daurizio
Member
what is the advantage of using one or the other and why is one hollow and not the other.
148gr hbwc vs 148 solid wc
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Erich
Member
If you have to ask, chances are good that you'll glean no advantage by using one or the other.
Super-duper target shooters claim that the HBWCs give them an accuracy advantage (under certain distances) because the base obturates to fill the bore precisely.
I now generally use standard BBWCs with a crimp groove, as I find these give me the ability to make decent short-range defensive mid-velocity bullets that are quite accurate and pleasant to shoot.
HTH.
Super-duper target shooters claim that the HBWCs give them an accuracy advantage (under certain distances) because the base obturates to fill the bore precisely.
I now generally use standard BBWCs with a crimp groove, as I find these give me the ability to make decent short-range defensive mid-velocity bullets that are quite accurate and pleasant to shoot.
Like Erich said.
Also, HWBC are generally a much softer alloy, and are intended for low velocity target loads only. Don't load them hot.
I'm a big fan of the HBWC, I've found them more accurate than the DEWC.
Also, HWBC are generally a much softer alloy, and are intended for low velocity target loads only. Don't load them hot.
I'm a big fan of the HBWC, I've found them more accurate than the DEWC.
VAdoublegunner
Member
I like DEWCs for the same reason Erich does. They are usually cheaper than other SWC options and are quite accurate. HBWCs do give me a slight accuracy advantage but you CANNOT drive them to higher velocities or at higher pressures. You risk tearing off the HB "skirt" in the bore and that will be a disaster for your gun.
Skip Sackett
US Veteran
If you decide to use a DEWC make sure of your recipe. Most recipes are for them BUT you may run against one that is specifically designed for the HBWC. Because the ones for the HBWC are exceptionally light you may end up with a bullet stuck in the barrel. 2.2-2.8gr of Bullseye may not give you enough oomph to get a 148gr DEWC out of a 6" or longer barrel.
Don't ask me how I know!
Don't ask me how I know!
BUFF
SWCA Member, Absent Comrade
One advantage the HBWC usually has over the BBWC or DEWC is better accuracy at extended ranges. Wadcutters, with their weight evenly spread along their length, often tend to tumble at 50 yards. A HBWC has more weight at the forward portion of the bullet and benefits from what some call "the shuttlecock effect." The more weight in the nose helps maintain stability. PPC shooters like them because of this because some of the shooting is done at 50 yards.
Back when I shot PPC, I tested several wadcutter bullets in a Ransom Rest. The Speer and Remington swaged HBWC shot a bit better than my home-cast wadcutters. The difference was more at 50 yards than at 25.
I would guess that, at 25 yards or closer, the accuracy difference between swaged HBWC and DEWC from the same maker (thus giving equivalent bullet manufacturing quality) may vary more from gun to gun than by bullet type.
Back when I shot PPC, I tested several wadcutter bullets in a Ransom Rest. The Speer and Remington swaged HBWC shot a bit better than my home-cast wadcutters. The difference was more at 50 yards than at 25.
I would guess that, at 25 yards or closer, the accuracy difference between swaged HBWC and DEWC from the same maker (thus giving equivalent bullet manufacturing quality) may vary more from gun to gun than by bullet type.
Originally posted by Erich:
I now generally use standard BBWCs with a crimp groove, as I find these give me the ability to make decent short-range defensive mid-velocity bullets that are quite accurate and pleasant to shoot.HTH.
Do you happen to have a recipe you could share with us? I'm sitting on 4K 146 gr. BBWCs and a bunch of Unique and Bullseye.
Erich
Member
I don't post load data, but have been known to point experienced fellow handloaders in the right direction following an email exchange.
Or, I could just tell you that the load that I use is the max load for Unique and a 148-gr BBWC that's listed in the Speer # 12. Firm roll crimp in the crimp groove with the Lee FCD, standard small pistol primer.
Or, I could just tell you that the load that I use is the max load for Unique and a 148-gr BBWC that's listed in the Speer # 12. Firm roll crimp in the crimp groove with the Lee FCD, standard small pistol primer.
SmithSwede
Member
I agree with Buff. Based on my testing, if you want the ultimate in wadcutter accuracy, the HBWC is better, especially at 50 yards. The DEWC is fine for 25 yards, or if you want to shoot a hotter wadcutter load.
In my experience, you will get better accuracy from the DEWC if you drive it a bit faster than the hollow base version, i.e. bump the load up a bit from what would otherwise work on a hollowbase.
In my opinion, the HBWC got its reputation for accuracy because that's what the Bullseye target shooters always used. But they used it because a wadcutter cuts a full caliber hole, which might nick the next higher scoring ring. And it does this with about the lightest recoil you can get in a .38 Special, which helps the shooter in the timed and rapid fire stages.
Despite its reputation, I don't think the HBWC is the ultimate bullet for pure accuracy, although they are very, very accurate bullets. The RNL bullet (Lyman 358311) has always grouped better for me, but they make a dinky hole in paper and recoil more.
No wadcutter works well beyond 50 yards.
In my experience, you will get better accuracy from the DEWC if you drive it a bit faster than the hollow base version, i.e. bump the load up a bit from what would otherwise work on a hollowbase.
In my opinion, the HBWC got its reputation for accuracy because that's what the Bullseye target shooters always used. But they used it because a wadcutter cuts a full caliber hole, which might nick the next higher scoring ring. And it does this with about the lightest recoil you can get in a .38 Special, which helps the shooter in the timed and rapid fire stages.
Despite its reputation, I don't think the HBWC is the ultimate bullet for pure accuracy, although they are very, very accurate bullets. The RNL bullet (Lyman 358311) has always grouped better for me, but they make a dinky hole in paper and recoil more.
No wadcutter works well beyond 50 yards.
Dale53
Member
I have shot a lot of HBWC's AND Dbl Ended WC.sin NRA Bullseye and PPC. I have done my share of testing in a Ransom Rest with a number of .38 Special and .357 Revolvers (all while using .38 Special cases except in experimental work). The traditional load of 2.7 Bullseye has worked well for me with the HBWC. I have found that 3.0-3.5 of Bullseye gave better results with the Dbl Ended WC's, so the suggestion to load them a bit hotter is well taken
My guns will shoot well under 1" at 25 yards and do slightly over twice that size at 50 yards. They do loose their accuracy much past 50 yards. However, they have been reliable for me at the "long line" (fifty yards).
A full charge solid base wadcutter is also a very fine self defense bullet if you are in to using reloads for that purpose. Jim Cirillo told me that is what he used on the New York Stakeout Squad during several shootouts (I believe it was a special factory load for the New York Police).
I have used wadcutters for edible small game on many occasions. They work very well - good stopping power on bunnies without much meat damage.
"Back in the day" Remington Factory HBWC loads would better my best hand loads by 1/16"-1/8" at 25 yards - that was SOME fine ammunition for accuracy work. Just one "bug hole". However, I'll take my reloads at 3/4" off the Ransom Rest with the cost difference MUCH in my favor.
Dale53
My guns will shoot well under 1" at 25 yards and do slightly over twice that size at 50 yards. They do loose their accuracy much past 50 yards. However, they have been reliable for me at the "long line" (fifty yards).
A full charge solid base wadcutter is also a very fine self defense bullet if you are in to using reloads for that purpose. Jim Cirillo told me that is what he used on the New York Stakeout Squad during several shootouts (I believe it was a special factory load for the New York Police).
I have used wadcutters for edible small game on many occasions. They work very well - good stopping power on bunnies without much meat damage.
"Back in the day" Remington Factory HBWC loads would better my best hand loads by 1/16"-1/8" at 25 yards - that was SOME fine ammunition for accuracy work. Just one "bug hole". However, I'll take my reloads at 3/4" off the Ransom Rest with the cost difference MUCH in my favor.
Dale53
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