HP 38

[slickracer]

I have heard that HP 38 is the same powder as 231, but I notice a difference in my manuals of maybe + .3-.4 gr. HP 38 over 231.
I've never had much luck with Bullseye, and wonder if HP 38 or CFE Pistol would be a better powder than AA#5, Unique or Universal for 148 gr. DEWC loads...357 brass/standard primers...@~ 800 fps? Hopefully, that will give a load that is close to .38 Spl. +P, exceeding 15,000 psi; mild, for a cleaner powder burn, and won't produce leading.
What say, revolver mavens?

HP38/231 are one of the best powders for 148 DEWC loads.

 

[Skeet 028]

Powder charges show different loads even in the same manuals sometimes...different bbls blah blah blah. I found out 231 aand HP 38 were the same many years ago. I got a commercial package of HP 38(25 lbs)...when I opened the box the plastic bag/container was marked Winchester 231. I still have the forerunner of 231---Win 230...still works...295/296 too

 

[ArchAngelCD]

I use almost nothing other than W231/HP-38 for the .38 Special. My 3 favorite .38 Special loads are made with it!

I'm a little worried because I have only 10 lbs of it left...

 

[sniper]

HP-38 and W-231 are definitely the same powder. The variations in load data you see from one manual to another are the result of the use of different primers, brass, bullets, firearms. Differences between HP-38 and W-231 from the same manual can be due to variations across different powder lots.

That makes sense.
Thanks!

 

[Old Corp]

Good thread......and timely for me.
For the first time in a LONG time, I'm going back to loading 9mm for range time. For quite awhile I relied on cheap online Rusky ammo and it was fine for range use and drills. Plus - I never had to pick up brass (steel actually), which I hate on a good day. My range is all grass, so picking up little 9mm brass is a pain.

Now that there IS no cheap 9mm, loading for it again looms ahead.
I used to use quite a bit of WW231 for both cast and FMJ 9mm target ammo.
In surfing sites yesterday, I see that HP-38/231 is more expensive than the very similar AA-2 by $5 to $8/lb.
I've used a LOT of AA in #'s 5, 7 and 9 in .38, .357, 10mm, .41 and .44's.

What's the consensus on AA-2 in comparison to 231?
Just trying to save where I can. Will be using commercial cast/powdercoated bullets in the 122-124 gr. range.

 

[cowboy4evr]

In 38 special case using 148 gr LEE wadcutter , my favorite load uses Ramshot Zip . It is also a favorite for std 38 special loads using 158 gr cast bullets . And again , Zip is my favorite in 45 Colt loads using the LEE RNFP 255 gr bullet . Regards Paul

 

[STORMINORMAN]

OldCorp: Accurate #2 is a fine fast powder for your applications, and $5-8 per lb. is certainly a $ignificant $avings as the load data amounts for those two powders is very similar.

Cheers!

P.S. Perhaps someone can explain why Hodgdons has less #2 powder (re: both velocity & pressure!) for a Hornady 124gr XTP in their 9mm +P data (4.0gr @ 1005fps & 31,700 psi) than in the non+P 9mm data (4.3gr @ 1030fps & 38,500 psi)?

REMEMBER: ALWAYS! ONLY! use "published load data" in ALL! your reloads. Well, except for the misprints and possibly transposed data...

 

[Nevada Ed]

If by chance that you do get some w231 powder for your loading use;

don't stop with just the 148 , pick up some 158 lead RN or Swc bullets
since they work great with w231, also.

 

[Model19man]

Back in the early 1980's I bought a bunch of Winchester 231 powder. Still have not used it up. I use loads from my old Sierra reloading handbook that was purchased new at the same time as the powder. Good stuff, highly recommended.

 

[Troystat]

HP-38, W231 and Bullseye are my powders of choice for my target loads for 38 and 45. All work well and for me it is more about availability. With my guns I need just a few tenths of a grain more powder with HP38 and W231 than my loads with Bullseye.

 

[Racer X]

so, HP38/W231 are good go-to powders for target loads in 38 spl and 45 acp?

 

[stansdds]

so, HP38/W231 are good go-to powders for target loads in 38 spl and 45 acp?

Absolutely. I burned plenty driving 148 grain LDEWC bullets in 357 Magnum cases (38 Special velocity) and 200 grain LSWC and 230 grain LRN bullets (target to full velocity) in 45 ACP.

 

[Paul in Nevada]

so, HP38/W231 are good go-to powders for target loads in 38 spl and 45 acp?

It's quite possibly the best do it all powder for pistol cartridges.

 

[smithra_66]

I have heard that HP 38 is the same powder as 231, but I notice some large differences in my manuals, varying, sometimes one, sometimes the other. (same manual.)
I've never had much luck with Bullseye, and wonder if HP 38 or CFE Pistol would be a better powder than AA#5, Unique or Universal for 148 gr. DEWC loads...357 brass/standard primers...@~ 800 fps? Hopefully, that will give a load that is close to .38 Spl. +P, exceeding 15,000 psi; mild, for a cleaner powder burn, and won't produce leading.
What say, revolver mavens?

It's the same powder. For DEWC loads it works well, but I'm surprised you haven't had luck with Bullseye. In those low pressure DEWC loads, you want fast burning powder to keep things clean. 231/HP 38 is fast, but not as fast as bullseye. For me it's not as clean with lower powered loads like the target wadcutter stuff. I usually add a half grain above the Bullseye charge for 231/HP 38 to bring the pressures up to the same level.

 

[smithra_66]

I don't understand the issue of clean powders either. Shooting can be "dirty business" just like working on cars. Take up black powder shooting and then all smokeless powders will seem clean!

A lot of people will use 231 with the same charge as Bullseye.

231 is slower and won't burn as thoroughly unless you increase the charge weight by about a half grain.

That makes it "clean" again which is just another way of saying "Operating at a pressure that allows for all of the powder to be burnt."

 

[zeke]

so, HP38/W231 are good go-to powders for target loads in 38 spl and 45 acp?

Am using Hp-38 for multiple calibers. Target loads to lighter weight jhp "vermin' loads in 44 mag. While 231 and Hp-38 may be the same powders, until recently (one or 2 years is recently when you get older) Hp-38 was cheaper.

Have found it is sensitive to slight changes in powder charge for best accuracy, if that is important to you. And like a lot of powders, it burns better when not using the lowest pressure loads.

45 acp- 5.0 gns with 200 gn lswc
38 special- 4.1 gns with 158 lswc
44 special - 6.4 gns with 200 lrnfp
45 LC- 7.5 gns with 200 lrnfp

 

[Sistema1927]

HP38 = W231

H110 = W296

Any differences in manuals reflect differences in methodology.