I like .380 but...

I carry a CS 45 when I leave. When on my farm, I carry everything from a .22lr, .380, or .38 spl. That is not to say I do not think a .380 is adequate. The .380 is about equal to a .38 spl. Many bad guys were killed with this round for many years, so it will do the job. Shot placement is critical as with any handgun round.

Two thumbs for my LCP, I feel that it is enough for self protection!

Keep the comments coming guys, I think this is a great discussion & hearing so many good points.

My main carry is a M&P Shield 40, and like I said, I carry my M&P 380 for quick trips out the door, convience store or walks... In this part of Texas where I live, it is over 90° 8 months of the year, so the .380 comes in handy for hot weather clothing.

However, I feel that .380 is borderline caliber adequate for self defense. Sure you might get the BG and he might succumb a couple hrs later in the ER, but if a BG is intent on taking you out, you need a caliber that will stop him in his tracks. Sure shot placement is vital, I know that. However it's no secret that calibers larger than 9mm have more energy behind them.

There isn't much in this collection of data that suggests any of the popular calibers 380, 38, 9, 40 or 45 yields much different results in stopping the bad guy from doing whatever it was he was doing. The results are eerily similar.

An Alternate Look at Handgun Stopping Power | Buckeye Firearms Association

A firearm in .380 can and does serve a purpose for many people both male and female.It's been around long enough to have proven it's worth and it's even more popular today.

The .380 was never intended to be a firearm for all situations but then again there isn't a firearm made that is. JMHO

I agree with ChattanoogaPhil that if a .380 is too tame then why settle for 9mm when the XDS .45ACP is available.

I was thinking about a blued .380 Walther PPK, but since the blued guns are SO hard to get, I held off.

Then lunatics started cutting people's heads off on THIS side of the ocean. Having previously had to sell my Norinco M1911 to make the rent a couple of Christmases ago, I compromised and bought a 3.5" Citadel M1911 in .45acp.

Unlike .32acp, I'm not unalterably opposed to .380acp, but these days I think 9x19mm and up is probably a better idea unless maximum concealability is paramount.

If I need to pocket carry, I'll stick with my 2" Smith 36 for the time being.

I have never shot anyone with a .380 and have never been shot with one. I like both facts just fine, but am willing to learn from those of you who have.

90% of the time I pocket carry. I carried full size autos and N-frames concealed for years and I know how to do it. I just prefer not to anymore.

I put a Bersa CC into my rotation recently. I put a few hundred rounds through it and settled on a hollowpoint that fed well. (Although frankly, EVRYTHING feeds well in this pistol).

It supplements a 642. Dimensions are so close I'd hate to live on the difference except the 642, which holds 4 fewer rounds, is 1/3 thicker. I haven't compared the Bersa to a Ruger LC9, but that is the only pocket 9 I've tried that isn't heavier, endowed with sharp edges or like shaking hands with a hot horseshoe rasp to shoot.

The Bersa puts 9 rounds into a smaller group than the 642 puts 5. Control and accuracy have become more significant to me than they once were.

IMO the Shield is a belt gun. Probably right on the edge and if I carried one it would be IWB, but I can't see it as a pocket piece except in cargo pants or if you're Captain Kangaroo. If I decide I need to carry a belt gun, it will mean I am either going hunting or being hunted and in that case it will be a .45.

Just my opinion, which is worth every penny you paid for it.

Two more observations: the only .380-induced gunshot wound I ever recall seeing was when a local purveyor of LSD tried to play Russian Roulette with one. Opened up his scalp ear to ear and left him with a killer headache and a permanent part.

My first contact with a Bersa was when a friend bought one as a BUG 30 years ago and put a round between his feet the first time he loaded it.

Despite both these experiences, there's a Bersa .380 in my pocket at this moment.

The comparison made is size. If one intends to pocket carry it's very much weight as well.

My Taurus 738 is 9.7 ounces unloaded.

My Kahr CM9 is borderline for
Front pocket is carry but okay for rear at 14 ounces.

My shield is 19 ounces and not suited for pocket but great at IWB.

So it depends what I am wearing. A suit the 380. No pocket sag in front pocket.

Casual Friday type dress. Kahr CM9 in rear of dockers.

Home and causal dress. Shield Appendix or 4 o'clock.


I don't dress around what I carry. I make my choice based on my dress.

I keep reading the " marginal "
" not big enough " etc when the 380 is brought up. Let's look at it logically.

There are 3-4 rounds that will meet the FBI specs. Based on shootthebull410 and his testing.

So if my shot placement is proper and the same with a .380 to a 45 ACP would the result vary if all the rounds all preformed as designed ?

I have the unenviable distinction of having accidentally shot MYSELF with a .380 in 1977. It was obviously not a critical CNS or cardio hit, and although it bled profusely and was not pleasant, it would not have taken me out of a fight for the next few minutes. This is not scientific, but I have not considered the .380 a serious defense cartridge since then. That's just me. For those who still love the .380, more power to you. It's MUCH better than a sharp stick.

(I recovered, and still have, the bullet - a 90 gr JHP. It did NOT expand)

Just remember this:

Seize not the tempest of the sea, but await the sunrise to drink of it's shade.

Well, I traded my Bersa .380 for a 2" Model 10 some time back and the one reason I miss that Bersa is because even though it was not small it was flat and could drop nicely into a back pocket of my jeans. OTOH, I don't miss it that much, I have a Star Model S that will outshoot any other .380 ever made - yes, I know that's a bold statement but with that gun I'll take any wager. It's just ridiculously accurate. I also have a Beretta 85FS. I don't carry them because they're not much different in size from my 6906 so if I elect to carry a concealable pistol the 6906 wins every time.

There is ONE very valid reason I can think of for SOME people to carry a .380 instead of one of the "wundernines" that is approximately the same size and weight.

That would be the much stouter recoil of the 9mm in a package that small. It is significant enough to prevent many people from quickly getting back on target for a follow up shot.

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I agree with that. Tiny .380s are way easier to control than tine 9mms. It jus' beez dat weigh......

I recently engendered some comments when I started a thread about carrying a .22 caliber pistol - I have my choice of a Walther P22 or a Beretta 70s. The problem is they're not really any smaller than the .380s I mentioned, so that brings me back to the 6906.

I might start carrying a .22 as a BUG in my briefcase or shoulder bag. Maybe. But I can just as easily carry one of the .380s. In this (off body) category the winner is probably the lightweight Walther. So far the only gun in that category has been my 638 (I am partial to S&W anything, especially a wheelgun!).

But a quality .380 with quality ammunition - yes, I wouldn't hesitate to carry one just because it was a .380 - not until the gun magazines start printing story after story about failures to stop crimes with .380s.

Buford57 said:

Despite both these experiences, there's a Bersa .380 in my pocket at this moment.

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In all honestly, I like the Bersa Thunder .380... I had one, and then sold it... Lately I've been considering buying another one as it was a good reliable shooter. Do you have the standard or the CC model?

I have recently purchased a Rock Island compact 1911, which I currently have for sale, but have thought of using it in place of my Walther PK380. That is if I don't sell it first.

I would carry this Smith 4006, but this rascal is on the heavy side!

Hang on to your 380, it's bought and paid for and you like it. Just in case you don't care for the micro 9 mm , you wont be stuck .
My dad told me to never sell a gun you like to get another that you might not like. Chances are you will be regretting that sale and wishing you had the first gun back...which usually doesn't happen.
Gary

Whether you use a 22LR or a 44Mag, your shots will disappear into his clothing and you will probably not see any immediate effect, if any at all. I've read too many stories and seen too many youtube vids to ever think he's gonna go down immediately. If you're lucky, he'll run away out of fear (to collapse somewhere else, maybe).

Nobody's going to stick around thinking, "That sounds like a 380. I'll stay and trade shots." They're going to run.

I'm starting to wonder whether the bigger calibers make much of a difference. Enough penetration to damage the spine is most important to me.

My primary CCW is a S&W N frame 44 Spl. BUG is a Ruger LCP 380 ACP.

I carry a ruger lc9-s inside the waistband. I owned a Shield once and the ruger is lighter and skinnier. I have carried it in the pocket, but depending on the pants, it's either just manageable or not at all.

So I've been going back and forth with getting a pocket gun. I owned a 642 once. Loaded it's about 17.5 ounces. Better than my lc9 which is over 20. The M&P Bidyguard is lighter and slimmer than the 642. I've put them both in my pocket at the gunshop and the 642 is comfy, but the Bodyguard absolutely vanishes.

Only thing keeping me from getting it is I don't want to start buying 380 ammo. I don't want to shoot 300 rounds of "break in ammo" to make sure the Bodyguard is reliable. I don't want to buy premium 380 ammo and shoot 100 rounds of that to be confident in it.

I own other 38's. I reload 38. I don't have to worry about the reliability, or light strikes, or pretty much anything else.

But to say there are 9MM's available in the same size as the pocket 380's is totally false. If there was, I would own one already.

President Reagan was almost killed by a "ricocheted" .22lr round. It expended a lot it's energy bouncing off a building, then entered his side. It was not a "shot placement" thing, obviously, as the wacko didn't aim at the building, and not full-powered by any means. So, just food for thought.

While I was an LEO for 20-1/2 years, I think I went through at least 10 different guns, including my actual duty gun at one point, trying to find the right gun that I would carry religiously every time I went out of the house when I was off duty. The guns ranged from a 9mm Sig P226, Ruger P95, S&W model 19 4", Glock 23, and a S&W 642. Obviously I skipped over a few others not really worth mentioning, but I concentrated on the more "respected" calibers of .38 spl/.357, 9mm, & .40 S&W.

Every one of those guns ended up staying home because to me they were too big/cumbersome/uncomfortable to carry, including that 642 Airweight if you can believe that---it was still just a little too big. I tried OWB, IWB, pocket holsters (for the 642) but to no avail. In my latter years of law enforcement I was so "over it" that it got to the point I had no interest in guns, sold off what I had, regrettably (oh to have that model 19 and P95 back----I loved those guns) and my shooting was limited to 4 times a year at qualification. I am ashamed now to say that I had no interest in carrying off duty, probably because I gave up trying to find the right gun and really wasn't interested in continuing the search because my interest in guns was zero.

About a year and a half ago, after being retired for about 3-1/2 years, my interest in guns was resurrected, and I sought to get my LEOSA permit. I wanted to be serious about what I knew I would carry every day, as my tastes for what I thought was uncomfortable to carry had not changed. Small in size as they are, I found 9mm guns like the Shield and Ruger LC9 to be not quite small enough (yes I admit I am picky to the point of being psychotic). I picked up an M&P Bodyguard and Ruger LCP and knew I found what I had been looking for, choosing the S&W.

The .380 has resided in my pocket every time I leave the house, go to work, go out for the evening, etc., etc. I carry it to the point that it is a habit for me now. I do take my .40 Shield out for a car ride when I'm going to Dairy Queen or someplace else where I know I won't be leaving the car. I am confident carrying the .380, made myself proficient in its use and I'll never look back.

I have the utmost respect for many people that are willing and able to carry compact .45's, Shields, snubs, etc. and have no qualms about their size and consider them comfortable guns to carry all day long. I wish I did find guns such as these comfortable to carry but I just don't---it's all a matter of personal preference. If it's not comfortable I'm not carrying it.

I would like to think that if I was in a somewhat crowded establishment, and the only 2 people in the place armed were me (with my .380) and someone else who carried a 9mm or larger caliber sidearm because that person felt the .380 was SO inadequate, and something went down, that other armed citizen would thank God someone else was at least carrying, and wouldn't care if the other's gun was a .22, a .380, or anything else.

CaptRon956 said:

In all honestly, I like the Bersa Thunder .380... I had one, and then sold it... Lately I've been considering buying another one as it was a good reliable shooter. Do you have the standard or the CC model?

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Mine is the CC. I picked it up used. 8 round mag, everything melted, integral finger grooves, 3-red dot sights (which works well on a satin nickle gun) and a loaded chamber indicator. My first trip to the range the 5th or 6th round in each mag would fail to feed. I cleaned the gunk out of the mag and ran another 200 rounds of ball and a box of HPs through it without a hiccup.