Larger Caliber CCW

[Smoke]

Smoke: DANG! THOSE ARE GREAT HAWAIIAN SHIRTS! I lived in Hawaii back in the '60s, and had a timeshare on Kauai for over 20 years, so we were in Hawaii every year; I still have a couple myself! Hilo Hattie's be mo' bettah, Bro!

I have been told that Kauai is the rainiest place on the planet.

No one comes closed to pulling it off quite like him.

You've never seen me in a Hawaiian shirt.

Point of Order

There is a difference between an Aloha Shirt and a Hawaiian shirt.

A traditional Aloha shirt is generally printed with tradionally Hawaiian designs and is generally made out of nylon or rayon.

A Hawaiian shirt has a similar cut but it doesn't use the traditionally cultural Hawaiian designs.

I prefer Hawaiian shirts and because I live in a high plains desert I prefer 100% cotton.
 
 

 

[cowboy94916]

I have read and listened to which caliber rifle or pistol is the solution for well over 60 years. Its a discussion with no right answer. Shot placement is paramount wether hunting or defending yourself and others. Even with perfect placement you can still be killed by a walking deadman as in the Miami shootout, for those old enough to remember it.
In order to give yourself the best chance its training, training, and more training. Can you hit where you need to on a moving target, can you do it in low light or with a flashlight in either hand weak or strong. I have been lucky enough to receive good training including having to pick up the front sight using your own muzzle flash in pitch dark, among other drills. My instructor was very creative and knew stress can make the best shot on paper miss. And misses can get you killed.
Hope i don't sound like I am preaching just trying to pass along what was drilled into my head.

 

[TaxPhd]

Back when I was teaching CWP chases......One fall day I put on and concealed 12 Handguns......We even ate dinner with a friendly deputy. He discovered none.......Went class and had them find my gun by pointing to an area on my body.........They found some.......Not all...........I FELT like I was carrying 20 lbs of log chain wrapped around me........So basically you can conceal most any size handgun you want.......I probably rotate back to a custom commander in 45 acp next week and give the .22's a rest.

Reminds me of this Bianchi ad from back on the day:

 

[Smoke]

Reminds me of this Bianchi ad from back on the day:

View attachment 771893

Rookie numbers bro.

 

[Eddie Southgate]

Rookie numbers bro.

Where's the baton ?

 

[BC38]

My normal EDC is a P365 - 12+1 rounds of 9mm JHP plus another 12 round mag in my off hand pocket.
HOWEVER, for the next week or so I will be carrying a bit "heavier" than normal.
PT145 - 10+1 rounds of 45ACP JHP plus a second 10 round mag in my offhand pocket.
After our recent activity in the Middle East, and with our nation's most Patriotic holiday coming up, I think we are at a heightened threat level.
Best to be prepared.

 

[Doug M.]

Handgun rounds are generally equally poor. Changing from a .380 (my broken old man gun, but better than a pencil and harsh language) to a 9mm to a .357Sig to a .45ACP is highly unlikely to make a real difference. The first answer is to AVOID. The next is to carry something you always have and can shoot well.

If you really can't avoid (probably most applies to LE), you need a rifle.

 

[mike p]

carried a 380 bersa 21 years last year I got a .40 Taurus

 

[SGT ROCK 11B]

Bill Jordan said the 38 Special was the most powerful round the average man-i.e. most of us-could hope to master.

From the thread 38 versus 357.

Realistically the best choice for most people is the 38 Special.

Of course 50 years ago I would have disagreed but as a young lawman and in my youth I had no problem carrying a 1911 pistol all day.

 

[Smoke]

That is all well and good until you get older than dirt.

Even when you're older than dirt you can do something to improve your physical conditioning.

The odds of daily exercise lengthening your lifespan are far greater than the odds of it ever making the deciding difference in a gunfight.

My home gym is full of people who are over 50 who are just in there trying to keep their mobility.

data shows that well over 80% of people shot with a pistol survive. That tells me pistol calibers are poor at stopping bad guys

I'm not sure of the proper terminology but what I want to communicate here is it just because you didn't kill them doesn't mean you didn't stop them.

 

[Phenix]

NO IT IS NOT..........Iffen ya pull it ya better be using it.........Or YOU may get hurt......See Rock's post above

So, if the perp with the knife sees your gun coming out and abruptly turns and starts to run away you’re still going to shoot?

 

[Phenix]

carried a 380 bersa 21 years last year I got a .40 Taurus

Those Bersa .380’s are excellent guns. Only very slightly bigger than the classic Walther PP, but lighter and having a MUCH better DA trigger pull.
Never really liked the DA/SA trigger system except in revolvers, but the Bersa was such an overall good gun I sucked it up and lived with it for a few years. Finally sold it to a co-worker when more models of smaller .380’s and 9mm’s became available. Went through several of those over the next few years, and have now ended up with a Glock 42 and S&W Bodyguard 2.0 being my current favorite .380 auto pistols. Also carry one of several J frame-sized revolvers on occasion.
I still have the .22LR version of the Bersa .380. Nice gun also. Works best with high-speed LR ammo.
Both Bersas fit perfectly in Russian and East German surplus military flap Makarov holsters that can be had in new condition, cheap. I would use those when working outside because the full-coverage holsters are best for preventing dings from bumping on things, and keeping rain, snow, and wood chips from the chainsaw off of the gun.
BTW, I typically pocket carry the Glock and Bodyguard in nylon pocket holsters.Every day.

 

[Phenix]

Even when you're older than dirt you can do something to improve your physical conditioning.

The odds of daily exercise lengthening your lifespan are far greater than the odds of it ever making the deciding difference in a gunfight.

My home gym is full of people who are over 50 who are just in there trying to keep their mobility.


I'm not sure of the proper terminology but what I want to communicate here is it just because you didn't kill them doesn't mean you didn't stop them.

Excellent point regarding killing/stopping.

 

[Phenix]

Concealability and caliber are only two factors in the equation. Ability to use that weapon effectively is of prime importance. Because of neurologic damage in my shoulders and hands, I have to use and carry a weapon that I am able to rack the slide, drop a mag, and insert a new one. For me, a Glock 42 has been a constant companion and a Bodyguard 2.0 is there as well. However, I only carry what I practice with constantly.

I carry the same 2 guns you do.
I would posit that the two most important criteria for CCW is conceal-ability and reliability. Caliber is not much of a factor for private citizens who are not going to be dealing with hostage situations or confronting bank robbers or enemy soldiers.

 

[SGT ROCK 11B]

… for private citizens who are not going to be dealing with hostage situations or confronting bank robbers or enemy soldiers.

In August 1997, Los Angeles County Sheriff's Deputy Shayne Daniel York was murdered in a hair salon in Buena Park while off-duty. The incident occurred during a robbery when two suspects stormed the salon. Upon discovering Deputy York's badge, one suspect shot him in the back of the head.

 

[Smoke]

In August 1997, Los Angeles County Sheriff's Deputy Shayne Daniel York was murdered in a hair salon in Buena Park while off-duty. The incident occurred during a robbery when two suspects stormed the salon. Upon discovering Deputy York's badge, one suspect shot him in the back of the head.

I don't see the connection. Presumably Deputy York was shot because he was a cop. The way you told the story it's safe to assume that had they not found a badge on him they wouldn't have killed him.

In the incident you describe he could have had an Uzi and it wouldn't have made a difference

 

[Squib_Load]

Training is critical if you want to be effective

Being willing to shoot is most important.

Some successful defenders never touched a gun before having to use one to shoot a bad guy across the counter. Sometimes store owners keep a gun under the register. Clerks end up using them. No training. Just picked it up, pointed, and pulled the trigger.

Physically, it is very easy. Even a three year old girl can pick up a gun, walk up to a brother and kill him. The little girl's only training was seeing it done in a cartoon. Remove the fear and anything that causes hesitation and it is a very simple thing. It's that easy.

Boys have defended their mothers against intruders by getting a gun dad keeps in a bedside table. Never touched it before that night.

Lot's of stories like that. So don't tell me it's difficult and that training is absolutely necessary.

The gun academies are money making machines. It's an industry that promotes itself as being critical to your survival. It's a successful industry.

You can practice on your own if you feel the need. Watch some training videos, listen to the instructors, and set up similar courses of fire. Save yourself some big bucks.

But willingness to take action is still the most important thing.

 

[Phenix]

In August 1997, Los Angeles County Sheriff's Deputy Shayne Daniel York was murdered in a hair salon in Buena Park while off-duty. The incident occurred during a robbery when two suspects stormed the salon. Upon discovering Deputy York's badge, one suspect shot him in the back of the head.

Looks like the caliber and model of the deputy’s gun, if he had one, did not matter.

 

[Smeckler]

I only pocket carry, and what I pocket carry depends on what pants/shorts I'm wearing due to pocket size. I'm either carrying a LCP, S&W 442, or a Beretta Nano. I train with all of them and feel confident in using all of them. I'm not changing any of that due to 'current circumstances'.

I don't see a realistic scenario where carrying a larger caliber or more rounds is going to be a game changer. For those of you changing things up, an honest question: What is the scenario that you're thinking may happen that requires you to go bigger or harder?

 

[grice]

Model 25 46 colt conceals just fine for me and that’s what I carry!