Constitutional Carry question

So, do those states that have Constitutional Carry extend that right to non-residents? Particularly interested in what Nebraska will allow once their newly passed Constitutional Carry law takes place. It would seem to me that a legal case could be made for “equal protection under the law “ against those states that deny non-residents.

I think in most states it is for their residents only, non-residents usually rely on their CCW permit as long as state has reciprocity .

For me that means Wyoming recognizes my Montana CCW even though both states have constitutional carry on the books.

Randy

I read the new Florida Constitutional carry bill a few months back,
Iirc it is extended to legal US citizens that are non Florida residents as long as you carry a form of ID that would allow PD to verify that.

North Dakota is the only state that has constitutional/permitless carry that does not apply to non-residents.

Wow, I'm surprised this thread hasn't been one-starred yet for the mere mention of constitutional carry...

That being said, unfortunately most constitutional carry states have such laws exclusively for state residents, but much like any other state you may plan on traveling to or through, it's your responsibility to read up on state carry laws in order to be informed and prevent yourself from inadvertently breaking any laws.

In my state, anyone can carry...open or concealed, permits have never been required here since the states founding. Maine and NH allow nonresidents to carry. Not a clue about any other state.

In Mississippi, any state resident can carry openly, except when you are on Federal property within the state and there may be a few other restrictions that I can't recall just now. Amazingly, in one of the most gun-friendly states, concealed carry here is only legal if you have a Mississippi Firearms Permit. There is also an Enhanced CCW that identifies you as trained by a certified firearms instructor or formal training in the military. I've never been comfortable with open, visible carry; I think it only invites confrontation in some situations. Concealed carry is the way to go.

Texas H.B. No. 1927

This is the specific statute:

87(R) HB 1927 - Engrossed version - Bill Text

The word "citizens" only comes up once.

Section 23, Article I, of the Texas Constitution
secures for Texas citizens the right to keep and bear arms;

Click to expand...

It starts with this:

A BILL TO BE ENTITLED

AN ACT
relating to provisions governing the carrying of a firearm by a person who is 21 years of age or older and not otherwise prohibited by state or federal law from possessing the firearm and to other provisions related to the carrying, possessing, transporting, or storing of a firearm or other weapon; creating criminal offenses.

Click to expand...

Note well: it says "person", not citizen.

By my count "citizen" comes up once and "person" a couple of dozen times.

If I was a citizen of some other state other than Texas and if I was visiting Texas or just passing through and (1) if I did not have a reciprocal CHL/LTC/CCW/etc. and (2) I was not a prohibited person and I wanted to carry a handgun I would do it concealed and hope that the law covers all Americans.

Further:

Only qualified Texas residents and nonresidents are eligible to carry under the law. If you are prohibited from possessing guns under either state or federal law, then you cannot possess or carry handguns, even under the new law.

Click to expand...

Permitless carry: The law and handguns in Texas

(c) Dallas Morning News 2022


More comments here:

Permitless Carry Becomes Legal In Texas Next Week. Here’s What You Need To Know – Houston Public Media

(c) Houston Public Media 2021

Oklahoma does not specify residency. At least i don’t remember it doing that.

Missouri’s 2017 permitless carry law allows anyone at least 18 yoa who is legally able to possess a concealable firearm to carry concealed without a permit, regardless of residency . . .

Muss Muggins said:

Missouri’s 2017 permitless carry law allows anyone at least 18 yoa who is legally able to possess a concealable firearm to carry concealed without a permit, regardless of residency . . .

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Adding this just for the info.
Permit updates after moving to Missouri...
Florida was contacted with change of address. No new card needed.
Arizona issued new card ($43)
Utah will not issue new card until a carry permit from county of residence is obtained.
Looks as though Utah does not fully honor Missouri constitutional carry.?.?

I read as much as I could possibly stand of LB77 in Nebraska, and the now legal text removed the term "permit holder" and replaced it with "person"... I am not a lawyer, nor have I played one on TV... I also didn't stay in that hotel either... so this ain't legal advice.

Rob613 said:

North Dakota is the only state that has constitutional/permitless carry that does not apply to non-residents.

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You used language here that is important.

People hear “constitutional carry” and start thinking that means open or concealed carry for anyone in the state who is not prohibiting from possessing firearms.

That’s not always the case. In addition, true “constitutional carry” doesn’t exist in many states as many states have permitless carry laws that allow some concealed carry or open or concealed carry with some restrictions.

North Dakota is a prime example as they allow “permitless carry” but only to residents of the state. They must be a resident for at least one month and the permitless carry law applies to concealed carry only.


Despite many “constitutional carry” laws being written based on a template used in other states, specifics can vary. For example:

In Alabama it’s legal to carry open or concealed but you have to be 19 (unless you have a permit to carry from another state and then it’s 18).

In Alaska it’s 21.

In Arkansas and Georgia, it’s 21 unless you are active duty or reserve military or an honorably discharged vet, then it’s 18. However in AR it’s concealed carry only while in GA it’s open or concealed carry.

In Arizona it’s 21, but you cannot carry in an establishment that serves alcohol unless you have a permit.

Texas has similar restrictions on permitless carry that do not apply if you have a concealed carry permit.

Tennessee allows open or concealed permitless carry at age 18, but has some areas like state and city parks that are off limits unless you have a permit

In Florida and Utah it’s 21 but is concealed carry only.

West Virginia is 21 with the 18 year old exception for active military, reserve and guard members *but not vets*, and you cannot have a concealed handgun in your vehicle on K-12 property without a concealed carry permit.


When deciding how you can carry in a state you also have to know whether open carry is legal or was legal prior to permitless carry to get an accurate read on open versus concealed as the permitless carry law may be silent on it.

For example South Dakota’s constitutional carry law allows concealed carry at 18 or older. It doesn’t mention open carry specifically as open carry was legal long before the law was passed (although open carry was very narrowly defined - a partially covered handgun, or a loaded handgun in a vehicle was considered “concealed” even when it was in plain sight on a seat, on the dash, etc).

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So, it’s your responsibility to get the details on what is and is not legal in any alleged “constitutional carry” state as many of the, are not what you think they are.

Always one guy in the crowd to ruin a good display of opinionating with facts... ;-)

Pisgah said:

Always one guy in the crowd to ruin a good display of opinionating with facts... ;-)

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Yep, the fun sponge.

BB57 said:

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So, it’s your responsibility to get the details on what is and is not legal in any alleged “constitutional carry” state as many of the, are not what you think they are.

Click to expand...

Looks as though Utah does not fully honor Missouri constitutional carry.?.?

Click to expand...

First point, it is absolutely your responsibility to know the laws of the states that you plan to travel in.

Second point. NOBODY - i.e., NO STATE honors any other states' so-called "constitutional carry" rules. It would be impossible.

The easiest way to look at it is from the extremes. Suppose you are from Vermont where there are no restrictions. You drive to New York - wait, even better, New York City - and you step out of your car with your openly carried handgun. Besides scaring the heck out of anyone who sees it you get arrested in short order. You tell the cop, and then the judge, "I'm from Vermont and every citizen there can carry a gun without a permit so I am bringing those citizens' rights with me here."

Good luck with that!

And so forth.

Remember the rule that says the first safety on your firearm is your brain? Same with cross-country carrying of firearms.

______________________________

Side note from a lawyer: I'd like to say that the 14th Amendment's Privileges and Immunities clause covers this but it does not. Not yet, anyway.

Not to derail the thread, or stifle the opinionating, there has been a bunch of opinionating here in NC this legislative session.

The house and senate bills 189 titled “Freedom to Carry NC” were moving through their respective houses and created an interesting contradiction in terms of requirements and enforceability.

Both were based on a red line of existing concealed carry legislation and that approach was badly flawed.

HB 189 stated in part:

Ҥ 14-415.35. Carrying concealed handguns.
(a) Carrying Concealed Handgun. – Any person who is a citizen of the United States and is at least 18 years old may carry a concealed handgun in this State upon completion of an approved firearms safety and training course, as described in subsection (e) of this section, unless provided otherwise by law.”



A preamble and other language had to be written to allow for residents to continue to apply for and hold concealed handgun permits for the purposes of reciprocity with other states.

There was also language indicating that a CHP would still be required to carry a concealed firearm in some of the places identified in “subsection b)”. Although there didn’t appear to be any of those areas identified in that section, there were rewrites in other sections that addressed parades and funerals, college campuses, and carrying by employees on posted property (e.g. can keep it locked in their vehicle on a company owned parking lot).

All of the prohibitions to concealed carry in certain locations and situations still applied (state and county buildings, properly posted private property, etc, as well as a reworded paragraph regarding carrying a concealed weapon into places that serve alcohol or places of assembly where an admission fee was charged if the person is consuming alcohol or is still under the influence of alcohol. NC does not have bars, just places that serve alcohol along with food, and under current law you can conceal carry in one of these establishments with a CHP, provided you have not and do not consume alcohol.

In order to address all these limitations the bill still required the “citizen” to have attended an approved training program as noted above, but the fine print of that specific sub section added “meeting the requirements of the NC Justice Training Standards and Education Commission”, just as it does for the CHP, but without specific reference to required hours of both firearm safety training, training in the laws pertaining to deadly force, and live fire qualification.

Exactly how an NC resident would prove completion of this requirement was not clarified, how this requirement would be enforced with out of state US citizens, and how those out of state US citizens would comply with this requirement.

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It’s unfair to draw any conclusions about the over all intent as the draft bill was still a major mess. But based on my read of what is there, it was an attempt to allow permitless carry to any non prohibited individuals that then got bogged down in all the restrictions that various legislators and or interest groups wanted to chuck in to the bill, with not enough thought to making the law easy to comply with an no thought given to enforcement.

It’s thankfully dead as it would have been one of the most restrictive “permitless” carry laws on the books anywhere in the US and would have still effectively required a permit in terms of both a photo ID and matching documentation of training - which is in essence a permit.

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Being from SD, I’m biased but SD did a much better job of it, first with a $5 (later $10) concealed carry permit that eventually became a “basic” permit with two other levels of enhanced permits with additional requirements and fees to meet the reciprocity requirements of most other states, and then meet the higher requirements of its neighboring always-thought-too-highly-of-itself passive aggressive (aka Minnesota Nice) state of Minnesota.

When SD adopted a constitutional carry law it did so cleanly without additional restrictions and left the existing concealed carry permits in place.

As long as you are able to legally own a gun, under federal law, you can carry it open or concealed in Montana with no permit.

for an additional bit of fun... Nebraska is a disclosure state.. ANY contact with law enforcement requires notification that you are carrying...

rather than get whats legal where legal advice from a forum....
handgunlaw.us is your friend........
Gary and his crew do an amazing job of keeping it very current.
Thanks Gary for all you do.