Why not a .45 for LEOs

Every law enforcement agency in my jurisdiction (except SHP) is carrying 45's.

Glock 21's, Glock 30's, S&W 4566, S&W 4513TSW, S&W 4506.

NC Probation & parole has those M&P 40's. They wish they had 45's. :) If I can't have a 357 revolver, make mine a S&W 3rd generation 45. Regards 18DAI.
 
Hmmmm... Plenty of us carrying .45s here in Maine. The state police carry HK USPs in .45, the local county S.O. was carrying G21s but switched to Kimber 1911s last year, and I carry a Springfield 1911 on duty and just put a new SIG 1911 Traditional Compact into off duty service. From here it looks like the .45 is alive and well in LE.
 
I wish they would give our Military the 45's back. To me it is sacrilege to import arms for our great Military.
 
I have to disagree with many of these comments. Until the introduction of the “maintenance free” wonder nine in the 1980s the Colt 1911A1 was still very popular with police departments. The popularity was so high that An Introduction to Modern Police Firearms by Roberts & Bristow printed in 1969 included firearms training for the 1911 along with revolvers.

The 1911A1 has been carried by many police officers since 1920. Many of the first officers to carry the 1911 brought them back from WWI. I remember reading an NRA article years ago that more than half of the 1911s produced for WWI were “lost” out of military inventories.

You must remember that most officers did not make a lot of money on the job. The M10 was anywhere from $20.00 to $40.00 cheaper than a Colt 1911.

Leather was another problem. If you were lucky you knew someone that was retiring and could give you some leather or a buddy gained weight and sold you his old one cheap. With a revolver all you needed was a holster and belt. Ammo was carried in a pocket until the advent of dump pouches. Remember that most departments did not issue hand radios until the 1970s. If you purchased a Colt you might have to special order the holster, belt and magazine pouch from a big city. Until the late 1960s most Colt holsters were designed to work with military belts not police belts.

Ammo was another issue. Many departments might have been very liberal with the approved list of guns but any ammo other than 38 special was up to the officer to purchase for duty and range. Maintenance and repair was also up to the individual officer.

All this said Colts were very common. Most people did not notice the gun because they were so common and nothing special. Today we notice a revolver because it is something rare and out of place. I also want to say that departments are now going away from 9mm and even 40S&W back to 45ACP. Illinois has had a great increase on department authorizing the Colt 1911. The main requirement is that the weapon must have the Colt series 80 safety.
 
Capacity in 45 ACP pistols has been a drawback compared to 9mm and 40 S&W pistols.

However, in last 10 years or so, the capacity gap has been closed. The Glock 21 offers 13 rounds and now the FN-45 has a 15 round capacity. Springfield and Smith also have 45 ACP pistols with similar capabilities. Because of that, many departments are making the switch to 45's. The town I live in, just switched to Glock 21's and Florida Highway Patrol ditched their 40's (Baretta 96 I think) for the Glock 37/38 which is chambered in 45 GAP.
 
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Capacity in 45 ACP pistols has been a drawback compared to 9mm and 40 S&W pistols.
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I agree but why need the added ammo? A few departments still carry revolvers. Others are going to the .45acp but the capacity is around 10 rounds these days.

Then we are back to the Pray & Spray method of shooting. Prior to the 80's, officers were carrying six round wheel guns and all was well. We depended on accuracy back then.

These days many officers fail to qualify easily because they feel with all the rounds they have, the requirements will be met. While good logic on the range, it is bad policy in the streets.

A natural reaction is use what one has. Give them eight shots and they will take better aim.
 
Not around here or those in the gun media. Even Glock is not pushing their 9mm any longer to LEA. While not a bad caliber, it is just not as effective caliber.

We can compare it to a 1/2 ton truck pulling a four horse slant load trailer to a one ton pulling the same. A 1/2 will work but not as well as the one ton. While both will start about the same, stopping is so much better with the one ton.
Glock pushes whatever people/agencies want to buy. The current craze is .45. The gun media pushes whatever will sell magazines. They've promoted some of the dumbest stuff ever. Like .410 handguns as the gold standard in self defense.

If you're using good modern ammo, service caliber choice comes in way down on the list on what it takes to win a gunfight. The person with more skill is most likely going to win every time. No matter if he's got a 9mm, or 40 watt plasma gun. Bigger bullets don't make up for littler training.
 
I totally agree that skill trumps caliber. The 45acp is so slow you can see the bullet as it flies down range. I have never seen a 9mm or 40 s&w in flight. My choice for concealed carry varies with my mode, but I am not an LEO but a suburbanite. I sleep well at night because of you under paid professionals are on duty.
 
I wish they would give our Military the 45's back. To me it is sacrilege to import arms for our great Military.

Beretta M9s are made in the USA, that was part of the deal when they got the contract.
 
Again the great caliber debate. When I started we could only carry .38spl and we could only carry Colt or S&W guns. Eventually, firearms training opened up to Ruger's. We argued for semi autos for years. Too much training they said. Too easily to jam they said. Eventually the powers approved semi autos. You had to qualify 3x with it on the range before you could carry it. 9mm was the first approved cal. Easy to control, penetration, etc. .45's were banned because of their at the time SAO triggers. Semis that were approved had to be DA/SA or DAO. Not too many DAO at the time. Glock was banned because of too light a trigger pull. Eventually they authorized .45....the problem my Department has, is that they have the officer buy the gun and they stock everything from .380 to .45.....off duty carry is limited to at least .380 (not for on duty) so the budget for ammo is outrageous. I think they would have been better selecting one gun, writing a contract for that gun, providing it upon hire, charging the officer for it (so he/she would own it) and providing one type ammo. I actually like the 9mm, because I feel its easiest to control, accurate and has ok stopping power if the hits are in vital areas.....I would guess that the .40 would be chosen as the best compromise between control and stopping power...just a guess.....
 
It is my understanding that the US Army is going back to the 1911 in .45acp since it has been proven to be a better caliber/gun.

That'll never happen.

The USMC Recon still uses some high-end custom built 1911A1s.
Many reserve units got 1911A1s at the beginning of Desert Storm. The Navy still had brand new in the kraft box/crate , WWII manufactured 1911A1s at several bases when I was in back in the late 70s-early 80s. The ones in the ready racks were like rattles. Same with M-14s.

I remember them crating the new ones up for shipment back to NS crane for destruction , and leaving the worn out old junk in the racks.
 
i too cut my teeth on old rattle trap 1911s. they were worn down old leftovers. the jump to 9mm was a boon to me and others, mostly because this meant new guns. i still shoot both, and love both. my carry is still a kimber pro carryII, with a mod 442-2 as back up. not that i mind 9mm i just got used to a 1911. i know 1911s are now avail. in many calibers, but i'll stick with .45acp thank you very much.
 
Beretta M9s are made in the USA, that was part of the deal when they got the contract.

OK, they may well be but where does the profit from the sales go? Honda, Toyota and many more companies make products sold in the US but the profits still go to foreign lands.

Another way to look at this is many companies, Springfield for one, make products on foreign soil but the larger profits from the outsourced manufacture come to the US but they are depriving US workers of quality jobs which are needed here.

I am not sure but I bet over half of every dollar we spend in the US goes to foreign companies.

Some of the younger guys may not remember but back in the 60's, the US had most of the larger banks. Now we do not have one even in the top 20.

Because something is made here is of little benefit since the money profitted does not remain here.
 
I'm amazed at the number of people who will knock the 9mm as not being capable of stopping a bad guy and then stick a model 60 in 38 Special in their pocket.

Now that I've said that, my favorite carry is a Colt LW Commander in 45acp followed by a model 66 with a 2 1/2" barrel.
 
The Texas Rangers are issued Sig p226 in .357 Sig, but alot of them choose to carry 1911's instead. The one that I spoke to at my local range said he had been shooting his 1911's so long that he felt more comfortable with it and just carried 8 extra mags to offset the lack of rounds offered by double stacked mags.
 
When the wondernines came out, they were a huge success with LE. Over twice the capacity, the revolver was doomed, logical, who knows, but more firepower was the issue. Then the FBI got into the 10mm, our Sheriffs Dept. adopted it, but I never saw one being carried before the 40 took over. A friend in SD showed me his 10, he was on duty packing his 9mm, don't know if they actually approved them for duty. And so it goes.......
 
CUT TO THE CHASE:
Real Cops work Patrol and carry .45s!
Any caliber that has a "4" at the beginning is acceptable.
Real Men wear Justin Boots, Stetson Hats, and carry .45 Revolvers.

(this opinion is bought to you by a member of the "Over The Hill" squad)
 
I agree but why need the added ammo? A few departments still carry revolvers. Others are going to the .45acp but the capacity is around 10 rounds these days.

Then we are back to the Pray & Spray method of shooting. Prior to the 80's, officers were carrying six round wheel guns and all was well. We depended on accuracy back then.

These days many officers fail to qualify easily because they feel with all the rounds they have, the requirements will be met. While good logic on the range, it is bad policy in the streets.

A natural reaction is use what one has. Give them eight shots and they will take better aim.


More rounds available is better when you consider 80% of all shots miss the intended targets. For a cop, the pistol is a tool of the trade, in fact one of the least used tools. With the exception of yearly qualifications, many police officers rarely fire their guns. Cops today have so many more dangers to face in todays world, I wish they could carry a belt fed gun.
 
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