiggle marks" on the recoil shield and I do not think this was the type revolver used to shoot lots of rounds at targets. Although obviously well-used, the revolver is tight with a perfect bore. This leads me to believe jiggling, not lots of fired rounds is the cause. But I don't know the gun's history first hand. I guess snub nosed revolvers can have a high round count.
If a revolver for sale was tight I would not pass on it due to brass marks on the recoil shield. It could be used as a negotiating point to lower the price though.
Comments from owners of revolvers with known histories may settle the question.
The cases are free to slam back and forth. Gun itself is held tightly by shooters hand bang, gun goes back and rolls up in recoil, cases try. To stay in ordinal spot, so the gun slams back into o them. But then the hand comes into place trying t get back to it's orgibal position, springing the gun forward, but not the cases. Case heads slam into recoil shield. Thousands of times will wear Orr blue. More conserning is wear on Center phone n hole.
You normally don't get those marks from "target" loads. Full power or +P loads will show like that more prominently.
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The marks are signs of heavy use, so a thorough examination for wear would be in order before purchase. It may check out fine or be loose mechanically.
Those marks are from lots of shooting.
I would surmise hot loads and too large a gap between the rear cylinder face and the recoil shield.
Jiggling could do itt, but in a normal holster the rounds are seated in cylinder and should not touch recoil shield. Maybe a lot of jogging. Possibly it could happen a shoulder holster where the gun hung barrel up.
Neither of those explain the egg shaped center pin hole. Which was caused by numerous openings and closings possible rapid ones or the dreaded Hollywood flip.
Neither of those explain the egg shaped center pin hole. Which was caused by numerous openings and closings possible rapid ones or the dreaded Hollywood flip.
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I have a Regulation Police 38 that has all 5 showing that. And I have 2 Colt Army Specials in 32 W.C.F. that show all 6 of the case marks. I'm of the opinion that cylinder shake is a serious contributor to the cartridge case tracks around the recoil shield. I have a Ruger NMBH in 357 that shows signs of the case impacts. I never considered it rare and never worried about it unless there were other serious problems involved. Come to think; I have a Uberti SAA in 44 Special that shows signs of it as well.
Lots and lots and lots of jogging.
More likely is lots and lots of rounds.
More likely is lots and lots of rounds.
This is my 1978 28-2. Shot a lot with only .357s. Carried very little in a holster.
This is my 1959 27. Its been shot a lot and I think its been carried very little in a holster too.
This is my 686 no dash. Its been shot thousands and thousands of times. I'm sure 1000s of both
.38 and .357 rounds and I doubt that its ever been carried in a holster.
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