Atticaz
Member
You wouldn't worry about it. It would all be worked into muscle memory.
Why do people care so much about trigger reset?
- Thread starter Dr.um
- Start date
Trigger control ultimately means releasing the sear without moving the front sight -- or more accurately without moving the front sight OFF TARGET. Nothing wrong with front sight movement at 3 yards, just shoot fast and make the bad guy stop.
That said, there is more than one right answer. If you break the shot, hold the trigger back, release it until reset, and fire again, there is nothing wrong with this, but I will add the following:
When the gun goes bang and all that noise and force hits your senses if you are waiting for the reset you are going too slow because most people can't feel and hear the reset at the same time the gun is going bang so most people wait a fraction of a second after the bang and then release to reset. This is the biggest reason why I don't think a tactile and audible reset is important - you won't hear or feel it in a gun fight or when shooting very fast (which can also happen in a gun fight).
That is why I break the shot, and then as quickly as possible (while the gun is recoiling) I release the trigger and pull back on the trigger to the point of resistance, realign sights, and rinse and repeat. Of course with speed comes some compromise so if shooting fast I just try to track the front sight rather than carefully realign - typically distance to target dictates how much time is spent realigning sights before the next shot is broken. The thing that I do at the same speed regardless of distance is release the trigger while the gun is recoiling and reapplying pressure until the point of resistance is felt.
Remember, once the gun goes bang, you have no control over that projectile. All you can do is find the most effective way for you to prepare for the next shot. For me, the reset has very little to do with it, but I do prefer the 2013 M&P and GLOCK reset to the older M&P trigger because I know some people prefer it, and it doesn't hinder me either way.
To each their own. There are different schools of thought out there and if you train and practice a certain method you will become better with that method which is what we should be doing - safely becoming better with our weapons in the off chance we have to use those weapons to protect ourselves / families.
That said, there is more than one right answer. If you break the shot, hold the trigger back, release it until reset, and fire again, there is nothing wrong with this, but I will add the following:
When the gun goes bang and all that noise and force hits your senses if you are waiting for the reset you are going too slow because most people can't feel and hear the reset at the same time the gun is going bang so most people wait a fraction of a second after the bang and then release to reset. This is the biggest reason why I don't think a tactile and audible reset is important - you won't hear or feel it in a gun fight or when shooting very fast (which can also happen in a gun fight).
That is why I break the shot, and then as quickly as possible (while the gun is recoiling) I release the trigger and pull back on the trigger to the point of resistance, realign sights, and rinse and repeat. Of course with speed comes some compromise so if shooting fast I just try to track the front sight rather than carefully realign - typically distance to target dictates how much time is spent realigning sights before the next shot is broken. The thing that I do at the same speed regardless of distance is release the trigger while the gun is recoiling and reapplying pressure until the point of resistance is felt.
Remember, once the gun goes bang, you have no control over that projectile. All you can do is find the most effective way for you to prepare for the next shot. For me, the reset has very little to do with it, but I do prefer the 2013 M&P and GLOCK reset to the older M&P trigger because I know some people prefer it, and it doesn't hinder me either way.
To each their own. There are different schools of thought out there and if you train and practice a certain method you will become better with that method which is what we should be doing - safely becoming better with our weapons in the off chance we have to use those weapons to protect ourselves / families.
modraker
Member
Right on, Blue9. That is about as good an analysis of trigger reset as I have read.
Rastoff- Well said. I agree with you 100%. I used to "slap the trigger". It appears to me that I have trained at the same place as you. Once I learned to 1) press the trigger until I get a surprise break, 2) trap the trigger, 3) release the trigger to reset, and then 4) press again my groups and speed improved considerably.
I agree that Miculek and Leatham have great success NOT using the reset, but for me it works. I have shot thousands of rounds with my five different handguns and have never short stroked a shot. Granted, this was not in a self defense situation, but most of my shooting is done under time pressure.
Different strokes for different folks, but there is nothing wrong with training to use the reset. For those of us who shoot that way, a tactile reset is very important. I, for one, am grateful that S&W recognizes that and has recently taken steps to improve reset in the M&P line.
I agree that Miculek and Leatham have great success NOT using the reset, but for me it works. I have shot thousands of rounds with my five different handguns and have never short stroked a shot. Granted, this was not in a self defense situation, but most of my shooting is done under time pressure.
Different strokes for different folks, but there is nothing wrong with training to use the reset. For those of us who shoot that way, a tactile reset is very important. I, for one, am grateful that S&W recognizes that and has recently taken steps to improve reset in the M&P line.
Just another way.....
Just another way to say this gun is better than that gun. I figure if you practice with the firearm you intend to use for self or home defense if it hits the the fan you know what to expect. I wouldn't rely on ANY gun that I didn't know how it worked, least of all a semi-auto.
Just another way to say this gun is better than that gun. I figure if you practice with the firearm you intend to use for self or home defense if it hits the the fan you know what to expect. I wouldn't rely on ANY gun that I didn't know how it worked, least of all a semi-auto.
PCnotPC
Member
LimaCharlie
US Veteran
I have been shooting guns since 1953, spent twenty-two years in the military, qualified expert marksman on many different guns, and spent tours in Viet Nam. I never knew I had to worry about trigger reset until the internet told me recently that it was important.
southchatham
Member
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Smitty357
Member
Seriously, if trigger reset is a problem.
Just get a full auto and dont worry about the trigger reset or even having to keep pulling the trigger. It works much better than having ur life taken because u were worried about trigger reset.
Just get a full auto and dont worry about the trigger reset or even having to keep pulling the trigger. It works much better than having ur life taken because u were worried about trigger reset.
Atticaz
Member
The majority of these posts are hilarious. It's about preference.
Rastoff
US Veteran
Yes, always about preference. As one instructor told me, "if slapping that trigger is working for you, keep it up, but you can shoot better. "
Johnny Dollar
Member
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You are absolutely correct on this point. Shoot what you like and what you can shoot well.
The other point that is being made in this thread is that you are fooling yourself if you think trigger reset is going to make a difference when you are shooting in a SHTF situation. You may be great on the range but I believe the maxim that if you are shooting to protect your life you will be half as good as you are on the range. However, that means train and practice to make that 50% as good as it can be, just don't think that your range performance will be the same as your SD performance.
Again, I've never had to shoot to protect my life, but I spend at least as much time in dry practice drawing my gun from concealment, getting the front sight on target, and pulling the trigger as I do sending rounds down range. I believe perfecting this skill will be the major factor in determining the outcome of any gunfight I might be in, much more so than trying to shoot to the trigger reset.
To clarify, I do not 'slap' the trigger. You will not hit a target at 500 yards by slapping the trigger. You will not put 5 rounds into one hole at 100 yards by slapping the trigger. Agreed, slapping is bad!
I pull through the take-up to the point of trigger break and hold it there. Even on a double action revolver there is a marked increase in force necessary to break the trigger.
To me, this makes much more sense than taking the time necessary to feel the reset and risk short stroking the trigger mechanism.
I really think this discussion has run its course. There seems to be two views and there's room in this world for both.
Do whatever works for you, and practice it. Stay safe.
.
I pull through the take-up to the point of trigger break and hold it there. Even on a double action revolver there is a marked increase in force necessary to break the trigger.
To me, this makes much more sense than taking the time necessary to feel the reset and risk short stroking the trigger mechanism.
I really think this discussion has run its course. There seems to be two views and there's room in this world for both.
Do whatever works for you, and practice it. Stay safe.
.
Smitty357
Member
Is there a certain GR bullet we should use if we shoot for reset? Bwahahaha
LimaCharlie
US Veteran
So when someone is attacking me or shooting at me, I will take a couple of breaths and hold with a half breath and squeeze the trigger so it surprises me when it breaks, only allow the trigger to reach reset, take two breaths and hold on a half breath and squeeze the trigger again so it surprises me when it breaks again. Two shots center mass and one to the head. After all the caliber doesn't matter, only shot placement matters. Am I getting all of this right?
For most reset isn't something they are trained for or readily recognize. My first LE job was Sig 229 in 40 back in 1997. My teeth were cut on that pistol in MA. Move to NY and it's Glock country. Took me a VERY long time to get use to it but Glock has an excellent reset point that is readily felt and there is an audible click.
An example of how ingrained this becomes through muscle memory is me with my first M&P. I am making a Pro 9 and Pro 40 into comp guns. Pro 9 came in a few days ago. The lack of clear reset on the M&P has me fishing for it....driving me crazy. Love the gun and cant wait to get a few thousand rounds down it.
If you use it enough to develop the muscle memory you sure will notice when it is not there.
An example of how ingrained this becomes through muscle memory is me with my first M&P. I am making a Pro 9 and Pro 40 into comp guns. Pro 9 came in a few days ago. The lack of clear reset on the M&P has me fishing for it....driving me crazy. Love the gun and cant wait to get a few thousand rounds down it.
If you use it enough to develop the muscle memory you sure will notice when it is not there.
LimaCharlie
US Veteran
Do you remember doing this while someone was shooting at you and you were shooting back? I read where LEOs fire 137 rounds at a guy, hit him three times, and he survived. Most LEOs can't tell you how many rounds they fired, let alone when the trigger reset in a shots fired incident.
Rastoff
US Veteran
This is why we hear of terrible shootings from cops all the time; poor trigger control. They are doing exactly what most are suggesting here, just pulling the trigger because they are panicking. It's the "spray and pray" mentality.
Smitty357
Member
They shot 137 rounds and only hit him 3 times.
So much for shooting for the trigger reset huh.
Rastoff
US Veteran
One more thing...
Reset is only part of the equation. It's about trigger control. You do not "shoot to the reset". The above example is a perfect one of truly poor trigger control.
Reset is only part of the equation. It's about trigger control. You do not "shoot to the reset". The above example is a perfect one of truly poor trigger control.
