Why do you need a safety?

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To me the safety is a CYA device.

Litigating attorney (Or prosecuting atty): The shield line of firearms is available with a safety, Which yours doesn't have, Would this tragedy have been averted if the firearm had a safety on it?

Litigating attorney (Or prosecuting atty), after a well meaning bystander intervened in an armed robbery, displayed his pistol, which he could not fire because he forgot to deactivate the safety, and the display of the pistol caused the robber to fire indiscriminately: The shield line of firearms is available without a safety, Which yours has, Would this tragedy have been averted if the firearm had not had a safety on it?
 
I have Apex triggers (~4#) and thumb safeties in my Shields. If Glock made a thumb safety I would have it in my 19. A thumb safety is an added level of confidence that the weapon is not going to fire unintentionally. The little "safety lever" in the middle of the trigger is not really safe. Is a Glock 19 safer than a Sig P320 because of that little lever? And now the 320 is available with a thumb safety because our military wants it.

Just sayin...:)
 
My 1st safety is but my between ears, a good holster and finger off the trigger. Sometimes a safety can fail. I always carrying with one in the chamber. Some guns have add safeties like Springfield's XD and XDM lines. Both my Shields have safeties because I carrying appendix and I like to have a little more insurance in that area. It all comes down to your personal comfort level with firearms and training.
 
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I prefer an active safety on a carry gun. I'm old and remember when all new guns had an active safety.

I've never heard a good argument for not having one. "Keeping your finger off the bang switch" is not a reason not to have a safety, that is just good firearm handling.

One more point to consider...every person who has ever had a negligent discharge, right up until that second, could honestly say they never had a negligent discharge.

We should be at least as concerned with gun handling other than a self defense situation as we are with self defense. Almost all of us will never have a self defense situation (thank goodness) and the few that do will still spend almost 100% of their gun handling other than that self defense situation.
 
My bodyguard has a safety and my next handgun (probably a shield) will have a safety also. I like the extra security. When i am out and about i switch the safety off. When i am home the safety is on. I trained myself to draw and move safety off.

My wife has a S&W Bodyguard 380 with a safety. When we purchased the gun both of us along with the sales person believed that a safety was an absolute necessity. At that time she was new when it came to shooting handguns

She is no longer new and has become a very good shooter at the range.

We know when its time for her or I to purchase another pistol both of us will purchase one with a manual safety.
 
Litigating attorney (Or prosecuting atty), after a well meaning bystander intervened in an armed robbery, displayed his pistol, which he could not fire because he forgot to deactivate the safety, and the display of the pistol caused the robber to fire indiscriminately: The shield line of firearms is available without a safety, Which yours has, Would this tragedy have been averted if the firearm had not had a safety on it?

I don't know if it would have been averted or not. This individual may not have had enough shooting experience and that's why he forgot to release the safety.

Had the safety been off how do you know he wouldn't have shot himself or an innocent bystander ?

I believe it all comes down to the individual that's carrying a concealed weapon. My advice to any gun owner is TRAIN, TRAIN and TRAIN SOME MORE.
 
My son.
Other than that, my first carry gun was a p238. Cocked and locked. So since I am used to it on there it only makes sense to use my Shield the same way.
 
Litigating attorney (Or prosecuting atty), after a well meaning bystander intervened in an armed robbery, displayed his pistol, which he could not fire because he forgot to deactivate the safety, and the display of the pistol caused the robber to fire indiscriminately: The shield line of firearms is available without a safety, Which yours has, Would this tragedy have been averted if the firearm had not had a safety on it?

Said no attorney ever, in any court, anywhere. LOL This would never be argued, or even be brought up. The simple fact is the attacker shot before the defender could even get the safety off of their weapon...fact...why he shot speculation.

And if anyone can't trust themselves enough to sweep the safety off...how the heck can they trust themselves not to discharge accidentally....and by anyone's numbers....accidental discharges, far outweigh, failed self defense because the defender forgot the safety. It's not a fair stat because so few ever use their gun in self defense...but it kind of makes a different point all at the same time.
 
Why? Really? Because people aren’t perfect — That’s why! Mistakes do happen, and sometimes even the best of gunmen can become either: careless, distracted, or forgetful.

This quite true. Sometimes people even forget to bring a gun to a gunfight and instead show up with an empty holster. I don't know, if I couldn't even remember to bring a gun I'd really question whether I'd remember to use a safety.

I’ve lived and worked with men who were in every sense of the expression, ‘blooded’ protagonists and very good with guns. In more than 50 year’s time, I never heard so much as one of them refer to a pistol safety as being anything even close to a user-impediment that a gunman has to learn how to work around — Not one, myself included!

Are you including yourself in that set of blooded protagonists?

This sort of pseudo-technical gun palaver is much too frequently all over the internet; and, then, it’s most often posted by, ‘cyberspace heroes’ along with other IGF wannabes who’ve never, ‘been there or done that’ when things were unexpected, up close and personal, and ‘one on one’ at anytime — anytime — in their entire lives!

Have you ever "been there" or "done that"
 
Things happen. If my gun by chance gets in someone else hands I think most people would pull the trigger and not think twice about how to take a hefty off. Remember the reason for a series 80 1911 was because if they fell the firing pin could still hit the primer even with the safety on. I think Ruger recalled it's LCP's because of this issue as well.

Its and option like 4wheel drive. I don't have to use it, I don't always use it, but I might as well get it.

Mainly because if there is an accidental discharge there are a couple of big arteries a bully will be way to close to, not to mention I like my private parts. Heck, I'd hate to lose my best friend.
 
I carry exclusively striker fired pistols without a safety and I have some very specific reasons why.
1. I personally have forgot to flip the safety off my 1911 under zero stress on the range I don't care to risk that in the real world.

2. I have personally disabled a firearm by accidentally engaging the safety/ decocker during a tap, rack, roll exercise on the range under some (but nothing like walking around a corner and running smack into a bad guy) stress. Again, I don't care to risk that in the real world.

3. I have personally witnessed a new shooter who was unable to get a proper firing grip on her Springfield XD and as a result was unable to fire it. Again, not a risk I care to take.


I want to be careful with my phrasing because I do want to claim (or even artfully imply) that I'm a "blooded protagonist" but I have carried a gun for a living and I have had to use a gun in self defense (no shots fired) and the very first time I did I panicked. It was every thing I could do to even remember to point the gun at the guy and you can forget about manipulating a safety. When I worked as a security guard for the city (not trying to put that job anywhere near on par with a police officer) my duties required me to go looking for trouble and I spent a lot of time dealing with tweakers in the middle of the night and even with experience I still got that dry mouth, heart pounding, tunnel vision feeling every time it happened and I was very glad that I didn't have an extraneous controls to deal with on my gun.
 
Safety

Well if you have concerns about accidental discharge or you feel more comfortable with a safety then sure and this is a personal choice. If you have a gun with a safety and train with it it's not a big deal. Now if you have shot striker fired guns with no safety other than the trigger mechanism then you could ha e some issues and would suggest plenty of time training before you carry the gun to make sure things are working right. Now if you carry a 1911 well you will get very good at working that safety and with more training it becomes second nature...
 
Refer: Post #51 of this thread ~

This quite true. Sometimes people even forget to bring a gun to a gunfight and instead show up with an empty holster. I don't know, if I couldn't even remember to bring a gun I'd really question whether I'd remember to use a safety.

Are you including yourself in that set of blooded protagonists?

Have you ever "been there" or "done that"

:rolleyes: You know, this is starting to get ugly! Look at the PM this guy sent me today.

Smoke said:
Why do you feel such a need to pretend you're something you’re not?

You’ve never been any closer to a gun fight than a John Wayne movie and when you were you didn't even remember to bring a gun.

Just so you know every time you claim it, I’m going to call you on it

Know what, Junior? I'm not going to take the bait. You're welcome to believe whatever you want to believe; but I will tell you for a fact that I'm too old, and too close to God now to be anywhere near as stupid as you and post either lies or unfounded accusations about someone else on anybody's internet gun forum.

You obviously can't understand the root motivation of someone like me. I'm not going to be here for that much longer; and, before I pass on into, 'the next life', I'd like to leave, at least, a little something of who I am, as well as what I've learned about salient topics like: God, guns, knives, the Holy Bible, and both intellectual and physical confrontation.

I actually DO know quite a bit about these several topics; in fact, I've often been chided by people who know me well for being something of a, 'dirt magnet'; and, know what? I can't really argue the point — Even my wife thinks that these people are correct! Filthy minds, blown up egos, and filthy people DO, indeed, seem to be too frequently attracted to whatever locus I happen to be in.

Truth be told: I AM, for a fact, a man who's had numerous extraordinary friends, acquaintances, and unusual life experiences. I was raised by military men (Most of whom were United States Marines; and these men were, all, most assuredly, 'blooded'.

In more recent years my lifelong close association with: guns, knives, and various martial arts has brought me into close contact with more military men as well as other government agents — Most, if not all, of whom were also well experienced, 'blooded' personnel; but this — and no more — is as much as you're going to get out of me on anybody's public internet venue.

If you don't believe me, who cares! That's perfectly fine with me. You seem to forget that I don't answer to you; and I strongly suspect that when it comes to being, 'a man' you're not fit to so much as, 'lick my boots'. As for myself? I live by certain principles; principles which I highly regard and doubt you would understand. Among others, my personal scruples include such biblical expressions as:

'But I say unto you, that every idle word that a man shall speak, he shall give account thereof on the Day of Judgment.' (I really truly believe this; and I think it's too bad that you don't.)

'Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam in thine own eye; and, then, thou shalt see clearly enough to cast out the mote in thy brother's eye.' (I'm sure you get the idea and, perhaps, even feel a little bit of déjà vu!)

And one of my own personal favorites: 'He that passeth by, and meddleth with strife belonging not to him, is like one that taketh a hungry wolf by its ears.'

You need to grow up, Junior. You're not in public school anymore; and, unless you still live at home with your parents, you're not always going to be able to throw a little, 'hissy fit' every time you want your own way. You're in the big bad real world, now; and you need to start thinking and acting that way. ;)
 
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As we have been known to say on this forum -"It's better to have a gun and not need it than to need one and not have it". Same applies to safeties IMO.
I don't agree with this applying to thumb safeties.

External Hammer Fire Semi-Autos kept Cocked & Locked (1911 etc) NEED an external Safety.
They don't need a thumb safety any more than the M&P needs a thumb safety. Let's explore this:

1911 Round in the chamber -
Thumb safety off - if the hammer falls, it lands on the half cock position; gun doesn't fire.
If the trigger is pressed, it won't move unless the grip safety is pressed; gun doesn't fire.

M&P Round in the chamber -
Thumb safety off - if the striker comes loose from the sear, the striker block prevents the striker from striking the primer; gun doesn't fire.

In both cases, the trigger must be pressed and held to the rear during the firing cycle or the gun won't fire. Neither needs a thumb safety. On the M&P it only prevents trigger movement. On the 1911 it blocks the sear and prevents the hammer from moving. So, the thumb safety is completely superfluous on the M&P, but adds a small amount of extra safety on the 1911. The M&P will fire regardless of the grip, but the 1911 has an automatic safety in the grip safety.
 
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First off, I'll say that I have been a revolver shooter for 50+ years.

My first semi-auto was a Colt 1911A1. The old Marine who taught me how to shoot it always stressed the safety and how it is so easy to thumb sweep it when withdrawing. We weren't in "combat conditions" and that's just hw he taught me. My second semi-auto was a SR9 - old ways are hard to break and that had a safety - easy enough to thumb sweep.

My next was the 9mm Shield - yep - got it with a thug safety. Right now, it rotates with my Smith Model 36 snub - which of course is a 5 shot J frame and has a hammer block so it is always loaded full. After all, it's a revolver . . right?

BUT . . . my thinking has certainly changed since I am getting more familiar with semi-autos. A little background on that. Many years ago, while responding to an ambulance call, it turned in to a bad situation and I was shot at - and I felt it go past my ear lobe. My point . . I know what it is like to be shot at and I well remember the adrenaline kicking in and how I reacted to it. Fast forward to the past few years. I have had several situations that could have turned ugly. Twice, being accosted in a large parking lot in a city in the middle of the day - a guy who was high on drugs and another who was drunk and insisting I was going to give him cash for "gas". Fortunately, I was able to defuse the situations. Then, while at home (and I live in a relative rural area and always a safe area, two heroin addicts came to my house out in the country and one went to the front door and the other to the back door to see if anyone was home. I was in the basement and fortunately, the dogs barked and I came upstairs. As soon as they saw me, one went back to the car and got in. The other tried to talk their way out of why they were there. I advised them to leave and never come back and relined the individual that most of us "carry in the country". Had they broken in and I had come upstairs and surprised them, I have no doubt that they would have over powered me and I may have lost my life. Two days later, they were arrested for a long series of break ins and thefts of guns, jewelry, etc. in three different counties.

My point? Just that experience taught me the importance of carrying in a safe manner but also in a manner that I could quickly draw and use a weapon if my life were in danger without having to think about a safety or sweeping one. Now, the safety on my Shield is always "off". Most people think of a SD situation as being with a "single prp" - a big misconception and a big mistake. I now longer feel that (for me) a 5 shot J frame is sufficient and I am stepping up to a double stack compact 45ac. But, it will not have a safety that needs to be swept off.

And let's face it - carrying that way is no different than carrying a double action revolver with the cylinder full. I use a Fobus OWB holster for all my carry guns and the trigger is always covered and the holster retains well but is still easy to draw from if necessary.

I'm and "old dog" but not so old that I can't learn new tricks and new ways of doing things.
 
When I first started carrying, I felt a safety provided a little extra safety to help make up for my inexperience. As I learned more about firing systems and gained experience, I now base my decision on whether to have a safety on specific gun. My normal carry that is DAO with hammer, I don't feel the need for a safety. My pocket gun that is SAO, I feel the safety is a requirement because of the short, light trigger.
 
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