Yea or Nah on Moonclips?

I got tired of having to pick up my 45 ACP brass so I got a 625-2 and use the moon clips. Then I found some 45 Auto Rim brass and started loading that. I still have a load of 45 ACP loaded so I'll continue using the clips until I decide to use it only in my 1911s. I guess I should mention that moon clips also eliminate the need for a speed loaded. So, I guess it's 50/50 with me.
 
steelslaver said:
... the odds of me being in a gunfight where I could or should do a "tactical" reload are right up there with me winning the lottery and I only buy the occasional single ticket when its several hundred million. I am not expecting either to happen.

If I get in a situation where that is key, I either screwed up badly or my "Karma" really sucks...
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Steelslaver,

If/when it happens, call me,or shine the Full Moon signal, (you know the one, kind of like the "Bat Signal") and I will h ad on over to help you out.

Kevin
 
kamloops67 said:
I like my 1937 Brazilian 45acp ,accurate and smooth
Tried to like moon clips but its not working out ive found they can bend pretty easily and take more effort to load into the gun once bent then the headspace is screwed up and cartridges rub against breech face .
Guess im a vote for no on full moon clips .
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I am curious how they would get so bent? Did it happen while loading or unloading?

Kevin
 
I have been using moon clips since I started shooting an uncle's 1917 in the late 60s. They were 1/2 moons then. Loading them was easy with a pair of waterpump pliers and stripping them was about as east. Put the empty case in the corner of a metal GI ammo can and pull straight away. The case popped free and dropped into the can. When full moon clips became available, it got even better.

Moon clips work best with the 45 ACP for a reason. They were designed for short, stout cartridges. Later in the end of the 20th century, folks tried to make them work with long, skinny cartridges and got mixed results. Not the clips fault. The balance is all wrong.

I like them and always keep a bunch loaded. A standard K frame speedloader case will hold 4 moon clips. That makes for a nice walk in the woods.

Kevin
 
Couple of months ago I got a 625-2 (.45 ACP) and I love everything about it, including the moon clips. It is very fast to reload at the range, and I assume in a SD situation as well. But I have a question for you guys who have more experience.

When I watch a video of Jerry Miculek shooting his 625, he just takes a loaded moon clip, tosses it in the general direction of the cylinder, and it goes right in. Mine won't do that - some of the loaded shells hang up when the mouth of the case isn't perfectly aligned with the chamber, thus requiring a little fiddling. I am using factory ammo, which cannot be crimped because it has to headspace on the mouth of the case in semiautos. So, does JM use reloads with the case crimped into a cast lead bullet, or what????

BTW, I love this site! You guys are a wealth of information. Thanks!
 
I'm a big fan of moonclips now, after a loooooong period of 'meh.'

While the clips kept the brass tidy, I never felt it necessary to really use the clips in a 627PC. It was a bit fiddly with 8 rounds, requiring the clip to be clocked perfectly and the rounds well-aligned.

Meh.


Now, with a 625, the magic is there. The fewer/shorter rounds, having less lateral leverage to deform the clip during anything but vertical insertion, just fall home. Im sure the spacing helps, too.

A 610 is on the way now, clips for it have already landed.
 
smoothshooter said:
I would think the moon clips would be a disadvantage for SD. To do a tactical reload you would have to dump unfired ammo.
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A revolver is not like a semi-auto where you can have one in the chamber ready to fire while you are performing your tactical reload.

You shoot the revolver empty then reload while in the midst of the gunfight.......and hope you survive if caught out in the open while doing so.

If you find safe cover and a brief lull in the gunfight and feel a top-off is needed then it would still be quicker to dump a partially loaded moonclip in your pocket (for later use if need be) and then top off with a full moonclip or two depending upon if you are using full or half-moonclips.

In the middle of a gunfight with a revolver in my hands I would be much less concerned about topping off the revolver versus making good use of every round I have in it. When I have safe cover and time to top off then I would much rather be fumbling with one or two moonclips versus 5 or 6 loose rounds......as the the lull in the fight might be much briefer than I had anticipated.
 
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First of all, round nose bullets. Yes, a light to medium taper or roll crimp is good, mainly to keep bullets from creeping forward from recoil of previous shots.

For semiauto rounds in a revolver, it is best to ream out the square shoulder for the case mouth to seat on. That corner in the chamber catches lead, carbon and other debris and over time, will keep the rounds from fully seating. If you look at the chambers of a rimmed caliber cylinder, you will see a tapered transition from case size down to bullet size. This allows most of the trash to just go out the barrel, rather than getting trapped in a square corner. The rounds then headspace on the rim and moonclip and will easily go all the way in, even when dirty.

None of this matters to the occasional plinker, but if you are shooting matches, it matters a lot. You need the most possible speed and reliability to win a match.

If you have round nose bullets, the best way to load them is to get the muzzle pointing down and drop them from 1/4" to 1/2" above the cylinder. Don't try to put them in the chambers by hand. I have very fast reloads with 6 or 8 of any caliber this way. I shoot 38 Short Colt, 38 Special, 9mm, 38 Super, 40 S&W, 44 Auto Mag, and 45 ACP, all with moon clips .
 
I'm not a fan. Quite a few of the guys I shoot bowling pins with use revolvers with moon clips. Many have trouble with misfires, clips breaking and the like. It seems like it is also something they have to mess with. Faster reloads? Yes but still not as fast as the semi-auto shooters on reloads (considering shooters of similar skill levels, of course).

I do pretty well with my Model 29 and Safariland speedloaders. I have never had anything break and if there is a difference in speed it is so slight that it isn't worth it to me.

Of course, the key is not to miss and a reload will not be necessary. :D
 
There is a problem with the whole premise of this thread. It is too broad, it lumps all moon clip guns together and asks for an overall opinion. bigwheelzip pretty much hit the nail on the head, but doesn't really spell it out.

I'm sure that there are probably a number of people out there that have gone out and purchased a gun chambered in .357 cut for moon clips, based on their experience with a .45 ACP gun. To their chagrin, they've found that it is a whole different ball game.

The OP needs to be more specific in their question - what gun/caliber are we talking about? and then go from there.

Adios,

Pizza Bob
 
First of all with bowling pins why reload? Really, your out of the money. Next all kinds of people have misfires when they set up the spring tension to low. I have never had one of mine not fire a round in a clip, But, I gave up on super light triggers and went to-learning to be abetter trigger puller. I would rather have a smooth 10 or 11 # DA trigger that fires every time than a#8 one that don't. Maybe they need a stronger finger instead of a lighter pull.
 
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steelslaver said:
First of all with bowling pins why reload? Really, your out of the money. Next all kinds of people have misfires when they set up the spring tension to low. I have never had one of mine not fire a round in a clip, But, I cave up on super light triggers and went to-learning to be abetter trigger puller. I would rather have a smooth 10 or 11 # DA trigger that fires every time tan a#8 one that don't. Maybe they need a stronger finger instead of a lighter pull.
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I've never had an issue with them either, but I guess if you are prone to using bent or nearly broken clips then it could be an issue.

That being said my experience with them has been from .45acp revolver types not having their mainspring tension fudged with.
 
I do see a use for moon clips, I also see a good use for using 45 Auto Rim in a revolver chambered for .45 ACP. When puttering around down at the range I prefer to use Auto Rim, I do not reload .45 ACP. I do own a few pistols chambered in .45 ACP but do not shoot them enough to warrant reloading, keeping a surplus of over 1K rounds including personal defense loads is enough. I have more revolvers chambered in .45 ACP and one of my favorite carry pieces is a cut down Model of 1917. While carrying that firearm I have personal defense loads in a full moon clip and a strip clip of six personal defense loads in a pocket. If I was to be carrying a model 1917 into combat I would want a supply of loaded half moon clips to be used as the firearm was designed.
I had a friend that lost a serious pistol match to a bent moon clip, he got me started on 45 Auto Rim and I never looked back. I only reload 45 Auto Rim because I do most of my casual shooting at a range. I don't seriously dislike half moon or full moon clips I just prefer to use the revolver like any other revolver. For personal defense I think a fully loaded revolver with a reload of six should be enough, any need for more firepower is going to have me packing a rifle or shotgun.
I have experienced a clip bent enough to not allow for a smooth reload, you can straighten them on a piece of glass. They usually get bent while unloading or loading, especially when someone is trying to be a good guy and do it for you after using the revolver at the range. I usually thank them but tell them I've got this and use my tool to unload the spent rounds.
I guess in summation I'm not really in favor of using moon clips except for an initial carry application, beyond that I'm more of an Auto Rim guy. For action pistol stuff, its pretty tough to be the speed of a full moon clip...the original speed loader. ALTHOUGH...The 1858 Remington cap and ball revolver could easily reload a full cylinder, even while horseback, making it truly the first speedloader.
 
I like moonclips and use them regularly in my 929 and 45 ACP revolvers. The RIMZ moonclips are very easy to use and I can use the steel ones without any tools other than a sharpie or wooden dowel.

I've never used them on a .357 and wouldn't be interested in converting any for moonclips. If I was so inclined I would just buy a gun that was setup for them from the factory.
 
I tried the moon clips but they jam up my 1911. Am I missing something?

The aggravation they cause is not worth it if you can avoid using them and there's nothing they do that can't be done with a rimmed cartridge and a speed loader. I dumped mine for my 25 and 625 and went to the auto rim and never looked back. I still keep the half moons for my 1917 only for nostalgia reasons.
 
Pizza Bob said:
There is a problem with the whole premise of this thread. It is too broad, it lumps all moon clip guns together and asks for an overall opinion. bigwheelzip pretty much hit the nail on the head, but doesn't really spell it out.

I'm sure that there are probably a number of people out there that have gone out and purchased a gun chambered in .357 cut for moon clips, based on their experience with a .45 ACP gun. To their chagrin, they've found that it is a whole different ball game.

The OP needs to be more specific in their question - what gun/caliber are we talking about? and then go from there.

Adios,

Pizza Bob
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With all due respect, if I had wanted a specific opinion I would have asked for one, but if you notice I asked for a (general opinion) and because of that I have gotten the education I was hoping for.
 
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I hate to derail but other than specific sizes for 38/357, what are the issues with them over 45acp moonclips? I am seriously considering getting my 2.5 686 cut.
 
I bought a 625 recently and like using the moon clips. I load a bunch of them up before I go out to my private range here at the house and they make loading unloading and keeping the brass together easy.
 
cmj8591 said:
I tried the moon clips but they jam up my 1911. Am I missing something?

The aggravation they cause is not worth it if you can avoid using them and there's nothing they do that can't be done with a rimmed cartridge and a speed loader. I dumped mine for my 25 and 625 and went to the auto rim and never looked back. I still keep the half moons for my 1917 only for nostalgia reasons.
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While I have around 500 or so .45AR cases I usually tend to handload the .45acp cases just in case I may also want to shoot them in my G21C or P250 semiautos chambered in .45acp.

Every now and then I'll shoot a bit of .45AR, but I too enjoy the nostalgia of shootin' that moonclipped .45acp.

I have plenty of rimmed cartridge caliber revolvers if I truly need to cure a rimmed case desire.
 
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It depends on your use and needs.
I'm into Bullseye and precision shooting.
I like the older "pre model number" 1950 and 1955 .45 Target revolvers. They have match grade chambers and proper throats for cast bullets. The headspace is on the tight side.
45 Auto Rim brass allows better control of fitting my handloads to the chambers. It's more work, but it lends itself to tighter groups, especially for slow fire at 50 yds.
Moonclips and ACP brass introduce one more variable. Moonclip thickness and flatness need to be a bit more consistent than how they seem to come as manufactured. Inconsistency can lead to cylinder binding, variation in headspace and other headaches.
I've played around with lapping moonclips dead flat on a leveling stone, and that may work out. But, it is more work.

This is probably why S&W opened up their chambers and throats in later guns.
If you have a later 25-2 with fat .457" throats and "longish" chambers, and can live with the trade off in accuracy, then it might be less of an issue.
 
Loyaljeeper said:
I hate to derail but other than specific sizes for 38/357, what are the issues with them over 45acp moonclips? I am seriously considering getting my 2.5 686 cut.
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Speaking as the newly educated OP, it seems that the shorter (chunkier) the round is the better. The longer leaner 357 requires a bit more finesse than the 45 does to manipulate speedily.
 
The moonclips for rimmed calibers need to be matched to the brass you're going to use. You need to get the best quality ones (TK Custom). They are thinner than rimless caliber clips, easier to bend when you step on them. Still worth it if you want a fast reload.

The rimless caliber moon clips are thick metal. They are cheaper, and you can use mixed brass with them.
 
[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0FbUMqoyjDw&ab_channel=JerryMiculek-ProShooter"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0FbUMqoyjDw&ab_channel=JerryMiculek-ProShooter[/ame]
 
I have two moon-clip guns - a 25-2 and a 646.

I like shooting them, but I shoot them less than some other guns because of the moon clips. If I have some loaded up - great. If not - maybe next time.

I only use Rimz plastic clips. They are cheap, work great, and no tools or blood sacrifice required.

I would never take a normal revolver and convert it to moon clips.
 

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cmj8591 said:
I tried the moon clips but they jam up my 1911. Am I missing something?

The aggravation they cause is not worth it if you can avoid using them and there's nothing they do that can't be done with a rimmed cartridge and a speed loader. I dumped mine for my 25 and 625 and went to the auto rim and never looked back. I still keep the half moons for my 1917 only for nostalgia reasons.
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I have never found them to be an aggravation. I also never mess with them at the range. I go out with a coffee can full of clipped up rounds and come home with what ever is left and another can with empty brass in clips. In my loading room out goes the brass with a handy dandy twist tool. New ammo fills the clips with another handy dandy tool.

And BTW nobody can reload a revolver with something other than clips in less time than it has been done with a clip gun. No where even close.

Hows this 16 rounds in 4 seconds. Not many could do that with a 1911 and 8 round magazines.

He does 12 from a 625 in under 3 second

Jerry Miculek Sets 16-Round Revolver Speed Reload Record | VIDEO – Personal Defense World
That is something you can not do with any speed loader.
 
steelslaver said:
Hows this 16 rounds in 4 seconds. Not many could do that with a 1911 and 8 round magazines.

He does 12 from a 625 in under 3 second
.
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That's one thing I found with the AR. It has slowed down my 12 round dump to 3.25 seconds! Miculek is from another planet!! His rate of fire with his 625 is actually faster than an H&K MP5 machine gun.
 
Jerry Miculek aside, my times with a moonclipped revolver are much better than using a speedloader. I competed in PPC for at least a decade so I got plenty of practice with speedloaders yet my split times are faster with any of my ACP revolvers.

If they don't work for you, no problem! But they do work, at least for some of us

Kevin
 
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