I do not understand the concern. Carry the Mod 19 and you can shoot both .357 and 38spl. Load 38 if in close spaces and carry 357 if in more open areas.
.38 Special or .357 for EDC
- Thread starter Rocketmedic40
- Start date
OP
This is what I ultimately decided to do, we upgraded the safe last week and I had more pistols than room for pistols, so I consolidated the 19-3 and the 64-8 into a single 65-4 and a nice bit of cash that pays for other things later on, because there was some fairly obvious duplication in revolvers lol. I've still got the -65 and a pair of Model 10s before I even touch snubbies or not-.38s
Looking for an N-frame 27 or 28, maybe a Security Six or other Ruger, maybe .44? Idk. I've got a lifetime of hobby to enjoy, got to pace myself.
If anyone's looking for a nice Model 19-3 or 64-8 in the Austin area, they're at Livengoods in Lockhart, very fairly priced (I think Brian has the 19-3 at $649, the Model 64 at like $400?
Sal1950
Member
Can you say Fort Polk's Leesville Louisiana
I carry a 2.5" 686, and I carry Buffalo Bore 158gr low flash .357 Magnum ammunition.
In the past I have carried Privi Partizan 158gr JHPs, which achieves a muzzle velocity of 1500fps out of a 10" test barrel. I could shoot it quite accurately double or single action (easily out to 25 yards), but it was a bit much out of my gun (in fact, the recoil was so severe the left hand grip medallion rotated from the firm grip of my right thumb on it combating the recoil), and I ultimately decided that Buffalo Bore load was a better compromise because of the quicker follow up shots and lower muzzle flash in low light.
In the past I have carried Privi Partizan 158gr JHPs, which achieves a muzzle velocity of 1500fps out of a 10" test barrel. I could shoot it quite accurately double or single action (easily out to 25 yards), but it was a bit much out of my gun (in fact, the recoil was so severe the left hand grip medallion rotated from the firm grip of my right thumb on it combating the recoil), and I ultimately decided that Buffalo Bore load was a better compromise because of the quicker follow up shots and lower muzzle flash in low light.
Malkovich
Member
- Joined
- Jan 23, 2021
- Messages
- 66
- Reaction score
- 74
I'm thinking of selling a pair of relics. model 60 (no dash) 2" stainless in 38 and a 10-8 HB 4"
Attachments
Zeke38
Member
- Joined
- May 3, 2025
- Messages
- 32
- Reaction score
- 34
Want to tell you about High Desert Cartridge Co. out of Oregon. Owner is a former cop and loads some cool 38 wadcutter loads and a 357 load meant for two legged varmints. The 357 load is a
158gr Hornady XTP JHP and it is doing 925 out of a 2" barrel. Very accurate, controllable, low flash and expanding. Reasonable price. I'm putting mine in my HD 357s. The wadcutter load 148 grain at 750fps. Running these in J frames.
158gr Hornady XTP JHP and it is doing 925 out of a 2" barrel. Very accurate, controllable, low flash and expanding. Reasonable price. I'm putting mine in my HD 357s. The wadcutter load 148 grain at 750fps. Running these in J frames.
Last edited:
Lance Boyle
Member
- Joined
- Jul 15, 2012
- Messages
- 197
- Reaction score
- 194
I admittedly carry a Glock 43x most of the time in town. If I am woods bumming I may grab a six gun.
My philosophy is to stick with .38s in a short barrel. Only when you start up around 3 inche barrel lengths I don't hate a .357 blast. For me personally I wouldn't bother putting .357 in a short barrel or an alloy or titanium gun. I just don't want to shoot it.
It's all moot for me though. All my six guns are 4" or better and my two small guns are the 43x and a Kahr MK40 that I wish I got the 9mm version in. It's a heavy little gun but I shoot it well.
I can't handle Snubs shooting 357. There was a time that's all I shot. Those days are gone. 38 +P from my new 817 Taurus was easy to handle and be accurate with. Les recoil and Les noise. 7 shots in my 817 in the waist. 5 shots in my pocket J-Frame plus reloads, if that isn't enough I guess I'll see you on the other side 
I carry the Speer 135 grain short barrel load in .357 and the Hornady Critical Defense110 grain FTX non plus P in .38.
BLACKHAWKNJ
Member
- Joined
- Oct 25, 2006
- Messages
- 6,216
- Reaction score
- 6,673
Skeeter Skelton was quite enamored of the 2.5' M-19 when it was introduced in 1967, later changed his mind, cited muzzle blast and flash, found a 4" no harder to conceal. Jeff Cooper noted all the magna need a long runway to get up to speed-the 357 was originally developed in a 8 3/4" barrel
and Cooper found the pre-war 357 was loaded much hotter.
A Hit with a Minor Caliber hurts much worse than a Miss with a Major. I am a Charlie Askins fan (Yes !!),
IIRC he carried a Colt New Service in 38 Special during his Border Patrol and WWII service.
and Cooper found the pre-war 357 was loaded much hotter.
A Hit with a Minor Caliber hurts much worse than a Miss with a Major. I am a Charlie Askins fan (Yes !!),
IIRC he carried a Colt New Service in 38 Special during his Border Patrol and WWII service.
Last edited:
A good compromise...The often overlooked and underrated Smith ..... The Model 12 2 inch.
IMHP received a bad rap concerning cracked frame.
Been on this forum near 22 years....seems I recall in the early days one of
our members TRIED to break one....IIRC correctly, he stopped the test at some
ungodly round court...nary the slightest sign of a crack.
This one I recently retired after picking up another one from a forum member gun show bud.
IMHP received a bad rap concerning cracked frame.
Been on this forum near 22 years....seems I recall in the early days one of
our members TRIED to break one....IIRC correctly, he stopped the test at some
ungodly round court...nary the slightest sign of a crack.
This one I recently retired after picking up another one from a forum member gun show bud.
I believe the question is which round is better suited for EDC...38 Special or .357 Magnum. Forget the guns (I love my Model 19, and also my Python), the OP is asking which round is best suited for a self-defense, carry gun. We are all different and have different situations, strengths, weaknesses, etc. So, we will never have one, simple answer to that question. However, I like to look back because history is a great teacher. An awful lot of bad guys have been dispatched by both LE and military with the anemic 158 grain LRN (or FMJ) .38 Special since it was introduced in 1898. Human physiology hasn't changed during that time. A .38 slug that would kill a bad guy during the roaring-twenties, will kill a bad guy today. So, if the .38 Special was always so effective, why was the .357 Magnum developed? Simple answer...automobiles. Gangsters were driving automobiles during the thirties that were made of thick, heavy, American steel. The doors had an outer steel shell, a thick piece of glass inside (assuming the window was down which it would be if the bad guy was shooting at you), iron and steel inside for the window crank assembly, and a steel inner shell. A gangster, shooting at you through that open window with a rifle, shotgun, Thompson .45, etc., with the door as cover was not an easy stop with a .38 Special handgun. The .38, punching through all that steel and glass, had ran out of steam by the time it go to the criminal's vitals. So, the .357 Magnum was developed. Not only could it punch through the doors better, but it could also get through fenders, tires and wheels, and put a big hole in a cast-iron engine block, taking the car out.
What is the lesson that I take from this? To me, it dictates my preferences in SD guns. I carry a Model 36, in my pocket, or in an IWB holster, stoked with the best, modern +P ammo I can find. I can shoot it well, and know I can put five rounds into a bad guy at expected ranges (within 15 yards). I have no doubt that this gun, and round, will adequately put a bad guy down. The 2" barrel is not as long as the barrels that put most of the bad guys down thru history, but today's ammo more than makes up for that difference. In the instance that I am in my car, and face a car-jacking, road-rage incident, etc., (need power to punch thru a car or have more than one target), I'm carrying a 1911 in my dash with at least one extra magazine. However, a .357 Magnum revolver with a couple of speedloaders would accomplish the same thing.
In a nutshell, on my person, I go lightweight with a gun and round that has proven itself for over 100 years as an adequate manstopper. In my vehicle, I carry a little more because I might have to do a little more.
What is the lesson that I take from this? To me, it dictates my preferences in SD guns. I carry a Model 36, in my pocket, or in an IWB holster, stoked with the best, modern +P ammo I can find. I can shoot it well, and know I can put five rounds into a bad guy at expected ranges (within 15 yards). I have no doubt that this gun, and round, will adequately put a bad guy down. The 2" barrel is not as long as the barrels that put most of the bad guys down thru history, but today's ammo more than makes up for that difference. In the instance that I am in my car, and face a car-jacking, road-rage incident, etc., (need power to punch thru a car or have more than one target), I'm carrying a 1911 in my dash with at least one extra magazine. However, a .357 Magnum revolver with a couple of speedloaders would accomplish the same thing.
In a nutshell, on my person, I go lightweight with a gun and round that has proven itself for over 100 years as an adequate manstopper. In my vehicle, I carry a little more because I might have to do a little more.
Last edited:
Just a few random thoughts from over 50 years of shooting with the .357.
I guess I'm odd - but I've tried to make the .357 work on smallish big game (Deer and Hogs) for decades and it has failed every time, even with excellent shot placment - there was one exception and it was on a deer I had not even intended to shoot and it only weighed about 35 lbs and even then I had to shoot it again!
That said I've always tried 125 to 140 gr. bullets on game other than a handful of vermin I shot with a 158 gr SWC at 1400+ - but those were moving when shot and the placement may have been imperfect.
On my first wild boar hunt, my partner shot a smallish boar 4 times with 158 gr. Winchester JHP - all four rounds passed through the heart and he still had time to reload bafore the boar got wobbly legged and fell - up to that point he was trying to get us but the brush prevented him from running in our direction - he did chew a small tree in half!
Mind you I'm not giving up, I am switching my methods to 185 gr. to 200 gr. LHP and LFN bullets.
I don't shoot full house loads in my K-frames or J-frame .357s - I replaced three K-frame barrels for customers which all cracked at the bottom of the forcing cone. All had a steady diet of full magnum loads.
Also, don't let the above make you think I am down on the .38 Spl. - while I prefer heavier bullets, the 135 Speer short barrel load seems to do as advertised.
I worked a murder case as an expert witness, the victim was shot with a Remington 125 gr. +P JHP - the bullet did not hit bone. It did not exand and only went about 9" - the victim died 4 days after he was shot from infection.
I certainly agree with those who say the most important factors are placement with adequate penetration...but an equally importat factor is the mind set of who or what you are shooting!
Riposte
I guess I'm odd - but I've tried to make the .357 work on smallish big game (Deer and Hogs) for decades and it has failed every time, even with excellent shot placment - there was one exception and it was on a deer I had not even intended to shoot and it only weighed about 35 lbs and even then I had to shoot it again!
That said I've always tried 125 to 140 gr. bullets on game other than a handful of vermin I shot with a 158 gr SWC at 1400+ - but those were moving when shot and the placement may have been imperfect.
On my first wild boar hunt, my partner shot a smallish boar 4 times with 158 gr. Winchester JHP - all four rounds passed through the heart and he still had time to reload bafore the boar got wobbly legged and fell - up to that point he was trying to get us but the brush prevented him from running in our direction - he did chew a small tree in half!
Mind you I'm not giving up, I am switching my methods to 185 gr. to 200 gr. LHP and LFN bullets.
I don't shoot full house loads in my K-frames or J-frame .357s - I replaced three K-frame barrels for customers which all cracked at the bottom of the forcing cone. All had a steady diet of full magnum loads.
Also, don't let the above make you think I am down on the .38 Spl. - while I prefer heavier bullets, the 135 Speer short barrel load seems to do as advertised.
I worked a murder case as an expert witness, the victim was shot with a Remington 125 gr. +P JHP - the bullet did not hit bone. It did not exand and only went about 9" - the victim died 4 days after he was shot from infection.
I certainly agree with those who say the most important factors are placement with adequate penetration...but an equally importat factor is the mind set of who or what you are shooting!
Riposte
.38 Special.
Zeke38
Member
- Joined
- May 3, 2025
- Messages
- 32
- Reaction score
- 34
Blast and recoil from a 2" 357 is more than I can effectively use at this point. 3" is negotiable, I have a 60-15 that has 357 158 JHP Blazer ammo and it is managable and accurate. My EDC is a Kimber K6xs loaded with Federal Punch 120grain doing 920 from a 2 inch barrel. I'm a big fan of 2" 6 shot snubs.The 3" 60-15 is for woods carry and it is accurate with the Blazer load.
Each person has to find his own answer. And it would seem like just guessing at it would not lead to the best outcomes.
for many decades I do what I call a "Controllabilibty test" - I shoot a number of rounds, typically 5, as fast as I can keep hits withing a 4X6 Index card at 5 yards. (lately I've been thinking that is too large a target but I do have reference records goin back to the 1970s so I still do them. Sometimes I vary the test and count the number of hits I can do in a set ammount of time - say 1 second (I often use 2 seconds for students).
I don't like to mention any numbers because that devolves the thread to an argument of who can do it better - it doesn't matter what others do, it matter what you do with gun A or gun B or even guns C, D and soforth.
I shoot a 4" K frame .357 about the same as a 2" J-frame with .38 handloads (but those handloads launch a 158 gr SWC at over 1000 fps.
I should point out, that this is all sort of a moot point as I can put 8 .45 autos from a 1911 in the same target as quik as I can do 5 .38s or 5 .357s. Again, it is an intensly personal thing - go forth and test!
Riposte
for many decades I do what I call a "Controllabilibty test" - I shoot a number of rounds, typically 5, as fast as I can keep hits withing a 4X6 Index card at 5 yards. (lately I've been thinking that is too large a target but I do have reference records goin back to the 1970s so I still do them. Sometimes I vary the test and count the number of hits I can do in a set ammount of time - say 1 second (I often use 2 seconds for students).
I don't like to mention any numbers because that devolves the thread to an argument of who can do it better - it doesn't matter what others do, it matter what you do with gun A or gun B or even guns C, D and soforth.
I shoot a 4" K frame .357 about the same as a 2" J-frame with .38 handloads (but those handloads launch a 158 gr SWC at over 1000 fps.
I should point out, that this is all sort of a moot point as I can put 8 .45 autos from a 1911 in the same target as quik as I can do 5 .38s or 5 .357s. Again, it is an intensly personal thing - go forth and test!
Riposte
If you already have a model 19, I'd say you're well set. If you find .357 mag. too much you can always use .38 Spl. or + P's in your 19. There's very little difference in weight or size when compared to other K frames.
Good luck with your decision,
Al
Good luck with your decision,
Al
- Joined
- Aug 9, 2005
- Messages
- 9,199
- Reaction score
- 11,412
Shoot what you shoot well; that's the best ammo for you. I'd try several different .38, .38 +P, and .357 and stick with a heavy bullet unless a lighter one is more accurate and/or point of impact vs. point of aim varies significantly. Testing at 25 yards will tell you far more than testing up close because everything, even poor ammo, is accurate up close. You can always try the loads up close after the 25 yard work.
Avoid YouTube; your own work will provide you with far more vital information.
Avoid YouTube; your own work will provide you with far more vital information.
Eddie Southgate
Member
I would stick to a good .38 Special myself since it's going to be smaller and easier to carry everyday , all day and has sufficient power to get me out of any trouble I find myself in as long as I do my part. I actually carry a hot loaded m32 .38 S&W as often as not and don't feel under gunned.
olympicmotors
Member
- Joined
- Mar 10, 2014
- Messages
- 92
- Reaction score
- 46
I am going to disagree with most of the replies on this thread, along with the general prevailing opinion these days. I carry 357 magnums in my K6s. They are Speer Gold Dot short barrel, which I have always considered them to be " sort of " 357 minus p . However I practice pretty often and understand they might not be quite as quick to get back on target.
