Would you fight it or not? Ticket question...

[The Big D]

So, you LEO bashers continue to have your days. Somewhat sickening, yet again.

Yes, before you ask: I have gotten well-deserved violation notices even whilst employed. Yes, I took it like a man; deserved the results of my bad decisions.

To those of you who suggest the violator wear his/her LEO uniform to court: You have no understanding of the profession whatsoever. Unbelievable.

Funny how all of you who got your "I didn't do it" tickets were wholly innocent and yet found yourselves in the presence of LEO's who somehow selected you. Hmmmmmm...

BTW, most of you (you know who you are; you chose the term) would be in better shape in court if you used the term "contest" rather than "fight." You may wish to consider that; doubt you will.

To the OP, you should be ashamed of your UNPROFESSIONAL choice of words describing the Trooper who cited you. Nice.

 

[semperfi71]

I am not an LEO. I have had good ones keep me out of trouble and cut me slack. I have had one or two officers who where having a bad day try to take it out on me. I stood my ground and it worked out. I was lucky.

NEVER let any government entity create a "black mark" (no matter how small) on any record of your existence. It could easily come up again when you are getting your first, real deserved "black mark" and be used against you. We all make mistakes in judgement but should not suffer for someone else's lack thereof.

I suggest you go there and respectfully dispute the ticket with your wife as witness and evidence you collected. If the judge is fair, you should be okay. Then I would go home, write a certified, receipt requested letter to the very top officer of the young officer's department illustrating everything that happened, in a respectfull manner as well.

I would bet the "boss" cop won't be happy about a young, over-enthused young man putting a bit of a black eye on the department. Your use of the mailed letter will be proof to the "top-cop" that you are serious about the issue enough to cause "documentation" that will give him pause, if he is smart.

 

[The Big D]

... Then I would go home, write a certified, receipt requested letter to the very top officer of the young officer's department illustrating everything that happened, in a respectfull manner as well.

I would bet the "boss" cop won't be happy about a young, over-enthused young man putting a bit of a black eye on the department. Your use of the mailed letter will be proof to the "top-cop" that you are serious about the issue enough to cause "documentation" that will give him pause, if he is smart.

Great idea!!! And DO include a copy of your post herein that describes your interaction with the Trooper who lied on an official document.

You should copy your boss with all correspondence; in the Federal sector bosses like to know whenever LEO's in their command were unjustly charged. Could be a conspiracy. They also like to know when their personnel appear in court...as violators. Note that on your leave request. Almost guarantees approval.

 

[feralmerril]

We are wearing this out. I just have one thing to add. Many better jobs in this country are in defense plants or similar. Depending on the level of clearances, you have to report even traffic tickets of $50s or more. Maybe its raised with the times since I retired. If anyone feels they were given a ticket wrongly and thinks its cheaper to pay it than travel to fight it, or whatever, it can bite you in the butt later!
I worked in a defense aircraft plant for 35 years as a lowly night watchman. Probley was the worlds most boreing job, but also paid the highest any guard could hope for. We had to have spotless records was the main qualification. I am not just talking about the security dept, but all the workers on secret programs. The difference might be working at jiffy lube, or makeing a 100G a year in defense plants. Keep your record clean!

 

[ladder13]

To those of you who suggest the violator wear his/her LEO uniform to court: You have no understanding of the profession whatsoever. Unbelievable.

+1 only to be worn for official duties. Heck, we couldn't even wear a Dept t-shirt off the job. Too many "young bucks" used to like hitting the bars after work wearing Dep't clothing. They liked to impress the young ladies, except the Commish got calls about the "on-duty" personnel sitting at the bar.

 

[thomp45acp]

Why would a LEO ask a forum about contesting a ticket? I know its a form of venting. Should he not have knowledge and or training on radar, court, policy of his own department that will mirror/be the same as statute if he got the citation in the same state he works in? Or be very similar. I do know tire pressure and correctly calibrated speedometer on a personal vehicle play factors when we at times think we are following speed laws and might be doing more or less then whats posted. You know a vehicle is a man made machine that breaks down and is not always up to code. A good radar and operator is checked and the calibration is checked i say more often then we check our vehicle. I am not trying to saying whats right or wrong. Just putting my thoughts in like everyone else.

 

[MTS Cop]

I'm not familiar with customs and practices in other parts of the country, but why didn't you ID yourself to the Trooper? SOP in NYC is to have your ID card out before the officer approaches the car so they see it right away. I'm always a little on edge doing carstops (as I imagine most of us are) and I appreciate seeing a shield/ID card right away so I can relax. Given the proper attitude, i.e. the off duty doesn't say "I'm a cop you can't write me", the stop lasts about 5 seconds. Granted I've only ever been stopped by my own department but doing this I've never had a problem.

And wearing your uniform to traffic court is about the worst thing you can do. Speak to the Trooper before the hearing and hopefully he gets a sudden case of amnesia. And may I suggest being a little more amicable than you were in that post, professional courtesy works both ways. If this guy is that much of a jerk off there are ways to handle him (union delegates, FOP reps or what have you).

 

[CAJUNLAWYER]

I was an alter boy at the time, If your Catholic, you might recall the pattens used during communion, which put us in a great place to make a statement.

Being a good Jesuit raised alter boy myself-I do remember the pattens. I raked many a throats in my day

 

[venomballistics]

So, you LEO bashers continue to have your days. Somewhat sickening, yet again.

Yes, before you ask: I have gotten well-deserved violation notices even whilst employed. Yes, I took it like a man; deserved the results of my bad decisions.

To those of you who suggest the violator wear his/her LEO uniform to court: You have no understanding of the profession whatsoever. Unbelievable.

Funny how all of you who got your "I didn't do it" tickets were wholly innocent and yet found yourselves in the presence of LEO's who somehow selected you. Hmmmmmm...

before you paint me as a blind LEO basher allow me to point out that I speak of a specific department. even within that department, I find no fault in three of its officers despite one really good violation citation that resides framed upon the wall of fame behind the 900 Horsepower mustang that it was earned it.
willpower is no match for horsepower and that equation can, and did, rack up half the book in half a block.
I was riding shotgun when that 10.5" SVO clutch hooked up. I saw the asphalt plummet leaving blue sky in the windshield.
when the asphalt levitated back in to view, it was accompanied by rotating lights ... had that one coming. it was costly. I find no fault in the officer ....

speaking of officers Ill borrow a quote out of a great LEO's post and show you why I think he is great.

Raymone was the first to break. The footprint got him talking. Tyrone and Tavarious still weren't saying anything. When I got off at 5:00 p.m. they still weren't talking. I suspect that will change later. Ramone told us where the stuff was. We went to an apartment and no one was there. Deputy Trey went to get a search warrant while I watched the apartment. Two older black guys were playing dominos out front. I got to talking and joking with them and one of them told me if I could beat him he would tell me something. I got him by five points and when his friend went inside to get rid of some beer he told me he watched a flatscreen TV being transferred from the white car to another car. He gave me a good description of the other car. We'll check it out tomorrow.

Now theres some thinking on your feet.
I dont know of another officer that would roll the dice on extending a lead quite like this.
if the apartment isnt the storage point, hes got a fair route to find the real drop point. and even if the apartment is the drop point, hes got a lead into a possible ring.
He must enjoy the people he works with to work like this.

 

[BE Mike]

I have been pulled over by mistake when I was abiding by the traffic laws. The officer operating the radar was mistaken about just who was speeding. It was a vehicle that had flown by me and cut closely in front of me as we passed the trooper with radar who was pulling into his spot. I explained the situation to the trooper who pulled me over (a different officer). He ended up letting me go without a ticket. All the time I was thinking how I was going to have to go to court and explain it to the judge.

My wife was pulled over mistakenly a couple of times and validly more than once. The first time went much like mine and the second time she went to traffic court with photos, etc. in hand. She won her case.

I would fight a ticket that was issued mistakenly or maliciously. You may lose even if you are completely innocent, but you will have tried. Fair is a place we go to to eat cotton candy and ride the rides...life ain't fair.

 

[The Big D]

vb: Charlie Sherrill is both smart and personable. Those are tremendous attributes for a LEO...and just about everyone, for that matter.

LEO's who are willing to engage their constituents are the ones who are most successful no matter what task in which they're engaged. I had more than one traffic violator shake my hand after receiving a citation(s.) It doesn't have to be an adversarial process. When I was a young officer I used the word "fight" when explaining the options to a violator. (As in "if you want to fight the ticket, here's what you need to do.") A co-worked offered that "contest" was a much better word...he was smart, too.

I always found real traffic violations readily available/apparent so didn't have to make up stuff. I think (no, I am sure!) that's the case for the vast majority of LEO's; they don't have to pick some innocent party at random and issue bogus paper.

Wasn't targeting you, vb.

I am presently enroute to a rather large state university (not the University of Maryland) to teach bright (hopefully) young college students some things that will serve them well in their future law enforcement careers. "Ethics" is among the topics to be covered. I can assure you it's emphasized where I teach and in my former organization.

Be safe.

before you paint me as a blind LEO basher allow me to point out that I speak of a specific department. even within that department, I find no fault in three of its officers despite one really good violation citation that resides framed upon the wall of fame behind the 900 Horsepower mustang that it was earned it.
willpower is no match for horsepower and that equation can, and did, rack up half the book in half a block.
I was riding shotgun when that 10.5" SVO clutch hooked up. I saw the asphalt plummet leaving blue sky in the windshield.
when the asphalt levitated back in to view, it was accompanied by rotating lights ... had that one coming. it was costly. I find no fault in the officer ....

speaking of officers Ill borrow a quote out of a great LEO's post and show you why I think he is great.


Now theres some thinking on your feet.
I dont know of another officer that would roll the dice on extending a lead quite like this.
if the apartment isnt the storage point, hes got a fair route to find the real drop point. and even if the apartment is the drop point, hes got a lead into a possible ring.
He must enjoy the people he works with to work like this.

 

[feralmerril]

I did 35 years as a night watchman, guard, security guard, rent a cop, or whatever else you want to call them. There are more deragatory cartoons and stupid portrayals of them in movies and tv shows than probley any other occupation you can name. Maybe even part of them are true! I can say that. I have a thick hide, plus I have yet to find someone that has ever had more experiance or hours put in at it than me. I dont think I have ever got bent out of shape or defensive of my ex occupation when I have overheard or read the jokes etc like the lawyer, doctor, cop or politican jokes do for the people involved.
I guess I am just too insensative!

 

[venomballistics]

I did 35 years as a night watchman, guard, security guard, rent a cop, or whatever else you want to call them. There are more deragatory cartoons and stupid portrayals of them in movies and tv shows than probley any other occupation you can name. Maybe even part of them are true!

it ranks up there as a joke target ... but its no longer in the number one slot.
I guess the work of San Fran Nan, BHO and the Hilderbeast just to name a few, did in fact have the positive effect of effect of granting some public dignity to one of those unpleasant jobs that needs doing
but then in any profession theirs always someone profoundly touched in the same field.
Google search "gecko45" touted as the "the original Mall Ninja" ... dont be offended ... this is me leading you to some interesting reading that would delight almost anyone.
@ the Big D ... ya might trace the same lead.
I am positive you can find a few useful examples of dead wrong mindset to have on the job to relate to cadets .. to go along with his world wide laughing stock status resulting from his efforts.
We might be trying to achieve the same result here. That being fine honest police forces.
seems your way is through telling them what to do and when to do it. My way is illustrating the result when they dont take your way to heart.
Train em right and train em well Sir.

 

[Senior Citizen]

I'm hard headed just like you and would fight it even if it cost me money to win. Go for it and good luck.

But I just have one question to those who replied with "be sure to wear your uniform", "I'd love to see the look on his face when he finds out you're a cop too" ...............

Big deal. So if you had been wearing your badge you would have gotten "preferential treatment"? If you were in the right you were in the right, but wearing a uniform does not always make you right.

Again, good luck with it.

SC

 

[don p]

Road trip without a doubt. Hopefully its not a kangaroo court. take the wife and make a 1 day vacation of it.

 

[The Highlander]

I'd fight it.

A while back, my daughter seemed to be the target of opportunity locally. She got one, well-deserved, ticket in the period, but was pulled over a number of times. Even walked out of the grocery store one night to find the officer parked behind her car, lights blazing. Since she is a drop-dead gorgeous little girl, and drives a cute little car, she innocently just asked the fellow if he was stalking her just to see her car.

After numerous "events" like this, my wife and I had a talk with the supervising officers of two different agencies. We found out that the patrolman in question was violating several department regulations when pulling my daughter over, and that the harassment would stop.

The officers reason for pulling her over, as provided by his supervisor? She looked like a drug smuggler.

Now, profiling aside (I'm in favor of it by the way), I was not aware that drug smugglers worked by drawing attention to themselves by driving CHROME YELLOW Mustang GT's! Who'd a thunk it!

I've since verified that this particular officer is not a threat to my daughter by trading cars with her and "trolling" trying to get him to pull me over. Apparently, the discussion with his supervisor worked. Should she have issues again, she has been instructed to pull over safely as soon as possible, roll down her windows, dial 911, and hit the speakerphone button.

The supervising officer and one of the dectectives in our agency were mortified at the officers behaviour by the way. A detective with the agency even gave her his cell phone number and told her to speed dial him if she was pulled over by the same guy again.

However, other than these incidents with my daughter, I feel that a majority of the police officers in our area are there to do the right thing, they sure don't do it for the money.

 

[The Highlander]

Oh man, I forgot my all-time best traffic stop story!

When my wifey was pregnant with our second child, she was on the way home, first child 2 1/2 years old, in a car seat. Anyway, she was VERY pregnant, and was having a lot of trouble with nausea and gotta-go-pee-right-NOW issues, so she was breaking the speed limit. I know, such a scofflaw.

Anyhoo, she gets pulled over. Now this part is purely from my wifey's point of view, and may be a little biased. But, officer slowly exits the cruiser, pulls his belt back up over his prominent gut, checks to be sure he is actually zipped, puts out his cigarette by throwing it on the ground and squishing it with his heel, and saunters up to her window.

Baby #1 is in the back seat crying, baby #2 is pressing on her bladder, and inducing a wave of nausea the size of the D-day invasion.

Officer stares at her through the window, tsk-tsk'ing her and shaking his head. Finally, asks why a little lady like her (I swear that's what he said) was driving so fast.

She explained about the pregnancy thing, which would have been obvious to Ray Charles, and said, "sir, I know I was speeding, but I REALLY need to get home as soon as possible. Please write me the ticket and let me get on my way." Or something to that affect.

Anyway, he tells her to exit the car, she declines saying that she really has difficulty getting in and out, and would he please speed up a little. He insists, so she struggles up out of the car. Again, VERY pregnant.

So, officer proceeds to lecture her and ask questions about where she lived, worked, how far from home and other totally irrelevant things. She reiterates "I don't feel so good!" Despite all admonitions from her to hurry it up, he seems bound and determined to draw out the process. After several predictions of dire consequences if he didn't shut up and write the ticket, the inevitable happened.

No, she didn't wet herself....

She barfed voluminous quantities of noxious, vile, pregnant lady puke all over his uniform shoes and lower legs!

And the ironic part, his name is Chuck!

 

[venomballistics]

whats up .. chuck

 

[The Highlander]

Yep!

I don't mean to come off bashing LEO, I have several good friends that are LEO's, and I've deserved every ticket I ever got except one, and I chalked that one up to all the speeding I did without getting ticketed.

Of course, around Knoxville, TN we figure speed limits are just a Suggested Minimum anyway. If you are doing 55 mph, you will be run down, probably by a cop!

 

[The Highlander]

That stinks.