Why the Philippines Has Lots of Guns But Few Mass Shootings

[Onomea]

An interesting article that attempts to answer the question the title poses: Why the Philippines Has Lots of Guns But Few Mass Shootings | Time

I do note that the article says there are lots of guns in the Philippines, and that they are freely available, but also says four million guns and 110 million people. Not very many by US standards, although a lot compared to the rest of Asia.

 

[Greyman50]

"Shame"? Here in the US? LOL, yea, right, green, orange, yellow hair and wearing pajamas to go shopping….

 

[martyd]

New Jersey, Chicago and others have very restricting gun laws.

What do I take away from this?

Gun laws have no impact on shootings!

 

[tlawler]

Maybe because they have a more homogeneous society?

 

[CH4]

As someone who lives and works in the Philippines, in the firearms and ammo business, I can say the PI has plenty of shootings/assassinations, often via drive by; they are "aimed" at specific targets, not indiscriminate like here.

There are a lot of firearms in the Philippines and it's easy to legally own and carry one. In fact, their permit process is essentially "shall issue." The only real obstacle is affordability. Most Filipinos only own 1-3 firearms, many of which are passed down from family members. The cost of the gun, registration and permit process are relatively expensive given that the average Filipino makes less than $300 per month.

About 20 years ago we had our COO ambushed at an intersection near the plant in Marikina, Manila, hitting him 30+ times. 8/20, another ranking employee involved in negotiations with the union was ambushed on his way home from work. An estimated 14 rounds were fired from a passenger on a motorcycle while our guy was stuck in traffic. Fortunately he wasn't injured.

The PI "justice system" can be much more abbreviated and thorough. We have "due process," they have "do process," That said, there haven't been any mall or school shootings that I recall and they have a lot of malls and schools. However, there was a shooting outside a mall in Thailand a couple years ago, perpetrated by a member of the Thai military. Lots of folks killed.

 

[biku324]

The reason there are few mass shootings in the Philippines is that nearly every major public building and a majority of even small businesses like convenience stores and cable TV outlets has Entry Control Points with heavily armed guards using wands, metal detectors, searches of all bags and often patdowns of employees and the public. Where these do NOT exist, portions of Mindanao and the Sulu Archipelago, there are occasionally Abu Sayyaf or IS-related mass killings. Just left in late 2018 after 5 years working with developing their national police and coast guard.

What works, works.

The Philippine national government only knows how many permitted guns there are (Batangas province is referred to by locals as 'the Wild West' because of unpermitted guns). The residual weaponry of WWII, Korea, and Vietnam exist, mostly with no accountability.

 

[CH4]

The reason there are few mass shootings in the Philippines is that nearly every major public building and a majority of even small businesses like convenience stores and cable TV outlets has Entry Control Points with heavily armed guards using wands, metal detectors, searches of all bags and often patdowns of employees and the public.

What works, works, and the national government only knows how many permitted guns there are. The residual weaponry of WWII, Korea, and Vietnam exist, mostly with no accountability.

Yes, I forgot to mention the ubiquitous security guard, they are everywhere; we have 60+ at our main facility alone. However, corruption among the cops and security guards is pervasive. My security lead is a retired Lt. Col from the Philippine National Army. He's a straight up guy who does a great job keeping our folks straight.

One of the main problems with the PI security guards is their rudimentary training and predictability. Their pat searches consist of patting the small of your back and cursory search of purses and bags, that's it. Note to self: Secrete my weapons elsewhere on my anatomy. Some use wands or walk through magnetometers. For our security team, I've developed additional, advanced training curriculum in PSD and searching vehicles, persons, buildings, etc. Nonetheless, their mere presence is a very effective deterrent.

Interestingly, most use RIA 1911s, shotguns and Armscor ammo.

 

[waffles]

The reason there are few mass shootings in the Philippines is that nearly every major public building and a majority of even small businesses like convenience stores and cable TV outlets has Entry Control Points with heavily armed guards using wands, metal detectors, searches of all bags and often patdowns of employees and the public. Where these do NOT exist, portions of Mindanao and the Sulu Archipelago, there are occasionally Abu Sayyaf or IS-related mass killings. Just left in late 2018 after 5 years working with developing their national police and coast guard.

What works, works.

The Philippine national government only knows how many permitted guns there are (Batangas province is referred to by locals as 'the Wild West' because of unpermitted guns). The residual weaponry of WWII, Korea, and Vietnam exist, mostly with no accountability.

Yep. It's also worth noting that over the last decade the Phillipines has had a higher number of persons murdered by firearms per 100k people, in some years double that of the US. Less guns, more murder, less mass shootings due to pervasive armed security (and surely other factors). Not really an aspirational goal wrt gun policy.

 

[biku324]

Yep. It's also worth noting that over the last decade the Phillipines has had a higher number of persons murdered by firearms per 100k people, in some years double that of the US. Less guns, more murder, less mass shootings due to pervasive armed security (and surely other factors). Not really an aspirational goal wrt gun policy.

Part of what I was working on with the PNP was putting together a national crime data system similar to UCR and NIBRS. They made great progress until Duterte took over and forced the PNP to report lower and lower levels of crime due to his iron fist policies. Any crime data in the Philippines is a best guess before early 2016, and utterly untrustworthy since late 2016.

The conversation here was about mass murders, not individual murders - these you can easily glean from checking newspapers and local news sites.

 

[CH4]

The primary difference is that the US has an incredibly violent past that is still part of us.

Same with the PI

 

[Puller]

The primary difference is that the US has an incredibly violent past that is still part of us.

"Incredibly violent past?" Only as the Hollywood propaganda machine portrays it.

 

[biku324]

"Incredibly violent past?" Only as the Hollywood propaganda machine portrays it.

Then the 620,000 Americans killed in the Civil War, more than WWI, WWII, Korea, and Vietnam combined, wasn't violence? Civil War Casualties | American Battlefield Trust

 

[biku324]

Same with the PI

And that violence continues on Mindanao and in the Sulu Archipelago. It also continued throughout the Dueterte regime's extrajudicial killings.

 

[CH4]

And that violence continues on Mindanao and in the Sulu Archipelago. It also continued throughout the Dueterte regime's extrajudicial killings.

Yep, my grandfather was a US Marine who did time in Mindinau. He often extoled the effectiveness of the 1911 and it's 230 gr FMJ rounds. The Spanish occupied the PI for 300 years until we booted em out in 1898; 42 years later the Japanese visited. There was plenty of violent activity before the Spanish arrived.

 

[biku324]

The Tausug and Maranao still occasionally kill one another over 1000 year-old stuff.

 

[VictorLouis]

The reason there are few mass shootings in the Philippines is that nearly every major public building and a majority of even small businesses like convenience stores and cable TV outlets has Entry Control Points with heavily armed guards using wands, metal detectors, searches of all bags and often patdowns of employees and the public. Where these do NOT exist, portions of Mindanao and the Sulu Archipelago, there are occasionally Abu Sayyaf or IS-related mass killings. ....

What works, works.
.

My visit was in Early '09. Shopping malls had a bag-check counter at each entrance. Guards would take your larger bag/s, umbrellas, etc, and put each into cubbies or proper lockers. They issued you a ticket for retrieval upon exit. I saw armored car crew picking up cash inside one mall. Shotgunner in the lead, bag-holder a step behind, and an M16 holding guard in third place.

Private guards were routinely seen in front of such mundane outlets as appliance and furniture stores. Pawn and jewelry stores, for sure. Proper banks had at least two, perhaps three guards. Where we are used to seeing one, inside, they had a long-gunner out front, and at least one armed inside the lobby.

My sense was that outside a large city, everyone knows everyone in the burbs, and villages. Or, at least you have the scuttlebutt on everyone. That can help keep one's nose clean, sometimes. Plus, it's a largely homogenous Catholic population of 90-ish percent. Of that other ten, they are almost all still believers of other faiths or denomination. Perhaps that is also a contributing factor.

 

[Hair Trigger]

Yes, I forgot to mention the ubiquitous security guard, they are everywhere; ....

Interestingly, most use RIA 1911s, shotguns and Armscor ammo.

Interesting, but not unexpected. Armscorp is headquartered in the PI, and RIA firearms are built in the PI, so they would be readily available and inexpensive compared to "foreign" firearms which would most likely have import duties and premium pricing. The RIA 1911 I own is easily the equal of my SA and Ruger in terms of quality and function, and I suppose their long guns are as well-made. Same would apply to Armscor ammo, it's made there, it's available, and it's cheap.

They are also adhering to a sort of "Buy American" philosophy, but there it would be "Buy Philippine", meaning "support your local economy". Money made there, stays there.

 

[CH4]

Interesting, but not unexpected. Armscorp is headquartered in the PI, and RIA firearms are built in the PI, so they would be readily available and inexpensive compared to "foreign" firearms which would most likely have import duties and premium pricing. The RIA 1911 I own is easily the equal of my SA and Ruger in terms of quality and function, and I suppose their long guns are as well-made. Same would apply to Armscor ammo, it's made there, it's available, and it's cheap.

They are also adhering to a sort of "Buy American" philosophy, but there it would be "Buy Philippine", meaning "support your local economy". Money made there, stays there.

Sorry, I forgot the smiley face. Was being ironical.

 

[Bald1]

Lots of societies/countries have guns and no mass shootings. 50 yrs ago the percentage of Americans owning guns was the same as now (according to Ted Cruze). Yet 50 yrs ago there wasn't all these mass shootings. Guns are not the problem. People are the problem. We all know the list of issues. Broken homes, no dominate male or father figure around. Violent video games that desensitize people. Social media where you say and do what you want with no consequences. Lock downs. And the overall coddling of young boys in our society. Nobody is teaching them to be MEN.

 

[Bald1]

DADDYS not at work. DADDYS not around at all. The common thread amongst most of these shooters is they've all been bullied or outcast. These young men were never taught that life is hard. Be a man and suck it up. There is no discipline. Today's society is more concerned with every one being equal and everyone gets a trophy. If our nation put as much effort into our mental health issues as they do allowing boy athletes to compete against girls we'd be much better off.